War on Brats

Reba said:
When my daughter was little, or when we took our grandsons out, I always made sure that I carried a small "surprise" toy or book for each of them, and a small snack food. Then, if they became bored or restless, I would pull the "surprise" out of my bag and entertain them with it. They were just cheap toys or books (sometimes freebies that I got from fast food restaurants) but to the kids they were something "new" so they were interested.

When I was a kid, my parents always took us to full-service restaurants, never fast food. Two reasons: 1. there weren't any fast food restaurants back then, and 2. my dad always wanted service. He didn't even like to go to buffets or salad bars. (If the restaurant had a salad bar included with the dinner, my dad insisted that the waiter get the salad for him!) Anyway, my brother and I learned real quick how to behave in a formal restaurant. It was no big deal. We knew how to use our napkins properly, which utensils to use, how to open a lobster, what a Roquefort dressing was, etc.

I was a teenager the first time I went to a McDonald's!

Kids need to learn the difference between fast food kid places and fine dining. Fast food places are for play and noise; fine dining is for sitting and polite conversation. Yes, conversation. I don't believe children should be taken to a nice restaurant and be told to just shut up and sit still. They should be included in intelligent adult conversation. That is how they learn to behave in a civilized way. :)
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I disagree.. "SHUT UP AND SIT DOWN" geez.. so called "Parent are total rude remarks".

Simple..
If you take your child and visit formal resturant..
First of all, You have to talk your child before go formal resturant..
Politely ask your child, Can you be quiet if as you can.... (silent wait til child respond), If your child say, Yes Mommy or Daddy, I will try be quiet and want to play something. You can respond your child, Yes you may bring one toy (not too loud toy) likely Hot wheel or Barbie.. while wait for order food...
Would be great.. Or... may have eat cracker (snack) to prevent restless wait for placed order the food.


I do tell my children first.. before enter formal resturant... They respect listen as well.. went into the resturant.. Just tiny noise then stopped.. Luckily we choose right place resturant due order food so quickly within 10 minutes ready.. Delcouisly.. *whew* Glaldy my children aren't way up high nuts.. (chuckles) few wks ago. My children are big now.. but mostly talk loud.. *remind them just low voice please* that's all
 
GalaxyAngel said:
I disagree.. "SHUT UP AND SIT DOWN" geez.. so called "Parent are total rude remarks". ..
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I don't understand what part of my post you disagree with. ??? I said that parents should NOT say "just shut up and sit still."
 
Reba said:
Kids need to learn the difference between fast food kid places and fine dining. Fast food places are for play and noise; fine dining is for sitting and polite conversation. Yes, conversation. I don't believe children should be taken to a nice restaurant and be told to just shut up and sit still. They should be included in intelligent adult conversation. That is how they learn to behave in a civilized way. :)
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I understand your point, but to be honest Reba nobody can be 100 percent perfect, not even adults either. I've seen a group of people (yeah, Adults) at another table were talking loud. Maybe they don't realized they are speaking too loud. :)

The point is how would we know that a child will act badly at a fancy restaurant? Nobody would know how the child would act until it happened. If you get my drift? So, really people cannot say, If I want to go somewhere fancy I won't take my children because they might behaving bad. It's like you have doubts about "your child's behavior". Not all children are "so-call bad kids". There are really good kids who sometimes makes mistakes. And also there are bad kids too. But, who says anyone was perfect? :thumb:

That's what I've been trying to say all through this thread but seems like nobody really understands where I'm coming from. ;)
 
Oh rats so many interstiung points made, and I have to go some place. But I'll be back later :)

Fuzzy
 
Cheri said:
I understand your point, but to be honest Reba nobody can be 100 percent perfect, not even adults either. I've seen a group of people (yeah, Adults) at another table were talking loud. Maybe they don't realized they are speaking too loud. :)
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I know that no one is perfect, especially the adults. It is very annoying when they are yakking on their cell phones in restaurants!

The problem is parents who just ignore their kids' misbehavior or think that it is cute entertainment for everyone in the restaurant. Yes, kids will misbehave but it is the parents' responsibility to solve the problem quickly and quietly. If the child is totally unmanageable (maybe too tired or not feeling well), the parent should request the meal be boxed up as a take out order, and go home.
 
Reba said:
I don't understand what part of my post you disagree with. ??? I said that parents should NOT say "just shut up and sit still."
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Reba.. Did I say disagree YOU????

YOU YOU YOU?? Nope you're dead wrong..

I mentioned disagree w/this word... "I disagree.. "SHUT UP AND SIT DOWN" geez.. so called "Parent are total rude remarks"."

