OK to doubt!

[netrox]

Some of you are skeptical of God or the Bible. I strongly encourage you to think freely. Do NOT fall for "the Bible is 100% true" mentality. If you suspect the Bible has changed through centuries, YOU ARE RIGHT! It's a fact. Cultures and languages are strongly interwhined and when cultures change, languages change. When languages change, cultures change. Many people think their ideas are the same as centuries ago when in fact, they are SO different.

Here's a known fact: the more intelligent you become, the less likely you'll believe in literal interpretation of the Bible. Why? The more you understand science and humanity, the more you are enlightened.

Many Americans don't believe in evolution but virtually all scientists believe in evolution. Belief in evolution indicates you're intelligent (well educated) and belief in creationism indicates your ignorance. There is NO single shred of evidence to support Creationism. Nada. Creationists spend so much time attacking evolution theory while they have NO evidence supporting their Creationism. Evolutionists demand creationist's evidence and they got nothing from them. Creationists are intellectually dishonest.

Several centuries ago, many people believed that the Earth was flat even tho virtually all scientists said the earth was a sphere. Do you see the parallels?

 

[VamPyroX]

Wow, I must be really smart!

 

[The*Empress]

NOAH knew that the Earth was not Flat... He is at the Genesis.

If people back then were so scare to ride the Boat, thinking that the
Earth is flat, then we wouldn't have Noah, we wouldn't have
the fishermen and Jesus....

Plus Jonah and the Whale

Columbus wasn't the first person to ride the boat...

Sheesh!!!!!!

Even ODYSSEY, he has been GONE FOR A LONG LONG LONG LONG TIME,
and this story was written before the Bible.
It talked about him the WORLD TRAVELER, going from one place to another place...
Odyssey went to the North America and the Caribbean.

And other sea adventure story

 

[The*Empress]

Did God Say the Earth is Flat?

Did God Say the Earth is Flat?
This one is kind of funny since the bible NEVER said
the earth is flat, yet it's often claimed that the bible
says it...

It doesn't.

There is not one statement in the bible saying the planet
earth is flat.

None.

The bible does mention the "4 corners of the earth", which
of course refers to the LOCAL land and the four compass
directions you can travel: North, South, East and West, but
this can't be said to imply a flat earth since we still
say the same thing.

And in the New Testament, there is a verse set where Satan
takes Jesus up to a high mountain and shows him all the
nations of the earth in a moment of time... again, it was
the local inhabited land, all the kingdoms around that
local land. Hence, that verse set can't be specifically
read as saying the earth is flat either.

There is also a verse set where in Daniel, there's a high
tree described... in a vision, the LOCAL LAND around it.
This too does NOT say the planet earth is flat.

Then there are verses describing the "ends of the earth"
of which the LOCAL land does in fact end at the sea shore
AND there actually are plate edges or "ends" in the LOCAL
land that collide, see earthquakes and fault lines.

In summary, are no verses in the bible claiming the planet
earth is flat.

God made it all, Jesus died for our sins.

 

[christlovedeaf]

Empress, that's exactly right. Many quoting Bible trying to prove is inaccurate and I say misquoting. Accusing christian teaching of this and that, but in some true, not all. Human search for blaming and brainwashed people which easily fall for what humanist theories. I have seen New Age movements quoting several Bible verses and boy, way out of line. Netrox, it isn't a fact, its matter of opinion. Know it all idnt the point. Its not easy how to point out but getting the wrong idea how we point it out. There is a difference btwn bashing and POV. Like how you said it is more like bashing on christians by timidation comments. ( letting you know the best way I can share with you without you think I'm angry or something which I don't). At first when I read whole thru the Bible, at first seems complicating, the more I read, the more I see and getting the point and whatever the humanist points out, I read it myself to careful not to fal easily. Sadly, many has. Quoting too many verses, so I read it to make it clarify of the passage. Smile.

 

[Kalista]

why did God take my husband away from me and two sons too soon? We haven't change to hug, chat and kiss him. He gone within 50 mins ??

