Some suggestions for Law Enforcement. I could use your help.

[Kaitin]

Im glad that you came to this board to learn! My best girlfriend's husband was a cop but now a detective. She is deaf and he is not. He took up ASL and Deaf Culture to gain understanding.

Learning Deaf Culture will really help you prepare more than just learning how to signs because some of us have different norms.

I have been pulled over a few times and I always get panicky because I am not sure what the police officer is saying - is he saying Dont move or is he saying Get out of the car or what? I am afraid to make a move in case he will misunderstand my actions. Do I open the door or roll down the windows?

Christian: I have the same question. Can you be the Police Answer Man? My parents said that if I am driving and see the police lights, I should slow down and stop at a place with good lighting. Then stop the car, roll down the window, and put both hands on the steering wheel. You said not to reach for pen and paper, and they said this too. What about for your driver's license? My roommate says to get your driver's license out because they want it. But you can't, right? So just sit with the hands on the wheel and say I can't hear them. I'm afraid they won't understand me and so they won't say OK to me getting pen and paper. My speech is better when I am not nervous and I would be nervous with a policeman.

I would like to know what a policeman would say then. I like to know what is said/asked so I have a better chance of understanding when the situation happens. It would be hard when nervous and at night!

Thanks! Hey! You know some ASL, so !.

 

[ASLGAL]

Glad you are interested in ASL and Deaf culture.
We need more in the field.

Keep going, Complete the levels and you will do fine and gain proficiency.

You stated you are almost finished with law enforcement degree and work part time at an SO.
Wisconsin does not require certification before you are a working officer?
Curious, not same in my state - must be certified and degree does not qualify.

 

[OpheliaSpeaks]

I believe that in some states a Deaf driver has a color coded sticker that goes on the visor. If they are pulled over, they flip the visor and the officer knows they are Deaf. They are provided by the DMV. I have also heard of an envelope with information that stays on the dashboard as id for this purpose. NYS doesn't have anything like this. If you're driving your registered vehicle and the officer runs the plate, sometimes it comes up on the computer telling the officer the driver is Deaf or hearing impaired. They neglected to put corrective lenses on my license though and I can't see to save my life without them so there are loopholes unfortunately.

 

[Silentwolfdog]

Why wouldn't deaf driver have sticker to put on license plate? Like some handicapped people do have symbol on license plate.

Sometimes deaf person do not have pen and paper with them. They are still human being, sometimes they forgot to bring or the paper ran out. I always try my best to bring it with me all the time even if it's a pain in neck to do so. Sometimes I just don't have it. I don't see any harm in hoping that hearing people do the same. If they refused, then that's their problem not our. If they accept then great...

It would be nice for polices to have different strategies to deal with deaf people. It's bad enough that we have to guess if cop want to us to open our car window or not. Or to lay on the road or not...and if we misunderstood the cop then we get shot.

 

[andycane]

I've been pulled over a few times in the past for different reasons (such as speeding once, being white in a primary black neighborhood, or my car matches a 'wanted' description). But with each encounter, all the enforcers didn't make any attempt to remove the communication barrier.

Since I read lips, it's a little difficult to read someone's lip when they're shinning their maglock flashlight in your eyes. I've turned on the in-car lamp to illuminate my interiors to compensate for their light, and told them that I'm HOH and need to see thier lips in order to understand what they are saying. But they keep shinning their light directly in my face, and the results usually have them repeat like 5 times everytime they say a sentence. All they had to do....just don't shine the flashlight in my eye as you can divert the light to anything else, just not in my line of vision. I'm not asking to turn off your lights, as you can shine the ground, or the top of the car and we can still see each other. Needless to say, each encounter I feel disrespected, and honestly I can say I lose my respect for law enforcers each as I get the impression that either they lack problem solving skills or simply comes off as an asshat. But someone like you helps restore that their is some hope & good enforcers as you're being proactive in the community instead of reactive. So I wish you all the best in your career.

 

[seki900]

Well because...

What I mean is, Deaf people experience the need for note writing with Hearies very often. Why not be prepared?

I've read many posts here at AD about cashiers who won't provide pens and paper at stores and restaurants, receptionists who won't provide pens and paper, etc. OK, take the hint. Hearing people might not provide you with pens and paper, so you might need to carry those things with you when you go out. Big deal. A very minor inconvenience that might prevent a serious misunderstanding.

