Is it fair to force retirement at 65 years of age? Aye or Nay?

[Barbaro]

European court backs UK retirement age of 65

The UK's compulsory retirement age of 65 is not in breach of EU rules on age
discrimination, a European court ruled today.

The charity Age Concern had brought a test case to find out whether it was legal for UK employers to force their workers to retire when they reached 65.

But today European judges backed Britain's compulsory retirement age today - as long as it has a 'legitimate aim' linked to social or employment policy.

In Britain, workers can be dismissed without redundancy payments when they reach their 65th birthday.

The verdict in Luxembourg amounts to a defeat for Age Concern's legal battle to banish enforced retirement at 65, but the final decision still rests with the UK High Court.

The European Court of Justice acknowledged that EU rules do ban employment discrimination on grounds of age.

But the court said the Equal Treatment Directive also states that differences of treatment may not amount to discrimination 'if they are objectively and reasonably justified by legitimate aims, such as those related to employment policy, the labour market or vocational training'.

The High Court, which sent the case to Luxembourg for clarification of the law, will now have to make a final ruling on whether the aims of the Government's 65 retirement age are 'legitimate'.

Today's judgment said EU governments were not required under the equality rules to draw up a specific list of the differences in treatment which they consider to be 'justified by a legitimate aim'.

The court said that whether a person could be treated differently according to age depended on individual reasons such as improving a firm's competitiveness or reducing costs.

The judges added: 'It is for the national court to ascertain, first, whether the United Kingdom legislation reflects such a legitimate aim and, second, whether the means chosen were appropriate and necessary to achieve it.'

Government lawyers insisted in court that the exception was a matter for national rules, and the situation of retirement age workers should not be governed by the EU Directive.

About 25,000 workers are estimated to face 'default retirement' at 65 in the UK every year, when they would be happy and able to carry on.

Age Concern said today that the result did not alter what it called the Government's contradictory position: 'On the one hand it wants people to work for longer, on the other, it's happy to keep this legislation that reinforces a 'grey ceiling'.'

source: European court backs UK retirement age of 65 | Mail Online

there are some UK links:

BBC NEWS | Business | EU judges back UK retirement age
UK employees can still be forced to retire at 65, EU court rules | Money | guardian.co.uk
EU backs forced retirement at 65 - Service Industries - Management Today
Compulsory retirement at 65 dispute 'far from over' - lawyer | KentOnline| News

 

[sara1981]

HMMM!

mostly workers always reach early retirement ages before 65 years old

my grandma got early retires from state farm insurance in 1995 when she was 58 years old she work as secretary.

my dad also retires from SBC (Southwest Bell Telephone,Co Inc.) they now changes ATT but he work there for 26 years in his services since 1978 till 2004 dues he had heart surgery summer 2004 but his doctors told my dad need easy to rest than worker harders! but he leave SBC when he was 51 years old very young! but my dad wanted return to his old jobs since retires.But he got another jobs somewhere.

 

[Royale]

No I do not think they should be forced to retire at 65 as long as they are still mentally and physical fit to work.

 

[Reba]

No I do not think they should be forced to retire at 65 as long as they are still mentally and physical fit to work.

I agree.

 

[Daredevel7]

There are some cases where people MUST be forced to retire. I knew a guy who was getting Army retirement benefits, social security benefits, and he was on active duty. He just turned 70 and refused to retire. They had to let him go because basically, he was making too much money. (Plus, he didn't work much anyway...)

 

[darkage]

increase number of longer live
too many people vs limited number of job or downsize
look for lower salary vs cost of live
Retire people reach 90 age vs not enough $$ cost of live

 

[Reba]

There are some cases where people MUST be forced to retire. I knew a guy who was getting Army retirement benefits, social security benefits, and he was on active duty. He just turned 70 and refused to retire. They had to let him go because basically, he was making too much money. (Plus, he didn't work much anyway...)

If he was retired from the Army, how could he be on active duty at the same time? That's double dipping.

Workers pay into SS, so they earn the right to collect that.

He must have special skills that the military needs. I knew a woman officer in her 90's who kept being called back to active duty because of her computer expertise. In those situations, there are waivers for age.

 

[Daredevel7]

If he was retired from the Army, how could he be on active duty at the same time? That's double dipping.

I don't remember the specifics, but it has to do with retire from the Army as a soldier or something AND working for the Army as a civilian. I am not sure how the whole thing works. I could be wrong. I just remember he had 3 sources of income by working for the government AFTER retirement from the Army.