The autospy and doctors did not understand why Andrew died really fast ? Wasn't it mystery because he wasnt in suffer or pain for a long time.

Perplexe me, Why did God punish me for?

Have you seen the movie called, " What Dreams May Come" actor Robin Williams?

I have not seen that movie yet. My husband left the booklet from the Pastor when he passed away. I read the some of story about the heaven. Andrew was prepare to going to the heaven few days before he died.

 

[The*Empress]

why did God take my husband away from me and two sons too soon? We haven't change to hug, chat and kiss him. He gone within 50 mins ??

The autospy and doctors did not understand why Andrew died really fast ? Wasn't it mystery because he wasnt in suffer or pain for a long time.

Perplexe me, Why did God punish me for?

I have not seen that movie yet. My husband left the booklet from the Pastor when he passed away. I read the some of story about the heaven. Andrew was prepare to going to the heaven few days before he died.

People died everyday. I don't know why your husband suddenly died...
I don't think God is punishing you. All it matters is that you're alive
and children are alive, and must move on to the next chapter...
You can do whatever you want...
You can remarried or not, whatever you wanna do... whatever
you have to do to feed your children and help them plan future for
themselves....
It isn't good to figure out why why why why...

 

[christlovedeaf]

why did God take my husband away from me and two sons too soon? We haven't change to hug, chat and kiss him. He gone within 50 mins ??

The autospy and doctors did not understand why Andrew died really fast ? Wasn't it mystery because he wasnt in suffer or pain for a long time.

Perplexe me, Why did God punish me for?

Have you seen the movie called, " What Dreams May Come" actor Robin Williams?

I have not seen that movie yet. My husband left the booklet from the Pastor when he passed away. I read the some of story about the heaven. Andrew was prepare to going to the heaven few days before he died.

My condolence with you. Yes, there is so much in life we don't understand. Good thing, by couseling by godly person. Like Naomi and Ruth, Job, Psalmist and Book of Ecclesiastes. Even facing hartdship in life, even within church how people looking at you and the world. God is the God of all comforts. Amen.

 

[Dark-Half]

Some of you are skeptical of God or the Bible. I strongly encourage you to think freely. Do NOT fall for "the Bible is 100% true" mentality. If you suspect the Bible has changed through centuries, YOU ARE RIGHT! It's a fact. Cultures and languages are strongly interwhined and when cultures change, languages change. When languages change, cultures change. Many people think their ideas are the same as centuries ago when in fact, they are SO different.

Here's a known fact: the more intelligent you become, the less likely you'll believe in literal interpretation of the Bible. Why? The more you understand science and humanity, the more you are enlightened.

Many Americans don't believe in evolution but virtually all scientists believe in evolution. Belief in evolution indicates you're intelligent (well educated) and belief in creationism indicates your ignorance. There is NO single shred of evidence to support Creationism. Nada. Creationists spend so much time attacking evolution theory while they have NO evidence supporting their Creationism. Evolutionists demand creationist's evidence and they got nothing from them. Creationists are intellectually dishonest.

Several centuries ago, many people believed that the Earth was flat even tho virtually all scientists said the earth was a sphere. Do you see the parallels?

Sure it's intelligent, but it's also arrogant to clam such a supreme opinion (about as bad as the people you're speaking against.). A truly intelligent person would be open to all possiblites. It's estabalished that we have yet even began to tap into the cosmos and beyond, we do not understand alot of things still. Until there's 100% solid proof that creationism is a fallacy I think it's better to allow room for the possiblity. It's nice to believe in something. Frankly said omni-potent being could of existed at a point then died off, we may never know.

 

[VamPyroX]

NOAH knew that the Earth was not Flat... He is at the Genesis.

Who said that Noah knew that the earth was not flat? Where does it say in the Bible that the Earth was flat?

If people back then were so scare to ride the Boat, thinking that the Earth is flat, then we wouldn't have Noah, we wouldn't have the fishermen and Jesus....

