School for the Deaf denies deaf child with Down Syndrome placement

Status
Not open for further replies.
jillo, do you think this might be one of those cases where the parent has a hard time accepting that their kid may need more intense MH special ed educational services?
Sort of like what happens with mainstreamed/oral deaf kids.....you know the parents who insist that their kid will be in mainstream classes or not learn ASL?
It does seem like there are a certain subset of parents of MH kids who scream and holler at the very SUGGESTION that their kid needs more then the mainstream or their kid needs more intense specialized programming. I know of a lady who when you suggest things like specialized classes (ie MH, dhh and b/lv) she starts yammering on and on that it's "segregated"
Not all parents of kids with disabilties do this, thank god. But it does seem like there are a lot of parents who are so afraid of specialized placement,(and thus admitting that their kids is DIFFERENT) that they demonize it or won't even try it as an option.
Every kid is different for crying out loud!
 
deafdyke said:
jillo, do you think this might be one of those cases where the parent has a hard time accepting that their kid may need more intense MH special ed educational services?
Sort of like what happens with mainstreamed/oral deaf kids.....you know the parents who insist that their kid will be in mainstream classes or not learn ASL?
It does seem like there are a certain subset of parents of MH kids who scream and holler at the very SUGGESTION that their kid needs more then the mainstream or their kid needs more intense specialized programming. I know of a lady who when you suggest things like specialized classes (ie MH, dhh and b/lv) she starts yammering on and on that it's "segregated"
Not all parents of kids with disabilties do this, thank god. But it does seem like there are a lot of parents who are so afraid of specialized placement,(and thus admitting that their kids is DIFFERENT) that they demonize it or won't even try it as an option.
Every kid is different for crying out loud!
Click to expand...

I don't know if the parents of this child have a problem with that or not. The OP isn't even related to the child according to her. I think it is more a case of someone not understanding all of the implications and jumping into something trying to be a savior and creating a mess.
 
jillio said:
And, we all need to keep in mind, before this child enters into the home school district to have an IEP drawn up to guide placement, comprehensive evaluation must be performed to determine eligibility for services. That evaluation is repeated every 3 years by law. So to maintain that this child was not properly evaluated is subject to skepticism.

Regarding the deaf school's observation of student: they have all of the information from the comprehensive evaluation prior to doing an observation. The purpose of the observation is to see how the information on paper plays out in the way the child actually functions in the environment at the school.

I have no doubt that this child, if said child even exists, was properly evaluated by both the home school district and the deaf school.
Click to expand...

We can only speculate with the limited information that was given to us. :dunno:
 
deafdyke said:
jillo, do you think this might be one of those cases where the parent has a hard time accepting that their kid may need more intense MH special ed educational services?
Sort of like what happens with mainstreamed/oral deaf kids.....you know the parents who insist that their kid will be in mainstream classes or not learn ASL?
It does seem like there are a certain subset of parents of MH kids who scream and holler at the very SUGGESTION that their kid needs more then the mainstream or their kid needs more intense specialized programming. I know of a lady who when you suggest things like specialized classes (ie MH, dhh and b/lv) she starts yammering on and on that it's "segregated"
Not all parents of kids with disabilties do this, thank god. But it does seem like there are a lot of parents who are so afraid of specialized placement,(and thus admitting that their kids is DIFFERENT) that they demonize it or won't even try it as an option.
Every kid is different for crying out loud!
Click to expand...


It is hard to say because none of us are there and we dont have alllll the information. Like I have said before, it feels like a guessing game with half-assed opinions from us which ended up pissing the OP off even more. Which was why, I bowed out from being able to help.
 
shel90 said:
We can only speculate with the limited information that was given to us. :dunno:
Click to expand...

Yeppers. Don't know why some things are such a big secret.

I am basing my opinion on the evals that I have experience with.
 
We can only speculate with the limited information that was given to us
Click to expand...
Exactly! It's too hard to say since we don't have all the information and we certainly do not know how well the child can function mentally.
However, I would assume that the California Schools are very experianced, both with evalution and educating students with mild mental issues. It's also a fact that when you get into the more severe mental disabilty, it is VERY challenging to educate them.
Putting a kid with a severe mental disabilty in a mild special needs program would be like putting a kid with severe autism in with kids who may just have social emotional delays or Asperger's.
 
If I was so interested in bashing deaf schools, I would have called it out by name in one of the earlier posts. I have no interest in bashing deaf schools, as they provide something very specific that isn't available in the mainstream setting.

I was however, trying to share this situation with others as it brings up something that needs to be addressed. This child was discriminated against, and that is not okay. If it is a large school for children who are deaf, they cannot deny a student based on a secondary disability. I'm not saying throw severely cognitively impaired children in a general Ed setting. There needs to be more classes available for students with other disabilities along with deafness.

The fact is, at this school there is a class for children who are multihandicapped. I think the biggest issue for the school was that the specific class available was full. Even if that's the case, they didn't
follow proper protocol to determine admission or denial. They cut off a whole chunk of the application
process.


Now, if you want to believe that there is no way the school did anything wrong that's your right. However the family, and staff at the school got a very clear impression that they made their determination before the observation process began.


This mother fully accepts her child for who she is, so this isn't a case of a mom not wanting her child to be "different.". She wants her child to have meaningful access to language, both socially and academically.

I stated this before, but I'll state it again. The entire IEP team believes the school for the deaf is the
LRE for her. After looking at other placement options, the IEP team including the school district believe
it's the most appropriate for her. That is based on knowing the child, observing her in daily life, and
assessments. I doubt the entire team is interested in being a savior for this child. In fact, for most of
them it's their job. So, I'd say they are pretty clear on what her needs are.



