NRA offensive exposes deep U.S. divisions on guns

Reba said:
So is my Jeep Cherokee (emissions). California is a whole other world.
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Are you serious?

Most vehicles are based on California standard than federal standard on emission.

There are plenty of jeep drivers in CA.
 
AdamFencepost said:
What are you talking about? If the US is invaded, what is it 200 "capable" citizens are going to do? We have 1. 5 million active military service members and an equal number in reserves. What is it you are afraid of?
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I think Jiro wants to be a warrior. :lol:
 
Foxrac said:
Are you serious?

Most vehicles are based on California standard than federal standard on emission.
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California standard is higher than federal standard.

Foxrac said:
There are plenty of jeep drivers in CA.
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the jeeps in CA are California-legal but Reba's jeep is not a current model.
 
AdamFencepost said:
US gun accidents and suicides are astronomically higher than any other developed nation.

US gun homicides: 7 American victims to 1 non-American victim in the 23 wealthiest nations of the world.
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you cannot compare America with other country. it's apple-orange. How can you compare America with.... say Korea? or Japan? very very apple-orange.

AdamFencepost said:
What are you talking about? If the US is invaded, what is it 200 "capable" citizens are going to do?
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you missed the point. there are 300 million American citizens and growing. do the math.

AdamFencepost said:
We have 1. 5 million active military service members and an equal number in reserves.
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you're forgetting casualties. and do you seriously think it's enough to protect America at all four sides?

AdamFencepost said:
What is it you are afraid of?
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I'm afraid for America if we continue to fool ourselves into thinking more laws and bigger government will make us feel safe. All these coddling will turn us into helpless sheep because we let them take a scissor and cut away the Constitution.
 
Jiro said:
California standard is higher than federal standard.


the jeeps in CA are California-legal but Reba's jeep is not a current model.
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Anyone can drive any vehicle from anywhere to CA when visiting.
 
Jiro said:
California standard is higher than federal standard.


the jeeps in CA are California-legal but Reba's jeep is not a current model.
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Yup, I know that emission standard is much stricter in California than federal, however I just point that most cars are made based on California standard.

How could make Reba's jeep as legal to drive in California? make modification on emission?
 
Foxrac said:
Yup, I know that emission standard is much stricter in California than federal, however I just point that most cars are made based on California standard.

How could make Reba's jeep as legal to drive in California? make modification on emission?
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none. it's old old model. simple - just don't be a Californian :lol:
 
Jiro said:
yes but not for residents.
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Right. OK, now about your handgun which is illegal in CA as you said, it means that you can't bring it with you even when you visit there. That's a different story.
 
Jiro said:
you cannot compare America with other country. it's apple-orange. How can you compare America with.... say Korea? or Japan? very very apple-orange.
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Sorry, I still believe that one only becomes convinced by observation. There is nothing to observe, as you would have it, if we never look beyond our borders. And therefore, not one thing changes until those with power, change it for us.

Jiro said:
you missed the point. there are 300 million American citizens and growing. do the math.
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Math was never my strong suit but 1.5mil + 1.5mil = 3million. That is massive force. I suppose that adding the 1 million police officers to the total would also be unconvincing.

Jiro said:
you're forgetting casualties. and do you seriously think it's enough to protect America at all four sides?

I'm afraid for America if we continue to fool ourselves into thinking more laws and bigger government to coddle us to the point where we'll become helpless sheep.
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We are being attacked from 4 sides? As far as I know, the US mainland has not been invaded since the Mexican War in the 1840's. Lincoln made a famous "spot speech" at the time questioning this invasion and demanding that we be shown the "spot" where it had actually occurred. With 170 years of history - we are now in danger of being attacked from all sides?

I'm beginning to think that this is simply paranoid thinking, Jiro. For those of us willing to accept change, I fear that those who fear change will lock us into place. That is a condition for extinction.
 
shel90 said:
The NRA,s views are idiotic. All they want to do is arm more people.

