Octuplets' grandmother faces foreclosure threat

Her number one priority right now should be finding a job. I know the job market sucks right now, but any job is better than no job!

We should give her cleaning supplies and tell her to go door to door cleaning houses or cutting grass or anything. It's better than nothing and does not require prior job experience nor job interviews.
 
Lucia, you did explain it very fantastic. :c)

Dreama and Maria, I'm sorry to say this... I have to agree with Lucia.

I'm so disappoint with that woman did not take a responality (sp). No, she did not. Thankfully, I don't have a job to pay it for her "needy stuff". When I get my job, I do NOT want to pay my tax to hers if the octmom did not take it personally. Well, I will be very disappoint and upset if I have to pay it on everything is belong to hers. I think it's totally uncalled for. :(

Please understand for one moment - the woman had six children, now she has eight new kids, which she have fourteen right now. It sucks awfully when her parents have to deal with all this crappy stuff. I saw tv show, Dr. Paul, she made me so sick... definitely, she also made me so mad. She is an attention whore, simple and clear. I don't know what my family feels about that since they have their jobs... :(

This octmom have NO, I meant, BIG NO common sense.

Sorry, I'm on Lucia's (and others') side for one whole reason.....
 
Jillio, thanks for the post about Duggar spouses. :) Quite interesting link. Jillo, what do you think of that? I'm curious.

EDIT: My opinion on this link... I think give a birth to single child is actually better than give a birth to so many children. That is all I think of. Thoughts? You are free to disagree/agree to that, it might be interesting to know how much different their POVs are. :)
 
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Lucia, you did explain it very fantastic. :c)

Dreama and Maria, I'm sorry to say this... I have to agree with Lucia.

I'm so disappoint with that woman did not take a responality (sp). No, she did not. Thankfully, I don't have a job to pay it for her "needy stuff". When I get my job, I do NOT want to pay my tax to hers if the octmom did not take it personally. Well, I will be very disappoint and upset if I have to pay it on everything is belong to hers. I think it's totally uncalled for. :(

Please understand for one moment - the woman had six children, now she has eight new kids, which she have fourteen right now. It sucks awfully when her parents have to deal with all this crappy stuff. I saw tv show, Dr. Paul, she made me so sick... definitely, she also made me so mad. She is an attention whore, simple and clear. I don't know what my family feels about that since they have their jobs... :(

This octmom have NO, I meant, BIG NO common sense.

Sorry, I'm on Lucia's (and others') side for one whole reason.....

Yep, Nadya is an attention whore, alright. :roll: Now her parents does not get to retire because they to take care of the children that THEY did NOT bring into the world. They were responsible in only having one child, Nadya, because that was all they could afford, and now Nadya is blaming her parents for being an only child and using it as an excuse to have 93874917034987304987534 children for attention and to milk the welfare/public assistance system for all she can get. She is one of the most selfish mothers I have ever heard of and ever seen. I feel very sorry for her parents, and I feel very sorry for all her 14 children. But I do NOT feel sorry for Nadya herself nor for the unethical doctor that provided her with the IVF treatments for all 14 children. I know many people who were an only child, and they never feel the need to have 9837492759137549387 children. They either have one or two, or many times, they even decide not to have ANY, or they just simply adopt instead. They are so much more responsible than Nadya ever has been and ever will be. She does not deserve any positive attention ever. I have absolutely ZERO empathy for her and I have ZERO TOLERANCE for this kind of bullshit. But my heart goes out to all the 14 children, especially the 8 fragile tiny babies who are going to end up with very serious medical problems as a result of Nadya's very irresponsible decisions and actions as well and as a result of her IVF doctor's irresponsible decisions and actions too...they BOTH should be held responsible and accountable for their actions and decisions regarding all 14 children, especially the octuplets.
 
