4 years old accused of improperly touching teacher

[Maria]

Well, I believe that the schools ( teachers ) are tryin' to destroy or break the families up by not teachin' their children about the natural love such as hugs. Why would I keep seein' a small glimpse inside the situation that the teachers/or schools are tryin' to screw the children up by makin' them more rebellious when they get older ? hmmm... That's somethin' I could see inside - a very small glimpse. That little boy ( in the article ) loses the trust in school, because of what happened to him and I am concerned about how he feels when it comes to his parents to hug ?? A little out of place feelin' ? That small thing could be damaged.

I don't think it is fair for the little boy to experience like this. Such ashamed ! It's perfectly normal that he was raised by his mother's natural affectionate since his birth. Same idea when he was born, his mother hugs/holds him everywhere and that's where he learns that hug from.

 

[Eve]

*ahem*
Seems you're not going protection your child if someone call'n your child is BAD MOLESTION touch their daughter... How can you deal w/your child?

I put the child in counseling to get to the root of the problem. My child’s mental and emotional welfare is my main priority.

Eve, do yourself a favor, will you please grow up I was only giving an example, don't take it personal.

BULLSHIT!

hink it's Eve that always seems to jump to conclusionsI’ve seen some people like her screamed "rape" or "sexual harassment " or "sexual assault", or "sexual molestation".

It doesn’t get any more personal than THAT.

I do not see that we jump quick to the conclusions. I didn´t see total of philosophical illogic that a 4 years old boy had being suspend at school because he hug and touch his face on teacher´s breasts

That’s because we don’t have the full story. We only have what the media chooses to give us.

Well this story is about a boy being accused of hugging a teacher isn't it? Let's just stick with the topic... its not about anybody else but this topic. everyone is entitled to speak of their own opinion instead you come in and say we jumped to the conclusion, well this isn't the first time you've done this. Just stop it and speak whatever you want to say. Just stop using your "I know it all" It isn't all about you, okay? You just basically think everyone in here is really stupid but yourself. so stop it.

The fact of the matter is, I don’t know it all and neither do any of us here. The only one who knows exactly what happened is the teacher and the child, and all we have is the media presenting us with a biased side to the story.
I am merely suggesting that there could be another plausible explanation for the teacher’s reaction to the child’s behavior.

I do not see the news link mentioning the 4 years old boy was molested. Maybe he has seen his parent had sex, or came into watching pornography by his dad or whichever, there's no evidence to support that.

That’s right, we don’t know because we only have one side to the story. And, there are always 3 sides to any story.

 

[Cheri]

Eve,

I wouldn't be bsing you, first of all you the one who kept saying we jump to conclusions when we are agreeing a hug is not an inappropriate touching. So, I made a statement saying this:

I think it's Eve that always seems to jump to conclusions, I've seen some people like her screamed "rape" or "sexual harassment " or "sexual assault", or "sexual molestation"

Pretty much sums up that you're agreeing with the teacher who has a sick-mind would think that the child is doing the inappropriate touching while hugging, when the child isn't doing that, a hug is a hug.

 

[jillio]

I dont think it is the teachers aid having a ditry mind. I would guess that she is a high maintainace girl that is attention starved. She saw the chance to ge ta little attention (at the expense of a kid) and did so. What an idiot. I would bet that she is an embarassment to all of her coworkers.

Agree with you Lilly's dad. The aide could do with some mental health counseling. She definately has issues.

 

[Eve]

first of all you the one who kept saying we jump to conclusions when we are agreeing a hug is not an inappropriate touching.

Oh, don’t get me wrong, I agree that a hug is not an inappropriate form of touching, but what I do not know is whether or not this situation is all about a simple hug or if there is more to the story than the media is telling us. I just can’t imagine a teacher taking a mere hug to such proportions without cause.

I think it's Eve that always seems to jump to conclusions, I've seen some people like her screamed "rape" or "sexual harassment " or "sexual assault", or "sexual molestation"

Like I said, it doesn’t get any more personal than THAT.

A hug is a hug, but we don't know that this was just a "hug".

 

[jillio]

Again, we are jumping to conclusions without knowing the full story. Maybe this child has acted out inappropriately before at school. I know my stepson did at that age. And he had been inappropriately exposed to pornography by his mother. We honestly don't know what this child has been exposed to in his short life. What I do know, is that if he is acting out sexually, it is the school's responsibility to protect other students and staff from his inappropriate behaviors.

Even if theis child had been exposed to pornography inaapropriately, he ccertainly didn't need to be punished. He needs counseling, and the adult that exposed him tothe porn needs punishment. He's 4 years old for heaven's sake. He cannot be held accountable if he is only responding to the bad influence of irresponsible and sick adults.

 

[Eve]

Even if theis child had been exposed to pornography inaapropriately, he ccertainly didn't need to be punished. He needs counseling, and the adult that exposed him tothe porn needs punishment. He's 4 years old for heaven's sake. He cannot be held accountable if he is only responding to the bad influence of irresponsible and sick adults.