Did i say word "you" ?

I do not like this word "shut up and sit down" doesn't matter whoever said this word.. I would say.. so called "Parent are total rude remarks."

:roll:
 
GalaxyAngel said:
Reba.. Did I say disagree YOU????
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I'm sorry that I misunderstood. Your statement was right below my quoted post, so I thought you were referring to my post. Sorry about that.
 
Well I am back ready to dispense my wisdom :) :mrgreen:



>>I understand your point, but to be honest Reba nobody can be 100 percent perfect, not even adults either.<<

Yes that is true. (To a point). The question however is, what is the parent to do in such situation?
Leaving a kid to continue it's tantrum or looking away when your kid is laying on teh floor blocking the line because "it's a kid's way" is teaching him behaving like that is acceptable and proper way to show his disappoinment or boredom. Well it's really not, especially in public. Depends on what you, the parent do, you'll teach -or not- you kid good manners.

Yes, Someone did compare adults and children by saying:
Quote:
If you have good manners, so does your children.

This is NOt comparing. I do not expect a 5 y old to hold the car's door for his mom.
But I do expect 5 y old know to sit in his designated car space and say 'please' and "thank you".


Are you saying that if a mother doesn't behave the child is most likely act the same as you? that's not true, because I been raise in an abusive home and I don't abuse my kids. I've seen parents who smoke and drink and their children doesn't. So, really it depends on the person.

I feel it is true.
Do not mix two different things - abuse and manners.
Chances are, if your abusive parents ate with their mouth open, you do too even if you didn't became an abuser yourself. ( I am NOT saying YOU do that, it's just an example)
Abuse has nothing to do with it.
Same with smoking and drinking. (well.. there is more to this and requires separate thread)
I did however leave 1% for all those cases that didn't turn out as their parents.

>>Expecting them to sit quietly or concentrate on one thing for a long time is quite unreasonable.<<

Of course it is unreasonable. That is why a good parent with good manners will entertain and care for a child, and will try to do something when crisis arise.
Will not just sit there talking or reading, letting his child to lie down smack in the middle of a line to cash register or scream at the top of their head...
See - it starts with the parents..

BTW if you do watch Supernanny have you ever noticed how it is ALWAYS the parent's fault the way their children behave?

Fuzzy
 
kids

you spent the first 2 years of their life trying to teach them to walk and talk..and the next 16 to sit down and shut up!... i just love that!! :locked:
 
Reba said:
I know that no one is perfect, especially the adults. It is very annoying when they are yakking on their cell phones in restaurants!

The problem is parents who just ignore their kids' misbehavior or think that it is cute entertainment for everyone in the restaurant. Yes, kids will misbehave but it is the parents' responsibility to solve the problem quickly and quietly. If the child is totally unmanageable (maybe too tired or not feeling well), the parent should request the meal be boxed up as a take out order, and go home.
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I agree Reba, No parent should ignore their child's behavior. I believe there are some parents out there do, but there are also other parents out there who tried their best to control the child's behavior. Like for example I remember when my first son was 2 years old we went food shopping, my son wanted a candy bar and I told him no and he threw a temper tantrums by falling on the floor and screaming in the middle of the supermarket. What did I do? I picked him up and we left the supermarket. I told him in the vehicle that I refused to accept that type of behavior when I tell you no it means no! Even my children's doctor warned me about that behavior that's why they are being called "terrible twos" it's most common at the age of 2 to act that way. But, it's up the parents to let it continue or stop. There are some parents out there who let it go on and the child never change his or her behavior development, but on the other hand there are parents out there who would put a stop to the child's behavior and most likely the child will obey.

Audiofuzzy said:
BTW if you do watch Supernanny have you ever noticed how it is ALWAYS the parent's fault the way their children behave?
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That's totally different Fuzzy, Those parents are letting those children take control! That's a big differences between "good" kids who makes alit mistakes Vs the kids on Supernanny. I notice that the parents on Supernanny doesn't use reasonable discipline on their children, They let the children be the "boss"

Audiofuzzy said:
Will not just sit there talking or reading, letting his child to lie down smack in the middle of a line to cash register or scream at the top of their head...
See - it starts with the parents..
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If a child scream at the top of their head, the parent kept on reading or talking and not paying attention, Yes I would say the blame is on the parent for neglect their child.