 

[Reba]

I don't remember the specifics, but it has to do with retire from the Army as a soldier or something AND working for the Army as a civilian. I am not sure how the whole thing works. I could be wrong. I just remember he had 3 sources of income by working for the government AFTER retirement from the Army.

OIC. Yes, a person can retire from the military, then be hired into the Civil Service. That's common.

 

[Tousi]

OIC. Yes, a person can retire from the military, then be hired into the Civil Service. That's common.

Right, same thing applies to me as regards my retirement from the State of California so long as I observe an earnings limitation unless I wanna pay 50% taxes above that limit. Oh, and when I turn 66, my full retirement age, the sky will be the limit as regards that.

 

[LuciaDisturbed]

He must have special skills that the military needs. I knew a woman officer in her 90's who kept being called back to active duty because of her computer expertise. In those situations, there are waivers for age.

A 90 year old computer geek? Awesome. I want to know more about this woman!

 

[Reba]

A 90 year old computer geek? Awesome. I want to know more about this woman!

Oops, she was in her 80's, and died in 1992. My mistake transposing the numbers. Still, she was impressive. I met and interviewed her in the 1970's. She was cool. She wore a granny hairnet under her uniform cover (hat).

US People--Hopper, Grace Murray.

 

[Bottesini]

Oops, she was in her 80's, and died in 1992. My mistake transposing the numbers. Still, she was impressive. I met and interviewed her in the 1970's. She was cool. She wore a granny hairnet under her uniform cover (hat).

US People--Hopper, Grace Murray.

That is amazing and inspiring. Obviously some people have a lot to contribute past age 65.

 

[Reba]

That is amazing and inspiring. Obviously some people have a lot to contribute past age 65.

Yep.

 

[Steel X]

If he was retired from the Army, how could he be on active duty at the same time? That's double dipping.

Workers pay into SS, so they earn the right to collect that.

He must have special skills that the military needs. I knew a woman officer in her 90's who kept being called back to active duty because of her computer expertise. In those situations, there are waivers for age.

A woman in her 80s with computer skills? This is rather something...

never met anyone who grew up from afew generations ago to be an expert with computers lol.

 

[Daredevel7]

Oops, she was in her 80's, and died in 1992. My mistake transposing the numbers. Still, she was impressive. I met and interviewed her in the 1970's. She was cool. She wore a granny hairnet under her uniform cover (hat).

US People--Hopper, Grace Murray.

wow, she's my hero! I am so impressed!

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Oops, she was in her 80's, and died in 1992. My mistake transposing the numbers. Still, she was impressive. I met and interviewed her in the 1970's. She was cool. She wore a granny hairnet under her uniform cover (hat).

US People--Hopper, Grace Murray.

wow, she is something... I can't image to work until 80 or more... .. wow...

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Yes, I support retirement at age 65. Before that, was 60, now up to 65... I do wish they decrease from 65 to 60 years old.

Why? because of improve unemployment rates. The young workers/employees should have jobs.

I cannot image to work until die... I prefer to enjoy my retirement and use my time for hobby with monthly pension money, I work for years to pay pension insurance.

 

[Reba]

More:

Biography - Rear Admiral Grace Murray Hopper, USN

...Upon graduation, she was commissioned a LTJG [Lieutenant (junior grade)] and ordered to the Bureau of Ordnance Computation Project at Harvard University. There she became the first programmer on the Navy's Mark I computer, the mechanical miracle of its day. Hopper's love of gadgets caused her to immediately fall for the biggest gadget she'd ever seen, the fifty-one foot long, 8 foot high, 8 foot wide, glass-encased mound of bulky relays, switches and vacuum tubes called the Mark I. This miracle of modern science could store 72 words and perform three additions every second.

Hopper's love affair with the Mark I ended in a few short years when the UNIVAC I [Universal Automatic Computer], operating a thousand times faster, won her affections.

In 1946 Hopper was released from active duty and joined the Harvard Faculty at the Computation Laboratory where her work continued on the Mark II and Mark III computers for the Navy. In 1949 she joined the Eckert-Mauchly Computer Corporation in Philadelphia, later called Sperry Rand, where she designed the first commercial large-scale electronic computer called the UNIVAC I.

She changed the lives of everyone in the computer industry by developing the Bomarc system, later called COBOL (common-business-oriented language). COBOL made it possible for computers to respond to words rather than numbers. Hopper often jokingly explained, "It really came about because I couldn't balance my checkbook." She's also credited with coining the term bug when she traced an error in the Mark II to a moth trapped in a relay. The bug was carefully removed and taped to a daily log book. Since then, whenever a computer has a problem, it's referred to as a bug.

 

[Daredevel7]

I think I have a girl crush on her...