Oral school

[Lighthouse77]

For a while, I confused oral school with mainstream school. I can't say whether I'm for or against oral schools because I personally don't have experience with any, except for Clarke School. And it seemed pretty bad to me. (Sorry to those who did go to Clarke). Of course, the experience of one oral school does not describe the others. However, I'd be more concerned about the quality of a school than the method of the school.....

I don't think it really matter.. If the school is not teaching your sign language or don't us sign language, then it is oral.

 

[faire_jour]

I don't think it really matter.. If the school is not teaching your sign language or don't us sign language, then it is oral.

It's like the difference between the Auditory Oral and Auditory Verbal approaches. There are differences, but you have to know them both well to know the difference.

 

[deafskeptic]

For some reason I don't like the word, "Oral School".

It conjures up in my mind--oral sex.

LOL! I always wonder if the hearing will have that in their minds when I mention oral schools.

 

[MomToDeafChild]

LOL! I always wonder if the hearing will have that in their minds when I mention oral schools.

Well, now I do, lol...

 

[Buffalo]

my mistake, I read your post wrong.

I experienced similar lonelyness. I was hoh and mainstreamed. I never quite fit in.

I question whether the education benefits is worth the social experience.

That is why I rather see that the deaf schools (either BI-BI or pure ASL) improve their education curriculum. I am tired of seeing the deaf education being dumbed down. I believe it was dumbed down along with oralism since the kids can't understand everything that was being said orally and remain there even though ASL is accepted back.

 

[shel90]

That is why I rather see that the deaf schools (either BI-BI or pure ASL) improve their education curriculum. I am tired of seeing the deaf education being dumbed down. I believe it was dumbed down along with oralism since the kids can't understand everything that was being said orally and remain there even though ASL is accepted back.

In all the deaf schools I have worked, interned, or volunteered at , all of them use the public school curriculm. The problem is that a majority of the kids come to the schools so delayed or dont have a strong language foundation. If they dont understand the concepts of numbers by the age of 6 or 7, then they arent ready to add or subtract. Have to have a strong foundation of everything first or they will end up with gaps in their education making things worse later. That's why I am very very against of trying different approach to see which one works for each child during their language formative years. We end up with these problems.

 

[Buffalo]

In all the deaf schools I have worked, interned, or volunteered at , all of them use the public school curriculm. The problem is that a majority of the kids come to the schools so delayed or dont have a strong language foundation. If they dont understand the concepts of numbers by the age of 6 or 7, then they arent ready to add or subtract. Have to have a strong foundation of everything first or they will end up with gaps in their education making things worse later. That's why I am very very against of trying different approach to see which one works for each child during their language formative years. We end up with these problems.

They may be on the public curriculm now. Maybe I am thinking about my own education in 60's and 70's. Still I am getting the impression that the deaf people are still abit behind in deaf schools. Yeah, it could have to do with lack of communication in their early years. I just don't like to see deaf kids with text books that are for those in few grades behind as it happened to me in the past.

 

[shel90]

They may be on the public curriculm now. Maybe I am thinking about my own education in 60's and 70's. Still I am getting the impression that the deaf people are still abit behind in deaf schools. Yeah, it could have to do with lack of communication in their early years. I just don't like to see deaf kids with text books that are for those in few grades behind as it happened to me in the past.

I am using 4th grade textbooks for all subject areas except for language arts with my 4th graders. The language arts curriculm is designed for hearing children so we modify to meet each child's needs since English is their 2nd language. If one wonders why deaf children are behind at deaf schools, then the view of deaf schools as "dumping grounds" need to stop. It is like the idea that if mainstreamed or oral programs dont work, then send the kid to the deaf schools as a last resort. It wont work successfully due to several years lost on learning.

 

[Daredevel7]

I am using 4th grade textbooks for all subject areas except for language arts with my 4th graders. The language arts curriculm is designed for hearing children so we modify to meet each child's needs since English is their 2nd language. If one wonders why deaf children are behind at deaf schools, then the view of deaf schools as "dumping grounds" need to stop. It is like the idea that if mainstreamed or oral programs dont work, then send the kid to the deaf schools as a last resort. It wont work successfully due to several years lost on learning.

Wouldn't that require a lot of parents to send their deaf kids to the nearest deaf school automatically in order to improve the school itself?

 

[shel90]

Wouldn't that require a lot of parents to send their deaf kids to the nearest deaf school automatically in order to improve the school itself?

No, it would require that all deaf kids have full access to language during their formative years.

The schools arent the problem. I am teaching what hearing kids are being taught but the problem is that we have some students who do not know the concept of their world at the age of 6, 7, 8, or even older. For example, how are they expected to understand elapsed time (a 4th grade math milestone) if they cant tell the time on the clock? I have to constantly go back to the basics with some students who have those gaps before I can teach the advanced concepts. That is the problem..not the schools, themselves.

 

[Buffalo]

I am using 4th grade textbooks for all subject areas except for language arts with my 4th graders. The language arts curriculm is designed for hearing children so we modify to meet each child's needs since English is their 2nd language. If one wonders why deaf children are behind at deaf schools, then the view of deaf schools as "dumping grounds" need to stop. It is like the idea that if mainstreamed or oral programs dont work, then send the kid to the deaf schools as a last resort. It wont work successfully due to several years lost on learning.