Audiofuzzy said:
Leaving a kid to continue it's tantrum or looking away when your kid is laying on teh floor blocking the line because "it's a kid's way" is teaching him behaving like that is acceptable and proper way to show his disappoinment or boredom. Well it's really not, especially in public. Depends on what you, the parent do, you'll teach -or not- you kid good manners.
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That has nothing to do with having good manners, If a parent let a child to continue it's tantrum that shown neglecting on parent part. That is different between good manners and being a parent. It's a parent duty to pay attention to their kids, and knowing what their kids are doing and put a stop right there, not having it to go on.
 
Let's not only blame it on the children's behavior or if they're being loud cause Adults do the same thing, how do I know? Everytime I go to a nice resturant with my family, they never understand what I'm saying when I talked because I talk real low and not loud enough for them to hear me, there are times they had to tell me to speak louder and also told me that the people here are talking loud and laughing out too loud, it is hard for them to hear me if I talk to quietly....

So instead of only blaming on the children for being loud, it should go both ways....

Children looks up, and they learn by others around them, so if adults allow to speak louder and laugh out loud, then why does it bother them so much if a baby cries?....

The bottom line is, no matter where you go, there only a few that may have resturants that are really quiet, but most resturants are loud enough so there's no point of blaming the children only....
 
Cheri said:
That's totally different Fuzzy, Those parents are letting those children take control! That's a big differences between "good" kids who makes alit mistakes Vs the kids on Supernanny. I notice that the parents on Supernanny doesn't use reasonable discipline on their children, They let the children be the "boss"
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Correct, the more the parents allow the child get what he/she wants all the time, and don't discipline them in a hard way when they whine or misbehave, then they're more likely become the " boss " and taking control over anything that comes in their way...

And for that, it means the parents are to be blame for not taking care of the problem in the first place...but this doesn't apply to all children where their parents do take control over the situation....
 
Originally Posted by Audiofuzzy
BTW if you do watch Supernanny have you ever noticed how it is ALWAYS the parent's fault the way their children behave?
That's totally different Fuzzy, Those parents are letting those children take control!

butbutbut BUT...

Cheri you keep missing my point.

My point is- children mirror their parents.
You see these parents have a problmes with their kids because these parents are themselves behaving unaprioprately.
for example, a husband calls his wife stupid, lazy, worthless in front of his children, and they are doing the same to themselves AND to their parents,
especially Mom!

Or some parents put up with their children whining or refusing to obey their orders because they feel "it's the way the kids are". They say "sit" but then they do nothing when the kid runs away. yet another, the father is NOT participating in raising kids leaving everything to exhausted and busy Mom while the kids are destroying evreything in sight including themselves.

notice how most of the times the first thing the Nanny teaches them (kids) is to talk politely, ask if they want something, like "may I, please, thank you etc". (But did you pay attention how the parents are speaking to thier kids? did once somebody asked - where's my Thank you? almost never!!)
And the parents too are taught to be consistent, agree on ways to discipline, and always but always there is a schedule for them (parents) to follow. They never had any of their own!

You see these parents do not let their children to run the show, these parents are like that themselves- chaotic, clueless and often not good mannered.

The same is with the misbehaving kids in the public places. You can tell when the kids is just having a bad moment, and when they are just smack unruly because their parents lack good manners themselves.

You said yourself:
Like for example I remember when my first son was 2 years old we went food shopping, my son wanted a candy bar and I told him no and he threw a temper tantrums by falling on the floor and screaming in the middle of the supermarket. What did I do? I picked him up and we left the supermarket. I told him in the vehicle that I refused to accept that type of behavior when I tell you no it means no!

That's what should be done! and you did it! you respected other pple who were forced to listen to your kids, and you taught your child this is NOt the way to behave. Your kid will follow in your steps.

It's different form these parents who ignore their kids bad behaviour, and I believe the cafe owners were too able to distinguish between a good child with bad moment and a bad-mannered child, along with no better mannered parents..

Fuzzy
 
Reba said:
Our local Piggly Wiggly supermarket has a kids' "theater" in the store, set up with comfortable seating and a large-screen TV where they show kiddie movies. Also, they have kid-size shopping carts for the kids to use, to keep them busy, or large carts shaped like cars for the bigger kids to ride in (if they feel to "big" for the baby seats), or double size carts for two kids to ride in. I think some stores are trying to be more "kid-friendly".
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A Piggly Wiggly??!!?? Oh my gosh, Reba; I grew up in the Midwest and we had those stores but they disapppeared, I think, in the late 50's to early 60's. Thanks for that bit of nostalgia! Does the store-front have a huge pink, cartoony head of a pig still?
 
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Liebling:-))) said:
But what if their children throw foods, drink or spoon to other table where you and your children are sitting?
If the children tripped to get waitress fall with full of hot tray on you and your children?