The big problem is that in order for it to be used it must be in plain sight. Because by the time that officer one is by your car door, his partner has his gun drawn and trained on you.

I got pulled over in Phx one night because the cars tail lights were out. A simple fix it ticket. Before, when I got pulled over I would get out of the car and lean against it. But the last time that I did that (expired registration) the cop told me it was unwise and that I should remain in the car with my hands on the wheel.

So that was what I did after I pulled over. I was waiting for the officer to approach the car. I was looking in the rear view mirror and I saw that they both officers got out of the car, the one on the passenger side drew his weapon and directed his spot light towards me. The driver was approaching slowly but he didn't draw his weapon just had his hand on it and it was clear to me if I made any movement he would draw his as well.

As it turned out, the reason that they did it was that I didn't respond to their PA system and they had no clue as to what I was up to. When I explained that I was deaf, first he didn't really believe me because I didn't really loose all my hearing till later in life. Then he saw that it was marked on the Drivers Licence and he was wondering why I didn't get the HC plates for my car.

I told him that it seems to me that getting those plates would essentially be a form of advertisment for any predatory member of our species that here was an easy mark.

In any case, If I did have a notepad and pen in my car there would have been no way that I would even think of reaching for it under the circumstances.

 

[Kaitin]

So that was what I did after I pulled over. I was waiting for the officer to approach the car. I was looking in the rear view mirror and I saw that they both officers got out of the car, the one on the passenger side drew his weapon and directed his spot light towards me. The driver was approaching slowly but he didn't draw his weapon just had his hand on it and it was clear to me if I made any movement he would draw his as well.

As it turned out, the reason that they did it was that I didn't respond to their PA system and they had no clue as to what I was up to. When I explained that I was deaf, first he didn't really believe me because I didn't really loose all my hearing till later in life. Then he saw that it was marked on the Drivers Licence and he was wondering why I didn't get the HC plates for my car.

Thats so scary! I am so confused about what to do which is safe and understood by policemen without using guns at all. You weren't shot but how horrible. I understand their caution with unknown people, but a gun on you because you didn't hear? And if you reached for pen and paper, what?

I wish Christian or another police would post and give a opinoin.

 

[seki900]

Thats so scary! I am so confused about what to do which is safe and understood by policemen without using guns at all. You weren't shot but how horrible. I understand their caution with unknown people, but a gun on you because you didn't hear? And if you reached for pen and paper, what?

I wish Christian or another police would post and give a opinoin.

Yes it is scary but what to do? I totally agree that there needs to be a single proven method that keeps the weapons holstered. After watching "COPS" several times I totally get why they need to be safe. But I just wish it wasn't so on the line when the only thing that happen was just a misunderstanding.

It wasn't the first time that I had a weapon drawn on me from a Law enforcement officer. It was just the most recent.

 

[Bergc]

IM BACK! So sorry, Ive been flooded with work the past weeks. Let the questions and comments flow!

*J...Just remember, common sense. Its the right thing to do when you see an accident. It helps us to get to the people quicker to render aid.

*Katin...Good technique. Pull over in a well lit area, keep the hands on the wheel. YOu have no reason to be nervous. Just take a deep breath and remember that not all cops are assholes . Ive been thinking a great deal about what I said earlier about having a pad and pen. I think its a great idea to have a pad, pen, your Drivers license and your proof of insurance/registration fastened to your drivers side visor. This can be done with a strip of velcro found at craft stores, or a cd holder that hooks to your visor (can buy them at Wal*Marts). Yes, holstering means to put the weapon away. There are very stringent guidelines for when an officer may pull their weapon. There are even more stringent guidelines dealing for when they are authorized to use deadly force. Tasers are considered to be less than lethal. These are used more often than a firearm or peperspray. Again, there are rules for when tasers can be used. By rule of thumb is I will deploy the taser if there is an ongoing threat this includes both verbal or non verbal. The ongoing threat is a face to face confrontation where officers read the body language of the individual. If the person keeps advancing using threatening measures or has a weapon, they may be tased. ONce again, you have nothing to worry about.

*Seki900... If been with officers that are comfortable with drivers getting out of the car, and Ive been with officers who are very threatened with the idea. When you work in a profession where danger can come at any angle, it becomes hard to percieve what is a threat or not. With that in mind, officers tend to treat anything out of their comfort zone as a direct threat. My opinion...stay in the car. When someone gets out of the car when Im on traffic stop, I would direct them to get back into the vehicle and I'll be with them in a moment.