People should not own guns like these. There is just no reason.

I seriously doubt Obama and our military will be a threat to us. The 2nd Amendment was written because America just became free from the British and wanted to keep it that way. Not for people to own machine guns or guns designed to kill humans.

I am not against people owning guns for hunting as a sport or to protect their homes but do people really need several assault type of weapons?
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They are a lot of fun to shoot. That is reason enou.
 
AdamFencepost said:
Sorry, I still believe that one only becomes convinced by observation. There is nothing to observe, as you would have it, if we never look beyond our borders. And therefore, not one thing changes until those with power, change it for us.


Math was never my strong suit but 1.5mil + 1.5mil = 3million. That is massive force. I suppose that adding the 1 million police officers to the total would also be unconvincing.
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try adding reality to that number. that number will shrink quite rapidly. think Vietnam War, WW1, WW2, Korean War, etc.

AdamFencepost said:
We are being attacked from 4 sides? As far as I know, the US mainland has not been invaded since the Mexican War in the 1840's. Lincoln made a famous "spot speech" at the time questioning this invasion and demanding that we be shown the "spot" where it had actually occurred. With 170 years of history - we are now in danger of being attacked from all sides?
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you need to think in multidimensions. everything in America depends on everything. if Texas gets overtaken by a foreign invader, this affects entire America because of oil supply. because of this, there will be anarchy/riot/problem all over America and National Guards and Army (via suspension of Posse Comitatus Act) will be stretched thin along with sustained causalities. we've already seen how sensitive and chaotic NJ-NY has gotten when we had gas crisis.

I'm a history buff especially in war history, weaponry, and tactic. I can say with guarantee that America is extremely fragile since our economy and supply chain management are based on "Just-In-Time". meaning? if there is a disruption in our supply chain management... it takes only 3 days for all supplies to disappear from shelves - water, gas, etc.

AdamFencepost said:
I'm beginning to think that this is simply paranoid thinking, Jiro. For those of us willing to accept change, I fear that those who fear change will lock us into place. That is a condition for extinction.
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does it ever occur to you that we too think this is simply a paranoid thinking that we're all bunch of gun-trigger happy cowboys who cannot be reasoned with and that you feel the need for more laws and bigger government to prevent America from turning into Wild West?

America is only about 230 years old. we ain't seen nothing yet. many many many countries including wealthy nations have already gone thru major revolutions and government collapses plus 2 World Wars. To think nothing's gonna happen to us.... oye oye you surely are in for some rude awakening especially for those who are not self-reliant. Maybe another Great Depression is needed to remind these coddling infants that it's time to wake up and start being a responsible self-reliant citizen? I assure you that over 50% of America will be fine but those who won't fare well are the one who lives in city and has never shot a gun or hunted an animal.
 
Reba said:
So, you expect Americans to stick with muskets and pikes while the enemy uses the latest and greatest weaponry? That's not logical.
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People forget that we had more than just muskets back then too.
 
Jiro said:
good one... good one...

I mean... yea you know what I mean :lol:
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Yup, lots of things can be dangerous if a person wants to make them dangerous. People will just replace one with another.
 
Jiro said:
try adding reality to that number. that number will shrink quite rapidly. think Vietnam War, WW1, WW2, Korean War, etc.
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I believe you are entirely too confident in your interpretation of reality and it does not make you far-sighted. As you say, there are some who are in for a "rude awakening" but it may be neither of us.

Evolution will overtake us and, as Texasgolfer says, "People will just replace one with another." He may not have meant people will be replaced with other people but that is the reality.

America is a complex nation but there is more to America than supply and demand, weaponry and military tactics.

I believe that this country is constantly in the process of evolving and that is a source of strength. There will always be those who seek to divide us thru fear and freeze us in place. We have acted best, however, when we have acted together. Where we will end up in another 236 years, and I have witnessed nearly 30% of that number, neither I nor anyone else knows.
 
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