EDIT: My opinion on this link... I think give a birth to single child is actually better than give a birth to so many children. That is all I think of. Thoughts? You are free to disagree/agree to that, it might be interesting to know how much different their POVs are. :)

I agree with you. The Duggars made responsible decisions in that they mostly had single births with a couple sets of twins. That's not as risky as giving birth to 8 babies. Having octuplets is, of course, extremely risky, and everybody in the entire world who is an adult knows that. If they don't know that, that's only because their heads are so far up their asses or their heads are in the ground/sand, or because their name is Nadya Suleman. Like, duh. Common sense. Plus, the Duggars have their own income, health insurance, they make/sew their own clothes, they can provide all their children with food, medical care, clothes, beds to sleep on, a roof over their head, heat, A/C, everything, and they do not elect to have such a ridiculously huge multiple birth. It's impossible to naturally conceive octuplets, anyway, and they do not use IVF at all or any kind of fertility treatments at all, and even if they did, they would most definitely NOT allow the IVF doctor to implant SIX embryos at once in the mother's uterus, since they obviously do have full reasoning abilities to think this through and make appropriate decisions. If they had chosen to use IVF, they most likely would have asked the doctor to limit it to two embryos. I know I would ask mine to limit it to two if I was receiving IVF treatment - of course I know better. Duh. (No, I don't want to have IVF treatment if I don't need it). All their children were conceived naturally, with good ole lovin' and fuckin'. Nadya has nothing to provide to any of her children, and yet she decided to have children, especially so many, and especially such a huge large multiple birth...EIGHT BABIES! She ELECTED to ALLOW the doctor to implant SIX embryos into her uterus. That's a very irresponsible thing to do. Big difference. No, I do not like that the Duggars had so many children over so many years, but I do have to say that they are so much more responsible than Nadya ever will be, and they have better reasoning abilities and the ability to make appropriate medical and financial decisions regarding all their children, and they are not dependent on any kind of public assistance at all except the donations from other people that they never asked for.

The Duggars and Nadya Suleman have very different motives for having such large families, and they did it differently.

The Duggars say that they are doing it because they believed that it was "their blessing from God" and that they were supposed to accept those "blessings" and that they enjoy having so many children. I don't agree with the religious motive, but that's their motive. And they have the means to provide their children with the things they need. They have shown that they have full reasoning abilities and can make appropriate medical and financial decisions regarding themselves and their own children.

Nadya Suleman's motive was to get attention and to milk the public assistance/welfare/disability payment system for all she can get from it from having so many children and from having such a large multiple birth, and she has proved that she CANNOT provide for any of her children in ANY way. She has NO means to do so. Her actions are very irresponsible. She has shown that she has NO reasoning abilities, and NO common sense, and she is NOT functioning with a full brain, and she has shown that she CANNOT make appropriate medical and financial decisions regarding herself and her children at all.

Huge differences, and very different motives.
 
That's a good point.

Do you mean she should have waited for the 6 to grow a bit before getting another baby, or she can have another set of octoplets later on?

I mean that she should have waited for her first 6 children to get a little older to be able to take care of themselves BEFORE she is able to have another set of octoplets. That's IMO.

I think people are being really mean to this woman, but I also think she should have been given councilling NOT help in producing extra babies in her situation.

Yeah, just because of people's different viewpoints/opinions on how a mother should manage things... but, really there's some places a mother can get some help like get some trainin' or education instead of threatenin' on grandmother.
 
NO. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. She clearly does not have the reasoning abilities to make appropriate decisions regarding herself and all her children. She has shown that with the first six children and then allowing the doctor to implant so many embryos into her at one time resulting in OCTUPLETS. So, NO. NO ONE with good reasoning abilities and a fully functioning brain would allow a doctor to implant so many embryos into her uterus, especially when they know all the risks involved. I know I would not want more than 2 embryos implanted into me at one time if I were to receive IVF treatments in the future (which I would pay for, of course, and with good income from a stable job and not from public assistance, and I would much prefer to conceive the babies naturally than go through the fertility treatments anyway and I hope I will never need any kind of fertility treatment anyway). That's because I have enough reasoning abilities to make appropriate decisions.