*I have mixed feelings about having license plates that tells if the vehicle is operated by a deaf or HoH person. On one hand, it would be nice to know because as an officer, I can tailor by enforcement so we can understand eachother...but on the other hand. It is a tell tale mark. How do you feel about this?

*Lets say that we have a vehicle who is being driven by deaf or HoH person and the car comes back matching a car to an armed robbery. How do you think we could be more effective in situations where we need to use a PA system?

 

[rockdrummer]

I am a hearing father of a profoundly deaf son. I have concerns and I have heard about incidents involving the police and deaf citizens. The concern I have is when the police react to people that aren't following their commands/orders. I understand that is a difficult situation for the police but you have to remember that you might be dealing with a deaf individual. Not all deafies can read lips. All I would say is to consider the fact that you might be dealing with a deaf individual before you take someone down for not complying with orders. Obviously you must do this with great caution. This is something that I personally believe should be part of all police training. Imagine if you are deaf and wallking down the street. An officer of the law is behind you yelling halt and you just go on your merry way (because you can't hear the officer). Then all of the sudden you are tackled from behind, taken down and cuffed. All because you didn't comply with orders that you could not even hear. Get the picture?

 

[Cheri]

Greetings! My name is Christian and I'm from MN. Im getting close to finishing my degree in law enforcement from Minnesota State and work part time as a sheriff's deputy. This semester I took my first ASL class and instantly fell in love with it. I was able to take what I learned my first week and transfer it over to my job. I'm writing a paper for my ASL 1 class and want to focus on Law Enforcement and the Deaf community. I would appreciate any feedback that you could give me on your aspects on law enforcement. Please provide any positive/negative contacts that you've had, things you would want to see changed or any tips that you can give me that I can carry over into my job when I'm working with someone in the deaf community. Again, I appreciate any feedback you can give!
-Berg

First I would like to say Congratulations on taken up ASL, wishes more police officers would take up sign language also, but rarely I seen a police that knows any signs.

I have a couple suggestions regarding how police handle emergency calls, the problem is when you're in a life and dangerous situation, I think time is wasted when they're asking too many questions on the phone when a deaf person is calling through a IP relay service, You know how much time that takes up? When dispatchers are asking so much questions time is being wasted you don't know rather a deaf person is still alive or not u know what I mean? I rather the police to arrive in just in matter of time when a call is placed, like if a deaf person asked for a police and there was a man outside with a weapon, without having the police asking so much questions why can't they rush over instead of sitting by the phone demanding answers like who's this guy, what is he doing there, do u know him? who's in the house with you?

The bottom point I'm trying to make here is that I rather to have the police here as soon as possible to take care of the bad situation first then ask questions later. U get my drift?

 

[Kaitin]

IM BACK! So sorry, Ive been flooded with work the past weeks. Let the questions and comments flow!

Hi, Christian!

*Katin...Good technique. Pull over in a well lit area, keep the hands on the wheel. YOu have no reason to be nervous. Just take a deep breath and remember that not all cops are assholes . Ive been thinking a great deal about what I said earlier about having a pad and pen. I think its a great idea to have a pad, pen, your Drivers license and your proof of insurance/registration fastened to your drivers side visor.

Great idea.

There are very stringent guidelines for when an officer may pull their weapon. There are even more stringent guidelines dealing for when they are authorized to use deadly force. Tasers are considered to be less than lethal. These are used more often than a firearm or peperspray. Again, there are rules for when tasers can be used. By rule of thumb is I will deploy the taser if there is an ongoing threat this includes both verbal or non verbal. The ongoing threat is a face to face confrontation where officers read the body language of the individual. If the person keeps advancing using threatening measures or has a weapon, they may be tased. ONce again, you have nothing to worry about.

I don't think I am a threat to police. But the police point guns at Seki for not responding to PA - correct for the police? Could they use the taser? Or pulling guns like this is not with the guidelines?

My opinion...stay in the car. When someone gets out of the car when Im on traffic stop, I would direct them to get back into the vehicle and I'll be with them in a moment.

Thank you. Good advice (my parents said it also, but a friend said to get out and talk to the police to show you are friendly. He also said cry to police and they won't give a ticket. I won't cry fakely. But maybe for real. ).

I have mixed feelings about having license plates that tells if the vehicle is operated by a deaf or HoH person. On one hand, it would be nice to know because as an officer, I can tailor by enforcement so we can understand eachother...but on the other hand. It is a tell tale mark. How do you feel about this?