The trouble is that parents want to keep their kid near home. Also, parents tend to go with oral method first. The doctors need to know that ASL and BI-BI is the best way to go. How can we go about this to change doctors' mind?

 

[shel90]

The trouble is that parents want to keep their kid near home. Also, parents tend to go with oral method first. The doctors need to know that ASL and BI-BI is the best way to go. How can we go about this to change doctors' mind?

I agree with u..that's why I would like to see BiBi programs being started at the public schools. My friend in California works at a BiBi program at a public school as a high school teacher and from what I gather from her, the deaf kids there are thriving because the hearing kids are able to take ASL classes so it sounds like a supereb program. She did say that at the elementary dept, they have the same issues as the deaf schools do too...have kids start at their program with little or no language. Usually, the kids bloom in everything around the age of 10 to 12 years old and by high school, they are usually caught up.

 

[Daredevel7]

No, it would require that all deaf kids have full access to language during their formative years.

The schools arent the problem. I am teaching what hearing kids are being taught but the problem is that we have some students who do not know the concept of their world at the age of 6, 7, 8, or even older. For example, how are they expected to understand elapsed time (a 4th grade math milestone) if they cant tell the time on the clock? I have to constantly go back to the basics with some students who have those gaps before I can teach the advanced concepts. That is the problem..not the schools, themselves.

Correct. That is what I am saying. You are saying that there are some severly delayed kids and you need to teach them before teaching the advanced concepts to others. I'm assuming those delayed kids are from oral schools since you talk about them a lot. So if those kids from oral schools went to the deaf schools instead in the first place, wouldn't you not have to worry about teaching those who are "behind" and can go forth with the advanced concepts? Thus improving the quality of the education?

 

[shel90]

Correct. That is what I am saying. You are saying that there are some severly delayed kids and you need to teach them before teaching the advanced concepts to others. I'm assuming those delayed kids are from oral schools since you talk about them a lot. So if those kids from oral schools went to the deaf schools instead in the first place, wouldn't you not have to worry about teaching those who are "behind" and can go forth with the advanced concepts? Thus improving the quality of the education?

The quality of education is fine so what do u mean by improving the quality of education?

Based on my experience with working with children from Deaf families, children from hearing families who have been in our program since infants, and children who came from other programs due to falling behind, I would have to say yes, more children wouldnt need to go back several years to establish a strong foundation of all the basics. Then again we would never really know because this problem continues to happen.

 

[shel90]

I better stop because I am going way off topic. So I am done discussing BiBi programs here as this is a thread for oral schools. My apologies.

 

[jazzy]

I voted No. How do I tell my parents when my oral teacher abused me? I could not. How well my English writing skill here on AD? I hope many hearing parents of deaf kids see this and learn something. If this is what they want for their child, go ahead and put their child in oral program and be alike me. Writing in 4th grade level forever and trying to catch up in reading skill. Good luck and also emotionally immature for rest of thier lives. Go ahead and be proud of it.

 

[deafdyke]

I really do think that Deaf programs need to be more openminded and try to attract good speech therapists.
I think the disreprency between quality of speech therapy is simply due to the public-private gap. If public schools had as many resources as the oral deaf schools (which are overwhemingly private) then maybe you'd see improved academic abilty.

 

[darkage]

I voted No. How well my English writing skill here on AD?

That's true.
I was 13. My english writing was level like 1st or 2nd grade level. All time, I ACCEPTED TO LISTEN WHAT MY PARENTS or BROTHER TELL ME TO WORK (clean kitchen, lawn mower, fix bed for my brother). No complain because I did not know how to talk (very lack of communication). No speak out how I feel.

I learned sign langauage when I was 14 years old at deaf school. Learn many things to catch up but still not complete education.

IF, I NEVER LEARN SIGN LANGUAGE. WHAT HAPPEN TO ME AND MY LIFE?

Last time in early 1980's, I heard that my ex-classmate from oral school. They are homeless, jail, whore, mental hospital, etc. Most of my classmates are no success. Only 3 people (include me) have good life. Still not see my ex-classmate for 25 years or more.

 

[shel90]

I really do think that Deaf programs need to be more openminded and try to attract good speech therapists.
I think the disreprency between quality of speech therapy is simply due to the public-private gap. If public schools had as many resources as the oral deaf schools (which are overwhemingly private) then maybe you'd see improved academic abilty.

Need to be more openminded?

Hmm...try to convince the states to allocate for funds for better speech therapists then problem solved!

If only it would be that simple...

 

[deafdyke]

Yeah I know, Shel. Many oral sucesses tend to have access to really good speech therapists, or are products of the oral schools or are products of very hyperinvolved families. And before I get attacked, yes there are some kids who do awesome with "just picking up" speech with their CIs.....however, there have always been kids like that. It doesn't mean that they represent the majority.
For example, I doubt you'd see a lot of oral sucesses who are products of an inner city enviroment, or a poor rural enviroment or whatever deviates from the perfect enviorment of a high acheiver suburb/city enviroment.