do you think downs sydromes should be in Deaf school deaf unit?

CSign said:
Absolutely. That doesn't prove anything though. :)
Most people who are posting in opposition are doing it from the standpoint that these students would be mainstreamed all day. The fact is that most would be mainstreamed for only part of the day. In the subjects that they would benefit from.

People really should do more research as to how things actually work here before making such blanket statements.
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I rest my case.

It is all about what kind of resources are available or not. Teachers alone cannot carry all the responsibilities of meeting different students' needs all alone. They need the resources and support and if they aren't available then everyone loses out.
 
shel90 said:
I rest my case.

It is all about what kind of resources are available or not. Teachers alone cannot carry all the responsibilities of meeting different students' needs all alone. They need the resources and support and if they aren't available then everyone loses out.
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AMEN! That's why inclusion in general as a wholesale educational policy is bad.....and it's bad for ALL kinds of low incidence disabilties! Mainstream teachers have a hard enough time teaching a regular mix of kids.........Plus most mainstream teachers really don't have extensive training on how to teach low incidence kids. About the only good thing about wholesale mainstreaming/ inclusion is that kids with spina bifida or CP or other mobilty issues aren't shuttled off to a Crippled Children's School any more.
Partial mainstreaming can be a good option for SOME high functioning mentally disabled/nereologically affected kids. But it needs to be VERY strictly and carefully done with mentally disabled students (whether low IQ, more learning disablity or autism) I also think it needs to be done with the understanding that while it might be benifical for some kids, it's not going to get the kid on par.....it will be good for the kid, but won't turn them into some SuperHigh Achiever. I think too there needs to be a failsafe to ensure that a kid isn't being placed in a sitution due to a parent trying to make themselves feel "YAY my kid is "normal"
 
shel90 said:
I rest my case.

It is all about what kind of resources are available or not. Teachers alone cannot carry all the responsibilities of meeting different students' needs all alone. They need the resources and support and if they aren't available then everyone loses out.
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yeah thats what happened to some of us, and they did order something special for anyones needs while we got old fashion stuff to study with since they dont have much money for supplies etc.
 
Bottesini said:
It's pretty succinct. What do you have trouble understanding?
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I wouldn't presume to know what goes on in the minds of people. This is why I asked her to post her thoughts, rather than a random post from an author.

So, FriskyFeline... What are your thoughts? Or, what was your intention with posting that quote?

Taking it at face value, that is a very negative thing to post.

Your child is deaf. But have no hope for a positive future, for that is denying reality.

Your wife has cancer. But have no hope she will beat it, for that is denying reality.

Your husband has a life threatening disease. But have no hope he will survive, for that is denying reality.

Catch my drift?
 
shel90 said:
I rest my case.

It is all about what kind of resources are available or not. Teachers alone cannot carry all the responsibilities of meeting different students' needs all alone. They need the resources and support and if they aren't available then everyone loses out.
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LOL. Ok. Whatever helps you sleep at night.
 
CSign said:
I wouldn't presume to know what goes on in the minds of people. This is why I asked her to post her thoughts, rather than a random post from an author.

So, FriskyFeline... What are your thoughts? Or, what was your intention with posting that quote?

Taking it at face value, that is a very negative thing to post.

Your child is deaf. But have no hope for a positive future, for that is denying reality.

Your wife has cancer. But have no hope she will beat it, for that is denying reality.

Your husband has a life threatening disease. But have no hope he will survive, for that is denying reality.

Catch my drift?
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I have my moments. Thank you. :wave:
 
CSign said:
LOL. Ok. Whatever helps you sleep at night.
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You seem bound and determined to demonize us about dhh mental disabilty kids in a dhh mainstream classroom. In some rare cases, yes a mentally disabled kid might benifit from partial inclusion....but again you have to be super SUPER careful with this population (and I include kids with signifnificent nereological issues) What is so hard to understand that kids with mental disabilties may not be able to keep up in a mainstream classroom?
 
CSign said:
LOL. Ok. Whatever helps you sleep at night.
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Do you teach a classroom full of special needs kids gonna daily basis? Before I became I teacher, I had no idea ..just like many of u do.

The kids deserve to have the resources and well-trained staff so their needs can be met. That's how I can sleep at night. Because I know from hands on experience. It is not about the parents' needs...it is about the children's needs.