What would you say?
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Here is my answer about "judgement" what someone mentioned in previous post.

Yes, I would judge a parent to watch her/his children next time because I don´t like what his/her children throw foods, drink or spoon on our table or let waitress fall with full of hot foods and drink tray on us. Yes, I judge the parents, not waitress, owner and children for neglect his/her supersivon.
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Cheri said:
Yes, Someone did compare adults and children by saying:

Which I disagee, Are you saying that if a mother doesn't behave the child is most likely act the same as you? that's not true, because I been raise in an abusive home and I don't abuse my kids. I've seen parents who smoke and drink and their children doesn't. So, really it depends on the person. ;)
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Yes, I can understand where you come from and know that you and I raised in an abusive home and didnt abuse our kids. I know you and I are good mothers.

But but but here is nothing do with abusive but teach the children how to behave. It´s difference.

I remember one of many examples.
I spend abroading school for years and came home 3 times a year is Easter, Summer and Christmas holiday. I learn a lot how behave manner at school than home.
I never never never forget how my parents and one year young sister laughed at me when they saw me saying "thank you" after get the dinner from my mom. They all said to me with grin: "Don´t need to say thank because we are your family". I was like :eek: and told my mom that what my teacher said that it´s manner to say thank you to parents, siblings or anyone... Their answer to me: "Your teacher is wrong". I feel pain and embarrassment. That´s how my parents taught us like this... I feel uncomfortable and rather want to say "thank you" or "May I have cookies please" because it´s my bad habit since I spent abroading school for a long time. They kept on laugh at me until one day, we visited Grandparents. Granny was weep with happy to hear the word "thank you" from me when I get money from her. My mom feel sort of embarrassment and said to me front of Granny, Again, she´s your Granny, you don´t need to say thank you". It make Granny angry and told my mom off then hug me and said "I am proud of you for say thank you... please do that again... I love it". That´s what I realized that I dont want to learn anything from my parents after got the word from my Granny that my teachers are right. I would turn into bad behavior like my family if I didn´t learn how to behavor in manner way by school.

My Dad said NOTHING and respect when he saw my children say "thank you", "please" to him because he know my way like this. He always said to me, "I am really proud to have a daughter like you - I really don´t understand why your siblings can´t be like you". I said NOTHING and :hug: back to him.

That´s what I mean is abusive and teach children to behave in manner way is not the same thing.


My parents beleive to receive the gifts from anyone is saying "thank you", no at resturant or whatever because they paid meal... why should we say thank them because we paid our meal... It´s their opinion. Thank God, that I didn´t learn from them but school... I still say "thank you" the waitress for serve the meal to us.... If I ask for bill, then I alway said "bill please".
 
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Reba said:
Kids need to learn the difference between fast food kid places and fine dining. Fast food places are for play and noise; fine dining is for sitting and polite conversation. Yes, conversation. I don't believe children should be taken to a nice restaurant and be told to just shut up and sit still. They should be included in intelligent adult conversation. That is how they learn to behave in a civilized way. :)
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:werd:

We celebrated my hubby´s 50th birthday at posh resturant at New Year Eve last year. We don´t want to see my children getting boring so we got an idea to get my good friend´s 2 sons who befriend with my children. 4 of them sat all the day and enjoyed themselves to make communicate, play with game boy, too. (we have buffett, that guests can walk to pick whatever they like...) My children chatted with guests because they know them.
 
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Cheri said:
The point is how would we know that a child will act badly at a fancy restaurant? Nobody would know how the child would act until it happened. If you get my drift? So, really people cannot say, If I want to go somewhere fancy I won't take my children because they might behaving bad. It's like you have doubts about "your child's behavior". Not all children are "so-call bad kids". There are really good kids who sometimes makes mistakes. And also there are bad kids too. But, who says anyone was perfect? :thumb:
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:werd:

That´s why I would not "doubt" my children´s behavior when we went to fancy (posh) resturant because I want my children know that we trust their knowledge how difference between fancy or fast food resturant. We went to Italian, Greek and German resturants mostly than fast food service (very rare). My children know the difference between fancy and fast food resturants.


I find okay when I want to be alone with my hubby for break to get away from our children for once to fancy resturant.

Reba
The problem is parents who just ignore their kids' misbehavior or think that it is cute entertainment for everyone in the restaurant. Yes, kids will misbehave but it is the parents' responsibility to solve the problem quickly and quietly. If the child is totally unmanageable (maybe too tired or not feeling well), the parent should request the meal be boxed up as a take out order, and go home.
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Exactly, that´s what we (parents) for is our responsible to do SOMETHING to calm our children now.
 
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