Info on STEM CELLS from scientific source

I showed the youtube video to my dad:

Chloe, a student in California lost her hearing 3 years ago due to a cold. She got another cold and lost more hearing in the other ear. Her hearing loss became progressive. Her parents are doctors. They both work in a hospital and none of the doctors could restore her hearing initally. They believed the hearing loss is autoimmune related. She was fitted with the best HAs bilaterally(both ears) to amplify her residual hearing. Later on(3 years after she lost her hearing), the doctors discussed stem cells with Chloe's parents. It was assured that using her own stem cells was 100% safe even though it was experimental. She was a success case and no longer wears HAs. One ear is at 50% of normal and the other ear is at 90% of normal. Music sounds great, especially in her better ear. She is so happy to be able to hear again!

My comments: I can't find anything about converting % HL to db HL. I did find that the cutoff for normal hearing is 25db HL. So it's likley her good ear is hearing at 25-35db PTA and her bad ear is probably at 50-60db HL or a moderate HL. She could benefit from a HA in the bad ear, but chooses not to wear HAs. Her good ear is good enough that she hears plenty without needing HA. Someone will need to email that clinic or her parents and find out her before and after audiogram or at least what db was her loss before and after? Regardless, such a drastic improvement that hearing is functional without HAs gets me and my dad very excited! I look forward to the day of hearing better. I have realistic expectations as ive mentioned many times.

Her case serves as evidence that stem cells has the ability to regenerate hair cells NOW and give near normal unaided hearing! Not everyone will achieve an improvement as drastic as she and improvement may not be the same for both ears. It's possible if she got a 2nd round of stem cells, she could achieve additional improvements in her worse ear. Ive been reading stem cell studies on animals and while none get down to 0db perfect hearing, the improvements are huge and on the order of 30, 40, 50db! The animal studies show that the more residual hearing that is saved, the better your hearing will be. Those with plenty of residual hearing are getting down to near normal hearing which is on the order of 20-35db loss compared to their hearing before it was destroyed with sounds or ototoxins. I could get down to near normal hearing at 250Hz and below and in the mid and high frequencies, my hearing could be anywhere from 50db HL to 100db HL because I have virtually no residual hearing at 1000Hz and above. I plan to use transposition if I don't have enough high frequency hearing.

My chances of being able to get stem cells in the very near future are high. I am just waiting for more pioneers to have gone ahead and report their results. I want an idea of how much improvement to expect and also stem cell technology is moving fast, it surely will be better tomorrow than it's today. The evidence of stem cell's success is rapidly growing and I look forward to seeing more results by the other pioneers who are going ahead. I may decide to go ahead sometime in 2012, but could be much sooner depending how many pioneers are going to be getting stem cells in 2010(next year) and how great their results are.
 
DD,

Why is it better to have a 100db loss in the highs (which you claim is possible) than to be able to hear at 30db across all frequencies? I don't see how that is an improvement...
 
faire_jour said:
DD,

Why is it better to have a 100db loss in the highs (which you claim is possible) than to be able to hear at 30db across all frequencies? I don't see how that is an improvement...
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Me neither. It is better to have a 30db across all frequencies.....

You would not be able to hear much not even with a 100db loss in the highs
 
DeafLissa90 said:
Me neither. It is better to have a 30db across all frequencies.....
You would not be able to hear much not even with a 100db loss in the highs
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The next step is for me to research the extent of how much stem cells can improve hearing. At this point, it's known that stem cells works on humans, is available now and the regenerated hair cells function great! I also have realistic expectations and will be happy with as little as 20db improvement.