Too bad. Since the fertility treatments were PAID FOR BY TAXPAYERS and now the TAXPAYERS are now FOOTING ALL THE MEDICAL BILLS for all eight FRAGILE babies, it is now our business. Her antics are going to cost California and perhaps even the entire country millions of dollars in order to care for the babies from birth to age 18, since she clearly cannot support the eight babies financially, in addition to the older six children. Her inappropriate decisions are adding to the huge deficit we have already. This country is in debt already. She has no job, no income, no home or even an apartment of her own, no insurance from a job, etc. She has nothing. She's living with her mother and the mother may lose the house. The state is footing the medical bills for ALL of the eight babies' as well as the older six children's medical bills, as well as the food stamps and WIC possibly being expanded to cover the family of 15, disability payments for the oldest three, and possibly getting disability payments for the eight babies since it is likely they will end up with disabilities or very serious medical problems resulting from a very premature and low weight birth resulting from a very large multiple pregnancy. Her irresponsible behavior and decisions is costing the state of California millions of dollars, starting from the birth of the octuplets until the octuplets turn 18 and possibly even beyond the age of 18 depending on how serious the octuplets' medical problems are going to be over their lifetimes. So we should let her do whatever she wants, allow her to keep popping out more babies for as long as she wants? NO! I don't think so! ENOUGH IS ENOUGH! We have to step in and stop this mayhem. I usually do not have issues with women having large families, but to allow a doctor to implant so many embryos fully knowing the risks? To continue having so many kids even though she clearly knows she has no way of supporting the children financially without public assistance, etc? NO! We are paying for all 14 of her children as well as for herself, so therefore it is our business now. This must stop. She must be stopped.

If this woman had a job, made appropriate medical decisions regarding herself and her children, and did not knowingly allow a doctor to implant so many embyros into her body, and carefully weighted the cons and pros of IVF treatments and the risks of a multiple birth, and was not on any kind of public assistance, and the treatments were paid for by her own insurance through a job or from out of her own pocket, or she had all her children naturally with no fertility treatments but is able to provide for the children financially with no help from public assistance, then it would not be such an issue.

I know families with even 10 kids or more where NONE of the children were conceived through IVF or any kind of fertility treatments, none of the children were from any multiple birth except twins and the rare occasional triplets, and the parents did not intentionally have multiple birth/pregnancy (meaning the multiple births occurred naturally with no IVF or any other treatments) and both parents had good income and had very good health insurance provided through their jobs, and did not depend on ANY public assistance, and the mother did not have health problems of her own to start with that resulted in disability payments like Nadya, and they don't expect to get donations from the public, and they are very thrifty with their money. They also have shown that they can make appropriate medical and financial decisions and have very good reasoning abilities, unlike Nadya. I have no major issues with those families because they are able to provide for the children with no help from the government and have double incomes and good health insurance that are provided through their full time jobs. Nadya had none of that. That's why it is such a huge issue. She made a really huge mistake that she cannot undo. And she clearly has not learned from it. She is not remorseful. She thinks that it was fine to do this. It was not fine and never will be fine. There is NO excuse for this bullshit. It was wrong. She has caused her babies to possibly have medical complications, severe medical problems throughout their lifetimes, and possible disabilities from being such low weight and such prematurity from being from such a large multiple birth. Is it fair for the babies to have severe medical problems that will last them their entire lifetime? If you think it is OK, then your reasoning abilities are clearly not very well developed. I wonder how old you are, since I have read somewhere that people completely finish developing their brains at or around the age of 25, and one of the last areas of the brain that finishes developing is the area where the reasoning abilities lies in. I think Nadya is 33 (I need to go back and review what I have read so far on Nadya) but she clearly does not have full reasoning abilities. Jillio can also correct me if I am wrong.



So? Different situation. She chose to knowingly allow the doctor to implant so many embryos into her body, fully knowing all the risks involved. Then when she found out she was carrying EIGHT fetuses, she actually should have elected to have several of the fetuses aborted. She chose not to. So, she's going to have to accept the public outrage, since she made very inappropriate decisions regarding her body and her babies. Usually I am all for not telling women what to do with her body, but sometimes there ARE situations when somebody has to step in and put a stop to this kind of bullshit. If no one steps in, she may do this again. There is no guarantee that she won't do this again unless she gets a complete hysterectomy. I am normally NOT for mandatory sterilization of the general female population, but this is one case that I will most definitely demand that the court order this woman to be sterilized. Enough is enough. Sometimes we have to make exceptions and step in and stop this kind of antic.