If the child has been exposed to inappropriate material, he does need counseling, and it is not the schools who provide that sort of support, that is provided through Child Welfare. Often, Child Welfare will not intervene unless a case has been made, and many times that can not happen unless there is documentation and discipline. The fact that the teacher has called such vast attention to the case, ensures that the child will receive more prompt attention from Child Welfare. Many times, Child Welfare is so bogged down that they don't have time to deal with cases unless it is pushed in their face like situations such as this that have been publicized.
Many parents are in denial about what their children have been exposed to and therefore do not seek appropriate treatment for their children. The world we live in today is far different than in the past. Our children are exposed to so much and many parents don't even attempt to limit the amount of tv their children watch, because it is so much easier to use the electronic babysitter than to actually interact with their own children.
Still, we do not know that this is the case, either.

 

[jillio]

The point is WE DON’T KNOW, so we shouldn’t be jumping to conclusions one way or the other.

Yes, and we don’t know what this child’s experiences were. My experience tells me that without all the information, we are just jumping to conclusions. My experience tells me that there are some 4-year-old predators out there, because that is what they have been groomed to be. They weren’t born monsters, but someone has taken the time and effort to form them into monsters. And believe me, without intervention, these monsters grow up to be bigger monsters. And my experience tells me that CPS generally doesn’t intervene with these monsters until it is too late and maybe just maybe the school didn’t know what else to do to get CPS’s attention to the matter and get this child some help before it is too late and this was a last ditch effort to help the child. But, you know, my experiences could be misleading as well, which is why I would prefer to wait until all the information has been disclosed before forming an opinion on this case, which has no relevance to your experiences or mine.

That’s a bit of a stretch.

A 4 year old child is NOT A PREDATOR. If he is acting out because someone has abused him, HE IS A VICTIM. And there is no evidence that this child has been sexually abused. He simply hugged a teacher's aid and in the process came into contact with her breasts. People making such a big deal about an innocent thing like this is what causes attitudes about sex to be so out of proportion. A four year old child cannot be held accountable in the case of any kind of sexual harrassment because they have no concept of what it is and cannot form intent to do wrong in theis situation.

 

[jillio]

If that 4-year-old has had his own balls hit, he does know that it hurts. And, if a 4-year-old has been sexually molested or exposed to inappropriate pornography, he does have a mindset for sexual deviance.

He knows it hursts but he does not have the capacity to relate it to anything of a sexual nature. He cannot have a mindset for sexual deviance at the age of 4 because he does not understand what sexual behavior is. Even if he had been abused, he would only understand that he was being hurt, not that it was realted to sexual behavior.

 

[jillio]

I agree with u some kids are not sexually innocents at 4. I remember my early childhood with a boy who was 4 at that time and I was not 4 yet. He asked me to show mine and he showed it to me his. He was into it and I hated it. Still hate him for that to this day. I also watched my friend's son growing up, from the age of 2 to 8 , he was touching his mother's breasts ( I would not let my sons to touch mine at beginning age 2). I told her not let him to do her but she lets him. She thought it was cute but now she is so sorry and sad. Her son is 12 and he got expelled from school by touch other girls' breasts. From what the school professors said it is sexual abuse, for him to touch girls. Better for this young boy to learn than be sorry in later life.

That is not a deviant act--it is normal childhood curiosity. And I maight add, if you showed him yours, you were a willing participant as well.

 

[Angel]

Even if theis child had been exposed to pornography inaapropriately, he ccertainly didn't need to be punished. He needs counseling, and the adult that exposed him tothe porn needs punishment. He's 4 years old for heaven's sake. He cannot be held accountable if he is only responding to the bad influence of irresponsible and sick adults.

I totally agree!!!! ...


When my little boy hug me, he sometimes rubs his head on my breasts just to turn his head the other way, young children are short, and of course our breasts are going to be in the child's face... If the child was actually kissing it or sucking them then that would be an inappropriate behavior....


Personally I think this school is the ONE who's jumping to conclusions here, there are other ways to handle this problem....I suppose for now on, I will have to tell my three boys not to hug their teachers anymore.. :shrugs:

 

[Eve]

A 4 year old child is NOT A PREDATOR. If he is acting out because someone has abused him, HE IS A VICTIM.

It is possible, however rare, that some 4-year-olds are predators, as well as victims. It is a vicious cycle.

Even if he had been abused, he would only understand that he was being hurt, not that it was realted to sexual behavior.

You are underestimating the mental abilities of a 4-year-old. He may not relate the act to sexual behavior, but he can certainly relate it to hurt. My 4-year-old will often say "I hate you" to me, because he knows it will hurt my feelings and he is looking for my reaction. He knows he is inflicting pain. This 4-year-old may not appreciate that his behavior was inappropriate, but if this was a repetitive act that the teacher had previously addressed and it was not being remedied, she may have felt it was time to take further action to prevent this from happening to another child. This of course is just a hypothesis, because I still do not know all the issues involved.