1257630208079796800.jpg


30-40db improvement would get me to 0db in the lows and normal hearing in most frequencies. Ill hear environmental sounds similar to a hearing person and hear speech much better than CI, but still a little below that of a hearing person. My aided audiogram after stem cells could be better than what my dad hears unaided. If stem cells gets me to only 100db in the highs, ill just enable transposition to get me to better than 30db across.

kokonut said:
She has regained more hearing. That's the key point.
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I would be very surprised if stem cells gives me or most people enough hearing to not need HAs. Her results could be exceptional for all we know. We would need to see results from at least a dozen others to further determine the extent of the improvement. Ive researched the improvement in animal models and have come to the conclusion that the audiogram above reflects average improvement after stem cells. I would have a moderate to severe HL and be aided to normal dipping down to mild in the highest frequencies. This is a limitation of HA's gain.
 
deafdude1 said:
The next step is for me to research the extent of how much stem cells can improve hearing. At this point, it's known that stem cells works on humans, is available now and the regenerated hair cells function great! I also have realistic expectations and will be happy with as little as 20db improvement.

1257630208079796800.jpg


30-40db improvement would get me to 0db in the lows and normal hearing in most frequencies. Ill hear environmental sounds similar to a hearing person and hear speech much better than CI, but still a little below that of a hearing person. My aided audiogram aft
er stem cells could be better than what my dad hears unaided. If stem cells gets me to only 100db in the highs, ill just enable transposition to get me to better than 30db across.



I would be very surprised if stem cells gives me or most people enough hearing to not need HAs. Her results could be exceptional for all we know. We would need to see results from at least a dozen others to further determine the extent of the improvement. Ive researched the improvement in animal models and have come to the conclusion that the audiogram above reflects average improvement after stem cells. I would have a moderate to severe HL and be aided to normal dipping down to mild in the highest frequencies. This is a limitation of HA's gain.
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Is even 0db possible????? Won't 0db be useless since that's no noise??
I know you said you want stem cells. But why pay all that money then find out they won't work for you. Why are you so desparate to hear? Hearing's not all that great. It's just hearing the world.
 
DeafLissa90 said:
Is even 0db possible????? Won't 0db be useless since that's no noise??
I know you said you want stem cells. But why pay all that money then find out they won't work for you. Why are you so desparate to hear? Hearing's not all that great. It's just hearing the world.
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0db does not mean no noise, just the threshold of "perfect" hearing. There are no guarantees in life. CI doesn't always work and stem cells don't always work either. If stem cells don't work, I still keep my residual hearing. I want to hear for the same reason you are getting CI to hear better. We discussed our choices. CI is your choice, stem cells are mine.
 
I got your PM. I guess that's your thread here.

Are you flying to Korea for your surgery? The stem-cell was started at University of Washington. But, the original is from Virginia Merrill Bloedel Hearing Research Center. I think that you might want to read these links for yourself because it's in the U.S. It is nothing wrong with the foreign country... I found some of these links a couple of years ago, and the links are still active.

Home

https://depts.washington.edu/iscrm/research/areas/regeneration.php

Do No Harm: The Coalition of Americans for Research Ethics

The biggest problem is that health industrials are stealing the money from the government's fund or someone's fund. Some of them do lie to us for many ways to make us believe that it works, or it causes a cancer, or even telling us that it does not work due twist the money situation. I want to avoid to write the long details here. No easy so we need to get a hard proof and look up a company's background information before you decide to get your surgery.
 
No responsible audiologist will aid you to 0 db. It just won't happen.

Plus, how bad do you think the highs will sound, cranked all the way up and full of distortion, if you are at a mild loss in the lows?
 
you know, my older sister is the same way. She told me she loves her hearing aids, and is against CI. Then later told me that She rather wait til stem cell come out.

I've come to conclusion that people who keep pushing stem cells are really anti-CI and they really doing it so people will delay CI longer (because hope is on the way!). Nothing wrong with that, but I've learned to take them a grain of salt (or whatever the saying is)

She even went as far as comparing a friend with CI to Hearing aids to see how much they can hear. Then she reported back it to me as CI is terrible thing.. and this was AFTER I have my CI. She is trying to get me to hate my CI or be anti-CI
 
An article about commercial stem-cell clinics:

The Shady Side of Embryonic Stem Cell Therapy

Caveat Emptor.