This is not just the doctor's fault, but also Nadya's fault since she ALLOWED the doctor to implant so many embyros into her body. She ALLOWED it. Yes, the doctor violated so many kinds of medical regulations on so many levels, but it still falls on the mother to make appropriate medical decisions regarding her body and her children and her pregnancies. She should have stopped at baby #6 especially since she has already had two sets of TWINS as well as two single birth babies. But no, she kept on going, and she actually ALLOWED the doctor to implant so many embyros into her uterus. She should have said, "No, I do not want eight babies. Please implant only 2 embyros in my uterus". She okayed the doctor to implant six embyros (some people are saying eight?) which clearly is a very inappropriate decision. No one in their right mind with fully functioning brain cells and fully developed reasoning abilities would actually allow a doctor to implant 6 to 8 embyros into her uterus fully knowing the risks of all the embyros possibly making it and fully knowing the risk of a very large multiple pregnancy. So, TWO people are at fault here. The clinic is also responsible, but I do not know anything about how the other fertility doctors at the clinic practice, what their ethics are, so I can't really say anything about the other doctors, so I am just going to say that there are at least TWO people who are at fault here in this situation, Nadya and the IVF doctor. Both persons knew the risks, and both made very inappropriate decisions, and both allowed this kind of situation to happen. So, both are at fault. Plus, this doctor enabled her to do this kind of bullshit.

Well, first of all -- you are exaggeratin' -- and second of all, THAT is YOUR viewpoints/opinions.

Lastly, I disagree with you totally about sterlization/hysterectomy issues and how a mother should manage things. She needs some help through education or trainin'. Same ideas about the teen kids that need some education/trainin' about how to protect themselves from gettin' STD, or HIV/AIDS and such through sex education. No body is goin' to force teen kids to have sterlization or whatsoever ..ohhh, just because of the diseases are spreadin'... or that teen girls are gettin' pregnant too early before they graduate. They STILL need to get some help. Don't be sooo harsh on them.

In my previous post, she should have waited until she is financially stable -- meanin' that she needs to get some trainin' on how to live managably and independently. I know she is young -- maybe, not enough experiences ? Hmm ? Education will help to benefit her to understand about the money issue and how to manage it.
 
Lucia, you did explain it very fantastic. :c)

Dreama and Maria, I'm sorry to say this... I have to agree with Lucia.

I'm so disappoint with that woman did not take a responality (sp). No, she did not. Thankfully, I don't have a job to pay it for her "needy stuff". When I get my job, I do NOT want to pay my tax to hers if the octmom did not take it personally. Well, I will be very disappoint and upset if I have to pay it on everything is belong to hers. I think it's totally uncalled for. :(

Please understand for one moment - the woman had six children, now she has eight new kids, which she have fourteen right now. It sucks awfully when her parents have to deal with all this crappy stuff. I saw tv show, Dr. Paul, she made me so sick... definitely, she also made me so mad. She is an attention whore, simple and clear. I don't know what my family feels about that since they have their jobs... :(

This octmom have NO, I meant, BIG NO common sense.

Sorry, I'm on Lucia's (and others') side for one whole reason.....

That's fine by me. It's your viewpoints/opinions as hers.
 
Speakin' of gettin' a job - sure, she needs it rather than livin' on welfare. Livin' on welfare doesn't help much. It all depends on what experience she has and what kind of job that she CAN work... some things that she knows how to work. If, not -- then, she needs to get some college education as well to get a better pay ( job ).

It is not necessary for her to work more than 40 hours a week. There's some jobs that pays good with less hours. Some pays fairly with more hours. Dependin' on what kind of job/hrs she wants.
 
1. Abortion is not the topic of this thread. If you want to talk about abortion I suggest you make a new thread.

2. Maria isn't anti choice and neither am I. We are against abortion.

3. I think that Maria was making the point that people talk about pro choice etc etc... but where there is any choices outside killing babies, then the same people become very anti choice. It's a good point, although I'd limit the choice to produce too many babies like Nadya, but only because it leads to so many deaths of the unlucky babies that get killed in 'selective reduction' or miscariage.

It will become people's business when they start paying for the care of these children.
 
