Is mainstream good for deaf?

I had been in mainstream all through the elementary school (1st grade to 6th grade) and then mainstreamed in high school(7th grade to 12 grade). Both of this schools sucked big time, I had to learn to use ear phone with the teacher talking into the microphone. No sign language allowed in both schools. No notetakers, either. During the mainstream elementary school and from 7th to 9th, I had to go into Gym classes with the hearing children. Then by 10th grade, I was mainstreamed with the hearing students all the way to 12th grade with no accommodations which I need very badly. I did not know how to sign the English sign language. I started to learn English sign language and ASL when I graduate from high school. I was 20 years old back then. It was a very difficult situation for me to go through not understanding what the teachers said and I was struggling as best as I could to make the grades. I was surprised and amazed to make it to graduation. I still have my high school diploma and just looking at it with the sad expression knowing that I probably would have fail at all the subjects in the regular class, because I could not understand a damn thing what the teachers said. Geeze. :mad:
 
Bebonang said:
I had been in mainstream all through the elementary school (1st grade to 6th grade) and then mainstreamed in high school(7th grade to 12 grade). Both of this schools sucked big time, I had to learn to use ear phone with the teacher talking into the microphone. No sign language allowed in both schools. No notetakers, either. During the mainstream elementary school and from 7th to 9th, I had to go into Gym classes with the hearing children. Then by 10th grade, I was mainstreamed with the hearing students all the way to 12th grade with no accommodations which I need very badly. I did not know how to sign the English sign language. I started to learn English sign language and ASL when I graduate from high school. I was 20 years old back then. It was a very difficult situation for me to go through not understanding what the teachers said and I was struggling as best as I could to make the grades. I was surprised and amazed to make it to graduation. I still have my high school diploma and just looking at it with the sad expression knowing that I probably would have fail at all the subjects in the regular class, because I could not understand a damn thing what the teachers said. Geeze. :mad:
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That's awful!
 
Oh. I have acces to classroom curriculum since 4th grade. It was fine. I am graduating on May 28 with regular diploma.
 
jillio said:
Speaking well doesn't necessarily mean getting access to the curriculm. Accessing the curriculum is a receptive activity. Speaking is not. That's where we make our biggest mistake. Assuming that a child who speaks well is also able to hear well.
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That's right.

Even at RIT, I've seen hearing students who have bad writing skills. (I even had a professor ask me if my mom did my paper or helped me with my paper because my writing was better than the rest of the class. *groans*)

Nowadays, people have become to dependent on slangs... mobile communication... online communication... l33t speaking (talking with abnormal characters)... that it affects their writing skills. I remember reading an article about one public school who had problems with their students using too many AIM lingos in their papers about what they did over the summer. (BRB, GTG, LOL, etc)
 
Vampy, it's also that most people don't really know how to articulate themselves through writing. A lot of them don't read, so they don't subconsciously learn how to construct sentances with appropreate grammar and syntax. They also don't know how to set up an essay or construct really good writing.
 
Oh and Oceanbreeze,
One thing that I think could help a lot with kids with mobilty issues, is a regional co-op mainstream school, that would in turn serve as a regional magnet program for kids with mobilty issues. I really think that a lot of them problem is that most mobilty affected kids are lumped in with regular special ed kids. Those of us who have more tradtional disabilties have needs which are completly different from just LD kids.
I mean when's the last time you heard about an LD kid being pulled out for OT/ST etc?
 
I experienced being in a public school and was onced called myself "regular" student in a majority of hearing children. I went to a school for the Deaf for several years before I enrolled nto a public school system. I was the only deaf student in entire system and I have my regerts in some ways. I missed out the fun-socialize life while I was kid and now I graduated from a hearing university and experienced the same way I have went through in school. I am blessed to learn the difference between the deaf way and the hearing way. Unfortunately, I do not support or would advocate mainstreaming programs in public school because of a large percent of the deaf students that graduated from public school tend to become very isolated and not funcation very well in the society; compare to the deaf residential graduates tend to be able to adapt in a different settings in their course of their life. Another thing I would want to emphasis this is that I am very concerned about the future of our deaf generation--where is new leadership within the deaf communties? There are so many veteran Deaf leaders now are retired and not active involve in our deaf communites. We need more Deaf leadership people who do have a strong sense of unity and desire to protect the deaf culture and the value of deaf core.
 
