Start with spoken language or ASL?

[jillio]

Lack of standards as I have mentioned. Since you are not willing to provide specific citings then untill I have the time to find this information I will with all due respect, take your comments as opinion.

I have provided specific citings on numerous occasions in the past. You can take it for whatever you choose to take it.

 

[jillio]

She provided the link to counterpoint a comment you made where you stated that sign language is not part of TC. I provided you a link that said otherwise and now she is providing an additional link that suggests otherwise.

That link is a website. It doesn't support anything, And I never stated that sign language was not a part of TC. Please, if you are going to quote me, make sure that you make certain that you use my exact words.

 

[imdeafsowhat]

That link is a website. It doesn't support anything, And I never stated that sign language was not a part of TC. Please, if you are going to quote me, make sure that you make certain that you use me.

Ok, I will!

 

[Cheri]

Yes, Cheri, SEE is the mode used most often by TC programs. And it is only one of the reasons that TC has not been effective. You have not provided a source, you have provided a website. That is an entirely different thing. Over the years, I have provided numeorus sources. No need to continually repeat myself.

Please, find me a TC program that uses ASL as their mode of instruction.

ASL is not a sign method. It is a language.

I'm sorry I respectfully disagree, ASL is the dominant sign language and is a visual language, not "a language"

I had provide a source about TC, it's advantages/disadvantages in the past, I do not need to repeat myself either. and SEE was not the only reason...

 

[rockdrummer]

You mean, you don't believe jillio's "researched facts", dang. Jillio is gonna beat you up. Hahahaha.

Be brave!

I aint ascared of Jillio. Maybe I am being bad because I need a spanking!

 

[imdeafsowhat]

I aint ascared of Jillio. Maybe I am being bad because I need a spanking!

Kinky.


Cheri just said the opposite of what I said. She said ASL isn't a language. I say it is sign language, but it is a language, just the lowest form of language.

 

[jillio]

I'm sorry I respectfully disagree, ASL is the dominant sign language and is a visual language, not "a language"

I had provide a source about TC, it's advantages/disadvantages in the past, I do not need to repeat myself either.

ASL is a language. And yes, it is also a visual language.

But it is not the language used in a TC program. TC programs are monolingual and based on English only. Therefore, they use an English mode of manual language. If they incorporate a different language as the mode of instruction they become bilingual.

But again, the discussion is on which language should be a deaf child's primary language. Not the differences between TC and bi-bi.

 

[jillio]

I aint ascared of Jillio. Maybe I am being bad because I need a spanking!

Let me get my whip.

 

[imdeafsowhat]

ASL is a language. And yes, it is also a visual language.

But it is not the language used in a TC program. TC programs are monolingual and based on English only. Therefore, they use an English mode of manual language. If they incorporate a different language as the mode of instruction they become bilingual.

But again, the discussion is on which language should be a deaf child's primary language. Not the differences between TC and bi-bi.

Truly, SEE and ASL are the same, but structure and the to be verbs are different, that's all. Both are visuals, physical, and in sign language.

 

[jillio]

Truly, SEE and ASL are the same, but structure and the to be verbs are different, that's all. Both are visuals, physical, and in sign language.

No, they are not the same at all.:roll: Please stop throwing out ridiculous statements simply to create an argument.

 

[Daredevel7]

But again, the discussion is on which language should be a deaf child's primary language. Not the differences between TC and bi-bi.

Thanks for sticking to the subject!

 

[Jiro]

Let me get my whip.

here's better one -

 

[imdeafsowhat]

No, they are not the same at all.:roll: Please stop throwing out ridiculous statements simply to create an argument.

They are in sign language. If you say, that person who knows ASL doesn't know SEE, then clearly, that person is so dumb because THEY BOTH ARE THE SAME. Once you know ASL structures, you can apply SEE to ASL. They become PSE. Pidgin Signed English.

 

[imdeafsowhat]

here's better one -

Sadism style.

 

[rockdrummer]

That link is a website. It doesn't support anything, And I never stated that sign language was not a part of TC. Please, if you are going to quote me, make sure that you make certain that you use my exact words.

I stand corrected. What you said was

the sign language used in TC classrooms is not ASL"

Then you were provided links to sources that suggest otherwise.

 

[rockdrummer]

No, they are not the same at all.:roll: Please stop throwing out ridiculous statements simply to create an argument.

They are both manual means of communication. I think that is what he means. I know from experience that not all of the signs are the same which is frustrating. I don't know why SEE uses a different sign than ASL when there is a sign for the word in ASL. Why create a new sign when one already exists That boggles my mind or there is something I am not understanding.

 

[jillio]

I stand corrected. What you said was Then you were provided links to sources that suggest otherwise.

No, I was provided a webpage from a hospital based site that said ASL may be used. It was not an educational site, nor did it specificaly refer to any TC program. It was an overview of what TC might be intended to give basic information to those who do not know what the term TC means. It did not say that it was used as a language for instruction.

And again, this is a discussion of primary language for a deaf child, not the difference in TC and Bi-Bi.

 

[imdeafsowhat]

They are both manual means of communication. I think that is what he means. I know from experience that not all of the signs are the same which is frustrating. I don't know why SEE uses a different sign than ASL when there is a sign for the word in ASL. Why create a new sign when one already exists That boggles my mind or there is something I am not understanding.

They may be different, but they are so much similar in many ways. Like Airplane in ASL and Fly in SEE. Different signs, but you can understand what is being implied. Beside I think ASL were created by the deaf community and SEE were created by the people who helps the deaf communities.

The oldest language of sign language is Home Sign Language dating back to Injuns and Spanishs.

 

[Cheri]

That's exactly right!, rockdrummer and imdeafsowhat

 

[rockdrummer]

.......No one here has said that a child should not be provided speech therapy. No one has said a child should not be provided with the opportunity to develop oral skills if they are capable of doing so. What I have said, and many others as well, is that you cannot do so at the expense of linguistic exposure in a mode that will allow that child to acquire language on a proper developmental schedule............

Part of my point about deaf kids growing up to hearing parents is exactly that. I believe you are risking the childs ability to aquire language on a proper developmental schedule when fluent ASL is not prevalant in the childs surroundings. The family circle, school, peers etc. The reality is that its difficult enough for some people to aquire a L2 language let alone a manual language. I know this from personal experience. Certianly there are those that will learn faster than others but I contend that you are risking the childs exposure to langauge at a time when they need exposure to language. It's also why some non-signing hearing parents will opt for a CI for their child. Depending on when the child is implanted and if the CI is successful, the child would be exposed to langauge on a proper develepmental schedule.