Jillio, thanks for the post about Duggar spouses. :) Quite interesting link. Jillo, what do you think of that? I'm curious.

EDIT: My opinion on this link... I think give a birth to single child is actually better than give a birth to so many children. That is all I think of. Thoughts? You are free to disagree/agree to that, it might be interesting to know how much different their POVs are. :)

I don't have a problem with the number of kids the Duggars have. They are responsible parents, they support their children without assitance, and they are debt free. They appear to be a happy and well adjusted family.
 
We should give her cleaning supplies and tell her to go door to door cleaning houses or cutting grass or anything. It's better than nothing and does not require prior job experience nor job interviews.

Agreed, or she can go to work at McDonald's. Usually if you have a pulse you can get hired at McDonald's.
 
The Duggars say that they are doing it because they believed that it was "their blessing from God" and that they were supposed to accept those "blessings" and that they enjoy having so many children. I don't agree with the religious motive, but that's their motive. And they have the means to provide their children with the things they need. They have shown that they have full reasoning abilities and can make appropriate medical and financial decisions regarding themselves and their own children.


It doesn't matter about motives with the Duggar family. The point is that they choose to have many kids and doing it debt free. I give them a huge amount of Credit. Besides their kids are very respectful, responsible and well behavied. You can't say that about normal size families. The Duggars are well respected in our community.
 
Speakin' of gettin' a job - sure, she needs it rather than livin' on welfare. Livin' on welfare doesn't help much. It all depends on what experience she has and what kind of job that she CAN work... some things that she knows how to work. If, not -- then, she needs to get some college education as well to get a better pay ( job ).

It is not necessary for her to work more than 40 hours a week. There's some jobs that pays good with less hours. Some pays fairly with more hours. Dependin' on what kind of job/hrs she wants.

I personally think this idiot mother should be at least temporarily severed from the kids. Have them stay with relatives until the mother can get a job and exhibit responsible behavior. The permanent requirements I would set follow:

1. She must work a job for a minimum of 6 months (they must be consecutive).
2. She must be given positive reviews in regular reviews on work performance (2 minimum positive reviews, also to be consecutive).
3. She must learn how to write up and implement a budget. A required expense on it would be to pay half the regular payment plus any interest from the debt accrued in the ten months non-payment on the mortgage, set up a budget that can return the balance to an acceptable figure within a year, maximum. This can be negotiated with the grandmother.
4. She must refile monthly for any aid that she gets. During the period of severance, the aid that would be given for the kids goes to the caretakers, and not the mother.
5. During her pregnancy, she should be busy applying for jobs stating an availability, barring any complications of the pregnancy and birth, of no later than a month after delivery
6. If there are not enough relatives willing to care for the kids, suitable "foster" parents will be chosen in local areas. The same requirement of financial responsibility will be used in choosing these parents. Visitation will also be allowed on a weekly basis, with a maximum limit of $100 to feed the kids while on visitation. Any more must be from the mother, so no splurging on a trip to Adventure Landing until she has gone quite well out of her hole to a place she will never fall back into it.

Terms of the severance period would include:

1. The severance would last a minimum of 1 year, with a requirement that she have fulfilled all above requirements before a time between 2 and 5 years (decision to be left up to the judicial system) after the beginning of her working (yes, this means that the official timeline does not start until after the pregnancy. The severance should start immediately.
2. If the mother is unable to meet the requirements above by the deadline, the severance should be made a permanent one and the kids put up for adoption. If the relatives and/or foster parents wish to keep the kids, they must fill out and qualify for the adoption.
3. If she meets the requirements, but is still unable to pay for the care of all the kids, a partial rejoining can be allowed, with the older children given preference to choice.
4. During the severance period, the mother may not practice in un-protected sex. This means she must use condoms (whether a male or female condom is used does not matter), and contraceptives if sexually active. This extends to sex after marriage as well.
5. If she gets married, the stepfather must also meet the above requirements. (One mooch marries another mooch and all you have is a double mooch)
6. She must seek her own housing, rental or owning, so long as:
7. She must demonstrate the ability to pay her housing bills, as well as her part of the mortgage payment (which continues until the amount she pays is half of the cost accrued during the ten month period, including interest, is paid by her.)
8. Any children conceived during the period will be treated the same as the original 14, taken to a foster family or relative who will be charged with the responsibility of caring for the kid(s). If it is shown that the mother was violating rule #4, punishments of severity up to and including permanent severance as described in rule #2.

additionally, the grandmother she mooched off of should be entitled to public aid due to her being the victim of this circumstance. All aid obtained this way is to be billed to her daughter.