Meggie2 said:
Oh. I have acces to classroom curriculum since 4th grade. It was fine. I am graduating on May 28 with regular diploma.
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I'm sorry, Meggie, I don't remember if you said or not: did you have an interpreter with you in the classroom?
 
fivesolasjz said:
I experienced being in a public school and was onced called myself "regular" student in a majority of hearing children. I went to a school for the Deaf for several years before I enrolled nto a public school system. I was the only deaf student in entire system and I have my regerts in some ways. I missed out the fun-socialize life while I was kid and now I graduated from a hearing university and experienced the same way I have went through in school. I am blessed to learn the difference between the deaf way and the hearing way. Unfortunately, I do not support or would advocate mainstreaming programs in public school because of a large percent of the deaf students that graduated from public school tend to become very isolated and not funcation very well in the society; compare to the deaf residential graduates tend to be able to adapt in a different settings in their course of their life. Another thing I would want to emphasis this is that I am very concerned about the future of our deaf generation--where is new leadership within the deaf communties? There are so many veteran Deaf leaders now are retired and not active involve in our deaf communites. We need more Deaf leadership people who do have a strong sense of unity and desire to protect the deaf culture and the value of deaf core.
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Good posting!
 
jiro123 said:
To answer your question, Meggie... Yes I think it's good idea to be on mainstream because we live in real world where it's hard enough to survive. We (the disabled people) need to learn how to get along with mainstream and to function with them. Yes it is hard enough when we're in schools that have ignorant people, bullies, or administrators who are not very helpful.
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Not at our expense. We need to get a good education without getting a lousy interperter who only took one sign language course. We need a good education so we can continue on to college if we wish so. It is the real world who need to get along with us and sadly many of them failed to get along with us. We need a school for the Deaf so we can have a proper socialization in order to have a health outlook on life. We need ASL like we need air to breathe.
 
Buffalo said:
Not at our expense. We need to get a good education without getting a lousy interperter who only took one sign language course. We need a good education so we can continue on to college if we wish so. It is the real world who need to get along with us and sadly many of them failed to get along with us. We need a school for the Deaf so we can have a proper socialization in order to have a health outlook on life. We need ASL like we need air to breathe.
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:eek: I don't think the school would hire an interpreter with just one sign language course. Doesn't she/he have to be certified to be a competent interpreter? It's not the real world who need to get along with us. There are far too many of them and too few of us to represent as the majority so it's us who need to get along with them. In School for Deaf - they only socialize with deaf people. They would not have enough experience to interact with hearing people. (please correct me if I'm wrong on this. I've never been to deaf school).

And yes of course you can learn ASL and have interpreter with you anywhere - at schools and work. I doubt the interpreter would be that incompetent with only 1 ASL course. My friend is deaf and has an interpreter with her thru whole schools - mainstream high school and college. She went to the MIT as mechanical engineer. Now she works for biggest firm for automobiles (I can't remember the name). She's extremely smart and excels in any classes. Perfect score in SAT and GMAT. My point is - well life's not easy. don't limit your lifestyle because of your disability. Any one of us can exceed past our limitation if you want to and disability is of no concern because there is always a solution for our disability. Handicapped? no problem - wheelchair. Deaf? no problem - ASL or CI. Blind? no problem - braille. Remember NY Governor? He's blind. Look at Stephen Hawkins too! How can a man with no mobility at all be a cosmology genius?
 
jiro123 said:
:eek: I don't think the school would hire an interpreter with just one sign language course. Doesn't she/he have to be certified to be a competent interpreter? It's not the real world who need to get along with us. There are far too many of them and too few of us to represent as the majority so it's us who need to get along with them. In School for Deaf - they only socialize with deaf people. They would not have enough experience to interact with hearing people. (please correct me if I'm wrong on this. I've never been to deaf school).
Children whohave been educated in themainstream, when looked at as a group, have notoriously delayed social skills as a result of the isolation caused by restricted interaction with peers and teachers. Children educated at a deaf school, shere communication is not restricted, are able to interact with peers and teachers without restriction, and therefore develop more advanced social skills. This facillitates interaction with the hearing world.

And yes of course you can learn ASL and have interpreter with you anywhere - at schools and work. I doubt the interpreter would be that incompetent with only 1 ASL course. My friend is deaf and has an interpreter with her thru whole schools - mainstream high school and college. She went to the MIT as mechanical engineer. Now she works for biggest firm for automobiles (I can't remember the name). She's extremely smart and excels in any classes. Perfect score in SAT and GMAT. My point is - well life's not easy. don't limit your lifestyle because of your disability. Any one of us can exceed past our limitation if you want to and disability is of no concern because there is always a solution for our disability. Handicapped? no problem - wheelchair. Deaf? no problem - ASL or CI. Blind? no problem - braille. Remember NY Governor? He's blind. Look at Stephen Hawkins too! How can a man with no mobility at all be a cosmology genius?
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Are you actually saying that 1 ASL course is sufficient to interpret? If so, I will have to strongly disagree with that one. Interpreting is more than knowing sign vocabulary. One ASL course hardly provides enough fluency to carry on a conversation, much less interpret.
 
jillio said:
Are you actually saying that 1 ASL course is sufficient to interpret? If so, I will have to strongly disagree with that one. Interpreting is more than knowing sign vocabulary. One ASL course hardly provides enough fluency to carry on a conversation, much less interpret.
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OH CRAP! I mistyped it. It's supposed to say - I doubt the interpreter would be that competent with only 1 ASL course. Thank you for pointing it out.