*Lets say that we have a vehicle who is being driven by deaf or HoH person and the car comes back matching a car to an armed robbery. How do you think we could be more effective in situations where we need to use a PA system?

I wouldn't want a license plate. I share a car with my hearing sister - plates wouldn't work. And I would feel vulnerable and intimidated - maybe stupid but I drive alone sometimes.

Why would you need to use a PA system? If I see police lights I slow and go to the side. If I thought they wanted me I would stop. Why a PA?

!

 

[Bergc]

Cheri...dispatch asks so many questions because we need to know whats going on. It is essential for us to know who is with you, where you are...etc. It isnt safe for us to just show up without any information. I do agree that relay takes..................a................really.......................long...................time! I was on the phone with a gentleman not to long ago using a relay service. The converstation lasted roughly an hour and I got the amount of information that a face to face interaction would have taken 5 min. I think this is a huge communication barrier that needs to be broken. Would it be a terrible idea for a deaf or HoH person to have an emergency box where they could type information quickly and it would go directly to dispatch? Is something like this already made available? This would save us both valuable time.

Kaitin... you have many many good questions. Without getting too much into firearm guidelines...it may have been standard protocol for them to pull firearms when a person doesnt respond to a PA. The PA system isnt so much used as pulling a person over, as it is used to give commands to a person who is non compliant with exiting the vehicle. Again, this is a barrier that needs to be overcome. As with the never ending stay in the car/get out of the car battle...stay in the car. There are many ways to show someone you are friendly. Being polite is one way. But please, getting out of the car will do nothing but upset officers. instead of having handicap plates (which I agree, would make a person feel vulnerable), would it be out of line to have, say, a colored piece of reflected metal (the size of a quarter) in the upper right hand corner of the license plate? How do people feel with that? <--Still, I feel on the fence about that one. This just helps law enforcement get through the communication barrier.

 

[rockdrummer]

What about situations where the deaf individual is not in a car.

 

[Bergc]

thats the one of the hang ups I have rockdrummer. It would just be an indicator that the operator may be deaf or HoH. THis way, law enforcement can better overcome the communication barrier. I understand that people share cars and it isnt always the case that the operator is deaf or HoH.

 

[pek1]

Greetings! My name is Christian and I'm from MN. Im getting close to finishing my degree in law enforcement from Minnesota State and work part time as a sheriff's deputy. This semester I took my first ASL class and instantly fell in love with it. I was able to take what I learned my first week and transfer it over to my job. I'm writing a paper for my ASL 1 class and want to focus on Law Enforcement and the Deaf community. I would appreciate any feedback that you could give me on your aspects on law enforcement. Please provide any positive/negative contacts that you've had, things you would want to see changed or any tips that you can give me that I can carry over into my job when Im working with someone in the deaf community. Again, I appreciate any feedback you can give!
-Berg

Hey Christian! What campus of MSU are you at? I'm at Moorhead.

 

[pek1]

That is sad that the officer did not have enough common sense of pacience for that matter to help someone communicate. I now carry a notepad in my back pocket and pens just in case an emergency like this should arise. Like I had said before...please, do not reach inside your glove box. Officers are trained that this may be a source of danger. The best to store a pad and pen would be on your sun visor. Make sure they are securley fastened so they do not fall while you are driving. This can be done with a simple velcro strap that can be purchased at a craft store.

Kaitin, I was busy before and didnt have much time to elaborate on my response for you. As we discussed, in the state of MN (and pretty much the rest of the states), fleeing from a peace officer is a felony. To help ease your mind a little more, an officer would not shoot a fleeing person in the back. It would be a different story if you had a knife/gun in your hand and were fleeing from an officer. This would paint a completley different picture. So, you have no reason to worry about being shot whilst minding your own business. So to put this all in context...if an officer did not know that someone was deaf or HoH, and ordered them to stop and they still went on running...it would be standard protocol for them to holster their weapon and try to pursue the subject. Departments have VERY strict policies regarding the use of deadly force. Hope this helps.