I think the above is a quite balanced way for her to redeem herself. I believe people should be given second chances, so while I agree with Lucia that she was irresponsible and should be made to pay back what she stole, we should give her another chance.
 
I personally think this idiot mother should be at least temporarily severed from the kids. Have them stay with relatives until the mother can get a job and exhibit responsible behavior. The permanent requirements I would set follow:

1. She must work a job for a minimum of 6 months (they must be consecutive).
2. She must be given positive reviews in regular reviews on work performance (2 minimum positive reviews, also to be consecutive).
3. She must learn how to write up and implement a budget. A required expense on it would be to pay half the regular payment plus any interest from the debt accrued in the ten months non-payment on the mortgage, set up a budget that can return the balance to an acceptable figure within a year, maximum. This can be negotiated with the grandmother.
4. She must refile monthly for any aid that she gets. During the period of severance, the aid that would be given for the kids goes to the caretakers, and not the mother.
5. During her pregnancy, she should be busy applying for jobs stating an availability, barring any complications of the pregnancy and birth, of no later than a month after delivery
6. If there are not enough relatives willing to care for the kids, suitable "foster" parents will be chosen in local areas. The same requirement of financial responsibility will be used in choosing these parents. Visitation will also be allowed on a weekly basis, with a maximum limit of $100 to feed the kids while on visitation. Any more must be from the mother, so no splurging on a trip to Adventure Landing until she has gone quite well out of her hole to a place she will never fall back into it.

Terms of the severance period would include:

1. The severance would last a minimum of 1 year, with a requirement that she have fulfilled all above requirements before a time between 2 and 5 years (decision to be left up to the judicial system) after the beginning of her working (yes, this means that the official timeline does not start until after the pregnancy. The severance should start immediately.
2. If the mother is unable to meet the requirements above by the deadline, the severance should be made a permanent one and the kids put up for adoption. If the relatives and/or foster parents wish to keep the kids, they must fill out and qualify for the adoption.
3. If she meets the requirements, but is still unable to pay for the care of all the kids, a partial rejoining can be allowed, with the older children given preference to choice.
4. During the severance period, the mother may not practice in un-protected sex. This means she must use condoms (whether a male or female condom is used does not matter), and contraceptives if sexually active. This extends to sex after marriage as well.
5. If she gets married, the stepfather must also meet the above requirements. (One mooch marries another mooch and all you have is a double mooch)
6. She must seek her own housing, rental or owning, so long as:
7. She must demonstrate the ability to pay her housing bills, as well as her part of the mortgage payment (which continues until the amount she pays is half of the cost accrued during the ten month period, including interest, is paid by her.)
8. Any children conceived during the period will be treated the same as the original 14, taken to a foster family or relative who will be charged with the responsibility of caring for the kid(s). If it is shown that the mother was violating rule #4, punishments of severity up to and including permanent severance as described in rule #2.

additionally, the grandmother she mooched off of should be entitled to public aid due to her being the victim of this circumstance. All aid obtained this way is to be billed to her daughter.

I think the above is a quite balanced way for her to redeem herself. I believe people should be given second chances, so while I agree with Lucia that she was irresponsible and should be made to pay back what she stole, we should give her another chance.

SECOND CHANCE!! Hell she's had 14!!

I say the kids need to be removed from her care plain and simple. She obviously lacks the LOGIC and COMPREHENSION to realize that she does not have the financial nor physical means to care for so many children.

Like Ive said in the past - once is an accident - anything after that is plain stupidity!

BTW 6 consecutive months of employment means NOTHING to an employer. If she can show she is consecutively employed for the SAME employer for 5 or more years then we can start saying yeah this girl can keep a job. Because she's never worked a day in her life she's going to have to take some pretty crappy jobs before she can start getting the better jobs. She's simply going to have to work her way up.