Children whohave been educated in themainstream, when looked at as a group, have notoriously delayed social skills as a result of the isolation caused by restricted interaction with peers and teachers. Children educated at a deaf school, shere communication is not restricted, are able to interact with peers and teachers without restriction, and therefore develop more advanced social skills. This facillitates interaction with the hearing world.
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I see. I somehow feel that deaf people who socialized a lot with deaf people at deaf school tends to stick with their own kind. Usually, it is a nice gateway to hearing world by having hearing friend. But that's my opinion.
 
jiro123 said:
OH CRAP! I mistyped it. It's supposed to say - I doubt the interpreter would be that competent with only 1 ASL course. Thank you for pointing it out.


I see. I somehow feel that deaf people who socialized a lot with deaf people at deaf school tends to stick with their own kind. Usually, it is a nice gateway to hearing world by having hearing friend. But that's my opinion.
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Who says children who attend deaf school don't have hearing friends? The vast majority come from hearing families.
 
jillio said:
Who says children who attend deaf school don't have hearing friends? The vast majority come from hearing families.
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families and friends are different. Can you say for certainty that most deaf children attending deaf school will be in mainstream life? You'll have to correct my view on deaf school because I have never gone there nor do I know any deaf friend (except just 1 but she was on mainstream path).
 
jiro123 said:
families and friends are different. Can you say for certainty that most deaf children attending deaf school will be in mainstream life? You'll have to correct my view on deaf school because I have never gone there nor do I know any deaf friend (except just 1 but she was on mainstream path).
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Well, my son attended a deaf school. 80% of their graduates go on to attend mainstream colleges. And any deaf person who has a job will be interacting with mainstream society.
If a deaf person goes to the doctor or the dentist, chances are they will be interacting with hearing society. If they eat in a restaurant, they will be interacting with mainstream hearing society. If they drop their clothes off at a dry cleaners, pick a prescription up at the pharmacy, or go to the grocery store, they will be interacting with mainstream hearing society. It can't be avoided.

Likewise, if a deaf child comes from a hearing family, simply by that family's association with other families, they will be in contact with hearing peers. Chances are better that their neighbors and playmates will be hearing that that they will be deaf. That is why the deaf school provides an environment that gives them the opportunity to interact with peers that are the same as them so that they are not constantly reminded of their difference, and hold themselves to hearing standards. Likewise with being exposed to deaf adults that can serve as mentors.

The point is that the mainstream environment does not provide for the educational needs of the deaf students, nor for the psychosocial developmental needs.
 
jillio said:
Well, my son attended a deaf school. 80% of their graduates go on to attend mainstream colleges. And any deaf person who has a job will be interacting with mainstream society.
If a deaf person goes to the doctor or the dentist, chances are they will be interacting with hearing society. If they eat in a restaurant, they will be interacting with mainstream hearing society. If they drop their clothes off at a dry cleaners, pick a prescription up at the pharmacy, or go to the grocery store, they will be interacting with mainstream hearing society. It can't be avoided.

Likewise, if a deaf child comes from a hearing family, simply by that family's association with other families, they will be in contact with hearing peers. Chances are better that their neighbors and playmates will be hearing that that they will be deaf. That is why the deaf school provides an environment that gives them the opportunity to interact with peers that are the same as them so that they are not constantly reminded of their difference, and hold themselves to hearing standards. Likewise with being exposed to deaf adults that can serve as mentors.

The point is that the mainstream environment does not provide for the educational needs of the deaf students, nor for the psychosocial developmental needs.
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Sorry to jump in your argument. I am the prime example of the mainstreamer with unmet psychosocial developmental needs. So I agree with that part of argument against mainstreaming. And I did get picked on a lot. But my children(hearing) told me when they went to school that people are more sensitive today and less mean.:dunno2:
 
Bottesini said:
Sorry to jump in your argument. I am the prime example of the mainstreamer with unmet psychosocial developmental needs. So I agree with that part of argument against mainstreaming. And I did get picked on a lot. But my children(hearing) told me when they went to school that people are more sensitive today and less mean.:dunno2:
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I would certainly hope so, but it is not what I am finding in the public school systems.

Thanks for your confirmation on the psychosocial needs.:ty: And no need to apologize. All are welcome to express their opinions and their experience.
 
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