People had nothing to be scared about if they were only going fishing since they weren't going far. As for Noah, it's not a matter of him being scared... but the matter of trusting God. There are people who trust their gods so strongly that they are willing to do something regardless of their fears. Maybe, Noah really did fear that the Earth was flat... but felt that God wouldn't let any harm come to him and his ark.

Plus Jonah and the Whale

Eh? What does that have to do with the Earth being flat?

Columbus wasn't the first person to ride the boat...

There's no documentation that says that Columbus was the first to ride a boat. The only thing Columbus was famous for was reaching America during the time of growing national imperialism and economic competition. One of the myths is that he was the man who went around the world. Another myth is that he was the first to discover America. Neither are true.

Even ODYSSEY, he has been GONE FOR A LONG LONG LONG LONG TIME, and this story was written before the Bible. It talked about him the WORLD TRAVELER, going from one place to another place... Odyssey went to the North America and the Caribbean.

Who says that the Odyssey is a true story? It's a poem writen by a guy named Homer. It's like the Bible... written by a bunch of different people. That's why translations are not to be taken literally and to be taken figuratively.

 

[Maria]

why did God take my husband away from me and two sons too soon? We haven't change to hug, chat and kiss him. He gone within 50 mins ??

The autospy and doctors did not understand why Andrew died really fast ? Wasn't it mystery because he wasnt in suffer or pain for a long time.

Perplexe me, Why did God punish me for?

Have you seen the movie called, " What Dreams May Come" actor Robin Williams?

I have not seen that movie yet. My husband left the booklet from the Pastor when he passed away. I read the some of story about the heaven. Andrew was prepare to going to the heaven few days before he died.

I am truly sorry, Kalista. It was Andrew that God took him Home, because God is done with him. I know it was too soon and unfair to you, but it doesn't mean that God is punishin' you.

Yes, I've seen that movie before and it was good. In Heaven, everythin' is very lushy - very richness, abundance and tender. It will make people wonder how beautiful God creates things in Heaven. Everythin' is VERY SOFT and RICHNESS. It is Love that shows everywhere in Heaven. I am sure Andrew enjoys it very much and much happier in Heaven. He wants you to be happy for him.

 

[christlovedeaf]

Who said that Noah knew that the earth was not flat? Where does it say in the Bible that the Earth was flat?People had nothing to be scared about if they were only going fishing since they weren't going far. As for Noah, it's not a matter of him being scared... but the matter of trusting God. There are people who trust their gods so strongly that they are willing to do something regardless of their fears. Maybe, Noah really did fear that the Earth was flat... but felt that God wouldn't let any harm come to him and his ark.Eh? What does that have to do with the Earth being flat?There's no documentation that says that Columbus was the first to ride a boat. The only thing Columbus was famous for was reaching America during the time of growing national imperialism and economic competition. One of the myths is that he was the man who went around the world. Another myth is that he was the first to discover America. Neither are true.Who says that the Odyssey is a true story? It's a poem writen by a guy named Homer. It's like the Bible... written by a bunch of different people. That's why translations are not to be taken literally and to be taken figuratively.

We have discussed that on other thread. In Psalmist is one of them and others, I think its on contradiction thread, I'm not sure. In the Bible does mentioned that the earth is round. The word spheres. Yes, I recently studied the group of creationism, and discovered their errors, but make it clear, there are group of christians disagreement of the view of the world, the way of life. This is a problem, whenever come out like creationism, meaning chritians believes it, which is absolutely not true. Whomever bringing the idea brought up the web try to claimed proof of the error of any k8inds toward christians make a quick decision by saying that's why I'm not a christian, its call a quitter or easily giving up. Even tho it is a personal choices each make. It is a good thing when someone brought up the subject and other to point out. Improper way by saying, dang, christians never give up, they been stubborn and ignorant, which is not so. Those, who keep weight the teaching by the Holy Spirit guidance will begin to enlighten and protect from decieved by men either preachers or humanist or evolutions.

 

[Reba]

why did God take my husband away from me and two sons too soon? We haven't change to hug, chat and kiss him. He gone within 50 mins ??

The autospy and doctors did not understand why Andrew died really fast ? Wasn't it mystery because he wasnt in suffer or pain for a long time.