J, you pose an excellent question. Many people get this notion from the final episode of Seinfeld where instead of coming to the aid of a victim being "mugged" on the street of a nice little town, they all stand back, videotape it, and laugh to themselves. In the episode, they were charged with breaking the Good Samaritan Law. That is not the case. The Good Samaritan Law are laws enacted by states that protect health profesionals (doctors, nurses, EMT's) from being sued when rendering aide under emergency circumstances. Back to subject tho...if you witness a motor vehicle accident it is common sense/curtosey to call 911 and give the location and details of the "crash". Under MN state law (169.09 sub 3 sub a) basically states that if you are involved in a motor vehicle accident you must render reasonable assistance to any individual injured in the accident. Failure to comply with the following law may result in the revocation of your drivers license.

*Another question: What means are the deaf community provided with in terms of emergency communication? Cell phone/Blackberry usage?

Christian,

What I've done in the past is, if it's dark and am stopped, I have my driver window all the way down, both hands either at the nine and ten o'clock position on steering wheel or hanging outside and have the dome light on. The last time I was stopped at night, the cop blinded me. By all means, I won't be cooperative, as the blinding light is all I see. That occurred in Duluth, Minnesota. Before getting stopped, I saw a vehicle approaching me rather quickly and the weather was just finishing snowing. I did a quick stop at stop sign because I didn't want to get rear-ended by it. If I knew it was a cop directly behind me, I would have stopped all the way and let her (woman cop) hit me.

When asked for driver's license, if I don't already have it out, I tell the cop where it is and that I'm reaching for it. They're fine with that and their tension goes down a little bit, as both of us are nervous. No such thing as a typical traffic stop.

 

[SxyPorkie]

I dont have problems with Police... but couple old classmates got killed by police.. when he yelled HALT... that cop did not know they were deaf... they got shot to death... so most of deaf people are sort of shaky with cops,,,

 

[Kaitin]

Cheri...dispatch asks so many questions because we need to know whats going on. It is essential for us to know who is with you, where you are...etc. It isnt safe for us to just show up without any information. I do agree that relay takes..................a................really.......................long...................time! I was on the phone with a gentleman not to long ago using a relay service. The converstation lasted roughly an hour and I got the amount of information that a face to face interaction would have taken 5 min. I think this is a huge communication barrier that needs to be broken. Would it be a terrible idea for a deaf or HoH person to have an emergency box where they could type information quickly and it would go directly to dispatch? Is something like this already made available? This would save us both valuable time.

Kaitin... you have many many good questions. Without getting too much into firearm guidelines...it may have been standard protocol for them to pull firearms when a person doesnt respond to a PA. The PA system isnt so much used as pulling a person over, as it is used to give commands to a person who is non compliant with exiting the vehicle. Again, this is a barrier that needs to be overcome. As with the never ending stay in the car/get out of the car battle...stay in the car. There are many ways to show someone you are friendly. Being polite is one way. But please, getting out of the car will do nothing but upset officers. instead of having handicap plates (which I agree, would make a person feel vulnerable), would it be out of line to have, say, a colored piece of reflected metal (the size of a quarter) in the upper right hand corner of the license plate? How do people feel with that? <--Still, I feel on the fence about that one. This just helps law enforcement get through the communication barrier.

Thank you, Christian. Good advice. I will stay in the car so the police don't need a PA.

I don't know about reflected metal. I share a car with my sister who is hearing. Would she remove the metal when she drove? Would others learn that the metal means "deaf/HoH"? Why can't the police use the license plate and know that the driver is deaf/HoH? Don't police check the license plate with computers?

Thank you!

 

[Kaitin]

First I would like to say Congratulations on taken up ASL, wishes more police officers would take up sign language also, but rarely I seen a police that knows any signs.

I have a couple suggestions regarding how police handle emergency calls, the problem is when you're in a life and dangerous situation, I think time is wasted when they're asking too many questions on the phone when a deaf person is calling through a IP relay service, You know how much time that takes up? When dispatchers are asking so much questions time is being wasted you don't know rather a deaf person is still alive or not u know what I mean? I rather the police to arrive in just in matter of time when a call is placed, like if a deaf person asked for a police and there was a man outside with a weapon, without having the police asking so much questions why can't they rush over instead of sitting by the phone demanding answers like who's this guy, what is he doing there, do u know him? who's in the house with you?

The bottom point I'm trying to make here is that I rather to have the police here as soon as possible to take care of the bad situation first then ask questions later. U get my drift?

Good point.

My parent's house has a alarm system and panic button. You press the panic button and the alarm company knows. They try to telephone the house. If none answer, the alarm company sends the police. No questions. I would like a panic button in my apartment. And my car now I think.