 

[jillio]

Yes, he MOLESTED them. Every professional we have taken the children to have admitted that he MOLESTED them. And yes, he attempted penetration and admitted such. So no, I don’t call that merely “curious”. And I really don’t care how my husband feels about me calling a spade a spade. And no, I do not blame the father, because he is not the one who had the children in the same room with him while he was having sex with another individual. That would be their mother who did that. She is where the blame lies. It took 2 court orders and all of our savings and retirement just to get the kids into therapy, because their mother didn’t want her dirty little secrets being revealed. Luckily, my stepson has been in therapy for several years now, and many many dollars out of our pocket (the mother doesn’t pay a penny towards the children’s therapy), and he no longer acts out sexually.
Like I said, you all are so quick to jump to conclusions without ever accepting the possibility of alternate theories.

Please, a 4 year old is not capable biologically and physiologicially of penetration. You sound like you resent the fact that you have had to ovtain therapy for your stepson. That is exactly what he needed, if he had been exposed to what you claim. Once again, and I emphasize this--he was not a perpetrator, nor would any reputable clinician label him a deviant--he was a VICTIM!!!!!

How do you know that is all there was to it? The teacher said there was more to it than just that.

Yes, the teacher did say he touched her improperly. Maybe you should go back and reread the article more closely.

There is a HUGE difference between sexual abuse and playing doctor, and I am sure the school teacher knows the difference as well. Until you have personally experienced the difference, you don’t know how big that difference is.

The child was neither abusing nor playing doctor. He was accused of harrassment. Perhaps you could do with a bit of therapy yopurself Eve. You seem tohave some real issues revolving around your stepson and you are transferring it to other innocent children.

 

[Angel]

A 4 year old child is NOT A PREDATOR. If he is acting out because someone has abused him, HE IS A VICTIM. And there is no evidence that this child has been sexually abused. He simply hugged a teacher's aid and in the process came into contact with her breasts. People making such a big deal about an innocent thing like this is what causes attitudes about sex to be so out of proportion. A four year old child cannot be held accountable in the case of any kind of sexual harrassment because they have no concept of what it is and cannot form intent to do wrong in theis situation

!!!!

 

[Eve]

I suppose for now on, I will have to tell my three boys not to hug their teachers anymore.. :shrugs:
__________________

For the record, I see absolutely nothing wrong with an innocent hug.
However, these days teachers have been accused of so much, that they must now protect themselves, which is sad. There are now trainings on HOW to hug a child (ie from the side or A-frame hug) so that no one will misconstrue a teacher's intentions.

 

[Eve]

The child was neither abusing nor playing doctor. He was accused of harrassment. Perhaps you could do with a bit of therapy yopurself Eve. You seem tohave some real issues revolving around your stepson and you are transferring it to other innocent children.

no, jillio, I am not transferring anything. I am merely pointing out that there are scenarios which reach beyond the text provided to us. I was also a teacher for 9 years and I know that not all children are innocent, which is a true shame.

btw, jillio, what is your profession which allows you so much insight into the workings of a 4-year-old mind?

 

[jillio]

It is possible, however rare, that some 4-year-olds are predators, as well as victims. It is a vicious cycle.
You are underestimating the mental abilities of a 4-year-old. He may not relate the act to sexual behavior, but he can certainly relate it to hurt. My 4-year-old will often say "I hate you" to me, because he knows it will hurt my feelings and he is looking for my reaction. He knows he is inflicting pain. This 4-year-old may not appreciate that his behavior was inappropriate, but if this was a repetitive act that the teacher had previously addressed and it was not being remedied, she may have felt it was time to take further action to prevent this from happening to another child. This of course is just a hypothesis, because I still do not know all the issues involved.

Its not a hypothesis, it an opinion. You do not have enough information to form a hypothesis. I am not underestimating the mental abilites of a 4 year old, but I do have enough of a background in child and adolescent psychology to understand that the cognitive abilties of a four year old are limited because of underdeveloped frontal lobe.

 

[jillio]

And to continue, you just proved my point. He can't relate it to sexual behavior, only to pain. Therefore, he cannot form intent, and cannot be guilty of sexual harrassment.

 

[jillio]

no, jillio, I am not transferring anything. I am merely pointing out that there are scenarios which reach beyond the text provided to us. I was also a teacher for 9 years and I know that not all children are innocent, which is a true shame.

btw, jillio, what is your profession which allows you so much insight into the workings of a 4-year-old mind?

I have a bachelor's degree in psychology and a master's degree in community/agency counseling with a school focus.

 

[Eve]

Its not a hypothesis, it an opinion. You do not have enough information to form a hypothesis.

lol you caught me. you are right, and you also just proved my point, I/we don't have enough information.

I do have enough of a background in child and adolescent psychology to understand that the cognitive abilties of a four year old are limited because of underdeveloped frontal lobe.

This is true, but it is also the responsibility of the schools to ensure the safety of other students and staff. If a 4-year-old brings a gun to school, he is still as dangerous as a 16-year-old with the same weapon.