I was brought in as a "volunteer sort of mentor or something" and I'm doing everything I can to help this family. I've already made somewhat of a difference for them, and I'll continue partnering with them to help their child get a FAPE. I've also not made a mess of anything, I've helped make progress to the ultimate goal.

What I have a problem with is the fact that they closed the door in her face, 2 times. I have a problem with the fact that there seems to be discriminatory practices going on at a state funded school. That, I do have a problem with. If it goes to federal court, it will be against the school. When and if that time comes, I'll be happy to post the information here.





I also hav
 
Last edited:
Could you elaborate on some of the acronyms? I wasn't familiar with most of them, only IEP. I know IEP because I had those myself. Thanks!!
 
"LRE" = Least Restrictive Environment

"FAPE"= Free and Appropriate Public Eduation

"IEP" = Individualized Education Program
 
Cool. I did not know the LRE or FAPE. The IEP was all too familiar to me :) Thanks, dogmom.
 
I'm not saying throw severely cognitively impaired children in a general Ed setting. There needs to be more classes available for students with other disabilities along with deafness.

The fact is, at this school there is a class for children who are multihandicapped. I think the biggest issue for the school was that the specific class available was full. Even if that's the case, they didn't
follow proper protocol to determine admission or denial. They cut off a whole chunk of the application
process.
Click to expand...
You know......It IS very possible that this is actually about staffing levels. Deaf multihandicapped kids do require more intense staffing (by law) then do just dhh kids.....and a special needs Deaf aide would need a lot of training....maybe it's due to severe budget cuts. Again, no easy answers.....
 
There is always two sides to every story. Like some of us said before, appeal. That's the only answer we can give if the school is discriminating against this child. Other than that, I dont know what else to say.
 
She wants her child to have meaningful access to language, both socially and academically.

I stated this before, but I'll state it again. The entire IEP team believes the school for the deaf is the
LRE for her. After looking at other placement options, the IEP team including the school district believe
it's the most appropriate for her. That is based on knowing the child, observing her in daily life, and
assessments. I doubt the entire team is interested in being a savior for this child. In fact, for most of
them it's their job. So, I'd say they are pretty clear on what her needs are.
Click to expand...
Well, you know it is possible that she could really thrive with ASL if she's only moderately mentally affected. It can be very hard to tell how much benifit a mentally disabled kid can get from ASL.
And jillo, the entire IEP team saying that the School for the Deaf is the LRE, even after looking at other placement options, does say something.......you yourself must know how hard it is for an IEP team to agree on somethign like that!
 
deafdyke said:
Exactly! It's too hard to say since we don't have all the information and we certainly do not know how well the child can function mentally.
However, I would assume that the California Schools are very experianced, both with evalution and educating students with mild mental issues. It's also a fact that when you get into the more severe mental disabilty, it is VERY challenging to educate them.
Putting a kid with a severe mental disabilty in a mild special needs program would be like putting a kid with severe autism in with kids who may just have social emotional delays or Asperger's.
Click to expand...

Not only do we not know how well the child functions mentally, we don't know how she functions socially. That is an important variable in placement, as well.
 
CSign said:
If I was so interested in bashing deaf schools, I would have called it out by name in one of the earlier posts. I have no interest in bashing deaf schools, as they provide something very specific that isn't available in the mainstream setting.

I was however, trying to share this situation with others as it brings up something that needs to be addressed. This child was discriminated against, and that is not okay. If it is a large school for children who are deaf, they cannot deny a student based on a secondary disability. I'm not saying throw severely cognitively impaired children in a general Ed setting. There needs to be more classes available for students with other disabilities along with deafness.

The fact is, at this school there is a class for children who are multihandicapped. I think the biggest issue for the school was that the specific class available was full. Even if that's the case, they didn't
follow proper protocol to determine admission or denial. They cut off a whole chunk of the application
process.


Now, if you want to believe that there is no way the school did anything wrong that's your right. However the family, and staff at the school got a very clear impression that they made their determination before the observation process began.


This mother fully accepts her child for who she is, so this isn't a case of a mom not wanting her child to be "different.". She wants her child to have meaningful access to language, both socially and academically.

I stated this before, but I'll state it again. The entire IEP team believes the school for the deaf is the
LRE for her. After looking at other placement options, the IEP team including the school district believe
it's the most appropriate for her. That is based on knowing the child, observing her in daily life, and
assessments. I doubt the entire team is interested in being a savior for this child. In fact, for most of
them it's their job. So, I'd say they are pretty clear on what her needs are.



I was brought in as a "volunteer sort of mentor or something" and I'm doing everything I can to help this family. I've already made somewhat of a difference for them, and I'll continue partnering with them to help their child get a FAPE. I've also not made a mess of anything, I've helped make progress to the ultimate goal.

What I have a problem with is the fact that they closed the door in her face, 2 times. I have a problem with the fact that there seems to be discriminatory practices going on at a state funded school. That, I do have a problem with. If it goes to federal court, it will be against the school. When and if that time comes, I'll be happy to post the information here.




I also hav
Click to expand...

No, you claim the child was discriminated against. There has been no finding of that to date. Big difference.

Volunteer mentors need to stick to mentoring and leave the educational placement and the law to those that are educated, trained, and experienced. Too many volunteer mentors think they know more about the process than they really do, and in their ignorance, simply create additional problems.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top