Credible research is being done at universities. I know that a local medical school is conducting stem cell studies for heart disease (adult stem cells). It will be interesting to hear the results.
 
What exactly are your credentials, stemcelldeaf? I don't take advice from random people on the internet. Why should I give any credibility to an actuary and insurance business person on the subject of stem cell treatment? Claiming to cure everything is a red flag of quackery. You're a medical tourism broker? Do you just visit forums for various conditions and post this? :hmm:
 
sallylou said:
What exactly are your credentials, stemcelldeaf? I don't take advice from random people on the internet. Why should I give any credibility to an actuary and insurance business person on the subject of stem cell treatment? Claiming to cure everything is a red flag of quackery. You're a medical tourism broker? Do you just visit forums for various conditions and post this? :hmm:
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I was wondering if it was spam or not.
 
faire_jour said:
DD,

Why is it better to have a 100db loss in the highs (which you claim is possible) than to be able to hear at 30db across all frequencies? I don't see how that is an improvement...
Click to expand...

I used to have 100db loss on my 1998 audiogram and was hearing at 35db with HAs! Todays HAs with 70db gain can aid a 100db HL down to 30db! I also have the option of transposition.

faire_jour said:
No responsible audiologist will aid you to 0 db. It just won't happen.

Plus, how bad do you think the highs will sound, cranked all the way up and full of distortion, if you are at a mild loss in the lows?
Click to expand...

I will need a very good reason for a refusal to get me to 0db if it's possible to begin with. It's like not correcting someone to 20/20 with glasses unless there's a very good reason. I talked to someone with the 2nd best CI result that ive seen and she's at 0db in one frequency and at 5db in a few other frequencies. She says her audiologist programmed her CI according to how much she choose to hear. This also caused her to understand speech better than the vast majority of those with CI. I do want to note that for most people, it's not even possible to get to 5db. They are able to get to around 30db and if their CI is programmed for more, they still hear at 30db. I will do the same when getting my HAs programmed as I choose to hear the best possible. How well I hear with HAs has to do with how much residual hearing I have after stem cells plus the 70db gain my HAs can dish out.

Second of all, ive been looking at other audiograms and low pass filters and good hearing in the lows makes a really huge difference in how loud you hear, how much you hear and how much speech you understand. A mild loss in the lows sloping to profound in the highs can give aided speech better than a CI from my research. In fact, even unaided speech can be quite good. Id love to be able to hear unaided, it's useful for some situations. Distortion is subjective. For you, im sure itll sound bad because you are comparing it to normal hearing. For me, stem cells will be the best hearing I ever had in my life and the distortion will be so much less than now.

Lighthouse77 said:
you know, my older sister is the same way. She told me she loves her hearing aids, and is against CI. Then later told me that She rather wait til stem cell come out.

I've come to conclusion that people who keep pushing stem cells are really anti-CI and they really doing it so people will delay CI longer (because hope is on the way!). Nothing wrong with that, but I've learned to take them a grain of salt (or whatever the saying is)

She even went as far as comparing a friend with CI to Hearing aids to see how much they can hear. Then she reported back it to me as CI is terrible thing.. and this was AFTER I have my CI. She is trying to get me to hate my CI or be anti-CI
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She has the right to choose stem cells. This is what I am choosing and the wait isn't much longer! CI is terrible for some people and excellent for some people. Don't let her put you down for your CI choice. Try discussing why you got CI with her and how much you hear with CI. If she hears with HAs better than you hear with CI, perhaps she doesn't need to spend tens of thousands on stem cells? But if she still wants stem cells, it's her choice and money and I respect this.
 
Actually, Deafdude, according to S. Gerber, 1978,

250-1000 hz carries 80% of the energy of sound, but only 20% of the intelligibilty

Whereas

1500-6000 hz carries 20% of the energy and 80% of intelligibilty.

You have it perfectly backward.
 
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