Ive worked some crappy jobs, but I can honestly say that Ive not worked up enough yet to get that better job yet. Im still working the jobs I dont want to simply because LOGIC and COMPREHENSION tells me that I must work in order to provide for my child. I was laid off and yes I am on unemployment assistance, but I am ACTIVELY looking for a job. The days I am not in school, are the days I spend ALL DAY knocking on doors, filing out applications, following up, and conducting interviews.
 
Nadya had no place whatsoever to even consider IVF. There should be something that says if you are on state assistance or have been on state assistance within the past 5 years, you are automatically disqualified for IVF.

I am 100% for sterilization of women who do this very thing. Morons should not bear children, period.

Be careful what you wish for. They could consider deaf people as morons as they have done in the past.
 
Be careful what you wish for. They could consider deaf people as morons as they have done in the past.

I agree. This whole case reminds me of this single deafblind woman I know. They spent a lot of money on services to help her with her baby. In fact a lot of it was unwanted and unwelcome based on doupts on how a deafblind woman could manage a child on her own. People were thinking the child would soon be taken away. Now she is married with 3 children who are all in good health. One of her sons who has inherited her blindness but he seens to be doing ok too. Give it another 10 years with Nadya and her brood and let's see what happens then.
 
Completely and totally unrelated to the Suleman case on every conceivable count.
 
Reading the above post is the exact reason why I feel the Dr. should be responsible for paying for the care of the babies.

He is the one that allowed it to happen by implanting 6 embryos in her. Two splitted resulting in 8 babies!
 
Well, first of all -- you are exaggeratin' -- and second of all, THAT is YOUR viewpoints/opinions.

Lastly, I disagree with you totally about sterlization/hysterectomy issues and how a mother should manage things. She needs some help through education or trainin'. Same ideas about the teen kids that need some education/trainin' about how to protect themselves from gettin' STD, or HIV/AIDS and such through sex education. No body is goin' to force teen kids to have sterlization or whatsoever ..ohhh, just because of the diseases are spreadin'... or that teen girls are gettin' pregnant too early before they graduate. They STILL need to get some help. Don't be sooo harsh on them.

In my previous post, she should have waited until she is financially stable -- meanin' that she needs to get some trainin' on how to live managably and independently. I know she is young -- maybe, not enough experiences ? Hmm ? Education will help to benefit her to understand about the money issue and how to manage it.

I am not exagerrating. This is the truth. This is the facts. The facts are: She does NOT have any reasoning abilities to make any kind of appropriate medical and financial decisions regarding her children and herself, and therefore she should be declared incompetent and placed in a group home for the rest of her life, plus the older six should be placed with different relatives permanently, and the octuplets should be adopted out to up to 8 different adoptive families, and she must undergo a complete hysterectomy, and she does NOT deserve ANOTHER chance. She's already had so many chances. She's had 5 chances with her kids - 2 single births, two sets of twins, and then OCTUPLETS. That's too many chances already. Enough is enough! And, then the grandmother should be given the opportunity to go on public assistance so she can finally retire since she has done EVERYTHING for her selfish daughter and her poor six children and if the state does not step in, she is going to be stuck caring for the OCTUPLETS too, which is not fair to her.

She did this intentionally. She KNEW the consequences, and she still did this. So, no amount of educating or training to teach her about the consequences of pregnancies, such multiple pregnancies, or even about how to manage her finances will do her any good, since she clearly has shown that she does not have a fully functioning brain, that she has some missing brain cells, and that she does NOT have the reasoning abilities she should have developed by the time she was in her mid-20s. She can't even live independently and she can't even manage the older six children. She's still living with her mother in a THREE bedroom house. How do you fit 14 children in a 3 bedroom house along with the mother and the grandmother? That's 16 people total!

We need to be harsh on this mother or else she is not going to realize the consequences of her idiotic actions. We need to put our feet down and say NO!" and "Enough is enough!" and cut her off of all kinds of financial assistance she has been getting, and make her go get a job working 40 hours a week, or even better, 80 hours a week so she can pay back the state and the government and then her grandmother. She took advantage of the system and she took advantage of her mother. That is NOT right. That is VERY wrong.
 
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