Perplexe me, Why did God punish me for?

I'm so sorry that Andrew died so young, so soon.

Honestly, I don't know the reason. Sometimes we never know. But the closer we get to God, the more we can feel His comfort and stregth.

His absence is very painful for you and your boys. It feels like the worst punishment possible. But God doesn't want to punish you. God wants to comfort and bless you. But it will take time. Wounds of the heart are deep, and sometimes slow to heal. But they can heal.

I continue to pray for you.

 

[Reba]

Some of you are skeptical of God or the Bible. I strongly encourage you to think freely.

People who think freely and do their research can come to the conclusion that the Bible is the inspired Word of God.

Do NOT fall for "the Bible is 100% true" mentality.

If we are alllowed to think freely, isn't "the Bible is 100% true" one of the optional conclusions?

Here's a known fact: the more intelligent you become, the less likely you'll believe in literal interpretation of the Bible.

Known by whom? Where is the documentation?

I know many people with high IQs, who are PhDs, medical doctors, scientists, engineers, computer geeks, CPAs, etc., who fully trust the Word of God. Many were former atheists. I also know many poorly educated people who don't trust the Bible. So? Education and IQ don't have anything to do with whether or not someone believes in the literal interpretation of the Bible. The pride of a good education or a high IQ can prevent someone from humbly examining his own heart.

Why? The more you understand science and humanity, the more you are enlightened.

Really? What about people who "understand science and humanity" and use that knowledge for evil purposes. Is that "enlightened"?

Many Americans don't believe in evolution but virtually all scientists believe in evolution.

No, it just means all evolution scientists believe in evolution, and all creation scientists believe in evolution. It depends on who gets more coverage and support from the mainstream, as to which belief gets promoted.

Belief in evolution indicates you're intelligent (well educated) and belief in creationism indicates your ignorance.

Are you actually encouraging "free thinking" or are you prejudicially grouping people? It seems that you are appealing to people's pride of "smarts" than their desire to think "free".

There is NO single shred of evidence to support Creationism. Nada.

In your opinion.

Creationists spend so much time attacking evolution theory while they have NO evidence supporting their Creationism. Evolutionists demand creationist's evidence and they got nothing from them. Creationists are intellectually dishonest.

They get the evidence but they ignore it.


All through elementary school, junior high, senior high, and college, I was taught from the evolutionary viewpoint. I grew up with National Geographic, humanist philosophy, and a strongly atheistic NASA engineer father. You could hardly say I was influenced by creationists. I did my own reading and research, starting in my late 20's.

My conclusion (condensed): God created the universe in six days, we are not evolved from lower forms, and the Flood of Noah was worldwide.

Several centuries ago, many people believed that the Earth was flat even tho virtually all scientists said the earth was a sphere. Do you see the parallels?

No. Your "facts" are generalizations with no specifics.

"Several centuries ago" what even constituted a "scientist"? How many centuries ago is "several"?

Pop quiz: Is the earth a perfect sphere or an oblate spheriod?

 

[EagleCherokee63]

why did God take my husband away from me and two sons too soon? We haven't change to hug, chat and kiss him. He gone within 50 mins ??

The autospy and doctors did not understand why Andrew died really fast ? Wasn't it mystery because he wasnt in suffer or pain for a long time.

Perplexe me, Why did God punish me for?

Have you seen the movie called, " What Dreams May Come" actor Robin Williams?

I have not seen that movie yet. My husband left the booklet from the Pastor when he passed away. I read the some of story about the heaven. Andrew was prepare to going to the heaven few days before he died.

I understand how do you feel and having a hard time without your husband.
We don't understand everything what is God's plan for your husband go home with the Lord. God did not punishing you because God had a good reason. God knew the best plan for your place. I had a hard time since my dad died in Nov. 4, 1994. He was the best Dad in the whole world! God took my Dad go to Heaven. I was so angry and why did God took my Dad away from me. I went to the counselor. I was feeling with a yoke on my shoulder for 2 years and I have finally accepted to let my Dad go. I would suggest you go get some counseling (it can be professional or any church that help in counseling sessions) to get a help for your emotional healing. I have forgiven to God because when I was angry and I let him go. I did not have a chance to hug or kissing him when he died!!! It was very tough for me. I still do cry about my Dad once in a while even after 12 years!

The counselor told me 5 reasons:

1. Denied
2. Angry
3. Depression
4. Grief
5. Acceptence

 

[netrox]

My conclusion (condensed): God created the universe in six days, we are not evolved from lower forms, and the Flood of Noah was worldwide.

Based on what? The Bible, of course. Evidence pointing to creationism? Nada. It's not an opinion, it's a fact. Creationists have tried and been refuted/exposed by scientists. I've read the Creationism literature and couldn't believe how dishonest they were.

You are NOT evolved from the lower form, you're right. I have.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

The people thought the earth is flat for years before Christopher Columbus came.

Christopher Columbus discovered that the earth is not flat but round.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

why did God take my husband away from me and two sons too soon? We haven't change to hug, chat and kiss him. He gone within 50 mins ??

The autospy and doctors did not understand why Andrew died really fast ? Wasn't it mystery because he wasnt in suffer or pain for a long time.

Perplexe me, Why did God punish me for?

Have you seen the movie called, " What Dreams May Come" actor Robin Williams?

I have not seen that movie yet. My husband left the booklet from the Pastor when he passed away. I read the some of story about the heaven. Andrew was prepare to going to the heaven few days before he died.

I still cannot beleive that your husband is not around anymore. I can understand how you feel and have a hard time to cope without your husband around.

Yes you are not only one who say like this because many people feel the same and wondering why God choose people to die. Nobody understands why their beloved one have go suddenly. I don't think God choose to "punish" you & your family because it has nothing do with God but ourselves. (It's decision of mind & body who wants to carry on alive or not).

 

[web730]

The people thought the earth is flat for years before Christopher Columbus came.

Christopher Columbus discovered that the earth is not flat but round.

Nope, he wasn't the first person to discover that Earth is round.

 

[Reba]

The people thought the earth is flat for years before Christopher Columbus came.

Christopher Columbus discovered that the earth is not flat but round.

Not true. Most people before and during Columbus' time believed the earth was a sphere. Columbus' voyages just proved it in a practical way.

You might want to read this:

The Myth of the Flat Earth

Some points from this link:

"...at the time [of Columbus] everyone knew it was a globe and were arguing about how big it was."

"The myth that Christians in the Middle Ages thought the world was flat was given a massive boost by Andrew Dickson White's weighty tome The Warfare of Science with Theology. This book has become something of a running joke among historians of science and it is dutifully mentioned as a prime example of misinformation in the preface of most modern works on science and religion. The flat Earth is discussed in chapter 2 and one can almost sense White's confusion that hardly any of the sources support his hypothesis that Christians widely believed in it. He finds himself grudgingly admitting that Clement, Origen, Ambrose, Augustine, Isodore, Albertus Magnus and Aquinas all accepted the Earth was a globe - in other words none of the great doctors of the church had considered the matter in doubt. Although an analysis of what White actually says suggests he was aware that the flat Earth was largely a myth, he certainly gives an impression of ignorant Christians suppressing rational knowledge of its real shape."

"Anti-clerical history of science writers have promulgated the myth so that even today, in his book The Discoverers, Daniel Boorstin manages to produce a totally misleading account (although he eventually gets Columbus right). His bias shows badly when he castigates Christians for thinking the world was flat when they did not and then praises the erudition of Chinese geographers who actually did believe it. The myth is so prevalent that the blurb on the back cover of the UK version of Umberto Eco's Serendipities, the editor repeats the myth even though within the book itself, Eco devotes a good deal of attention to debunking it!"

"The doyen of historians of Medieval Science, Edward Grant, covers the issue in his new book, God and Reason in the Middle Ages where he finds all educated people in the Middle Ages were well aware the Earth was a sphere. Perhaps today we can at last dispense with this patronising belief about the Christian Middle Ages."