I hope you are able to sleep well at nights.
 
shel90 said:
Do you teach a classroom full of special needs kids gonna daily basis? Before I became I teacher, I had no idea ..just like many of u do.

The kids deserve to have the resources and well-trained staff so their needs can be met. That's how I can sleep at night. Because I know from hands on experience. It is not about the parents' needs...it is about the children's needs.

I hope you are able to sleep well at nights.
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THIS. THIS totally! Lots more to say but need to run....shall post more later!
 
shel90 said:
Do you teach a classroom full of special needs kids gonna daily basis? Before I became I teacher, I had no idea ..just like many of u do.

The kids deserve to have the resources and well-trained staff so their needs can be met. That's how I can sleep at night. Because I know from hands on experience. It is not about the parents' needs...it is about the children's needs.

I hope you are able to sleep well at nights.
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I'm back. And I am nodding here. We are not taking a Republican " oh those kids are useless and shouldn't be educated" way of thinking. Neither are we proposing a "leave the mentally handicapped/autistic kids in the attic approach. Inclusion and mainstreaming oppertunties tend to be championed by parents who are caught in a Warm and Fuzzy "oh my kid is gonna benifit SO much from being with the hearing/normal IQ/nereotypical kids" approach. It sounds awesome, but again it can be very difficult to meet the needs of mentally disabled and autistic kids in a mainstream classroom (whether it be a deaf school or a hearing mainstream classroom) SOME kids who are more on a nereologically affected functioning level MIGHT benifit from partial inclusion. Heck, I know of Down's kids who have gone to college.....But then again, I have also known Downs kids who can't even function at a community college or who struggle at a day program.
 
CSign, why are you so offended at the idea that mentally disabled kids may need a specialized placement for ALL of the day?
Yes, there are some HF mentally disabled kids, who would fit in very well in some "just dhh" classes, but most of them are still going to STRONGLY lag behind the "just dhh" kids. And I mean strongly......I remember vividly doing an activity with some people with my syndrome. I kept getting paired up with people who were very affected and didn't even KNOW what was going on.....Yes, I know not all mentally disabled folks are like that.....
I also think that a lot of parents are overestimating the value of the mainstream.......
 
deafdyke said:
CSign, why are you so offended at the idea that mentally disabled kids may need a specialized placement for ALL of the day?
Yes, there are some HF mentally disabled kids, who would fit in very well in some "just dhh" classes, but most of them are still going to STRONGLY lag behind the "just dhh" kids. And I mean strongly......I remember vividly doing an activity with some people with my syndrome. I kept getting paired up with people who were very affected and didn't even KNOW what was going on.....Yes, I know not all mentally disabled folks are like that.....
I also think that a lot of parents are overestimating the value of the mainstream.......
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Everybody how about doing those of us that read your posts and putting a blank line between paragraphs? It would make those posts so much easier to read.
 
Jane B. said:
Everybody how about doing those of us that read your posts and putting a blank line between paragraphs? It would make those posts so much easier to read.
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there's not even a single paragraph here ....*confused*
 
shel90 said:
Do you teach a classroom full of special needs kids gonna daily basis? Before I became I teacher, I had no idea ..just like many of u do.

The kids deserve to have the resources and well-trained staff so their needs can be met. That's how I can sleep at night. Because I know from hands on experience. It is not about the parents' needs...it is about the children's needs.

I hope you are able to sleep well at nights.
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Shel, I'm wondering.....do you also hold the same position about autistic (and not just talking about "oh they have "social issues" so that automaticly means high functioning autistic/Aspergers "autistic) and behavorial kids as well? I think CSign thinks that we're delibratly excluding mentally disabled children. Like" oh we don't want THOSE kids in our classroom!" Nope.
Other kids with additional specialized educational needs also may need a specialized program.
And yes, I agree 100% with you. Inclusion sounds good.....but due to the fact that kids with additional special needs function differently, then "just dhh", usually it doesn't work out that well.
 
And indeed CSign, if you had real honest to god experiance actually TEACHING you would most likely understand. It seems to be a case of theory seeming to be better then the actual practice.
 
deafdyke said:
I'm back. And I am nodding here. We are not taking a Republican " oh those kids are useless and shouldn't be educated" way of thinking.
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A) Political discussion is banned

B) What you have described is not a viewpoint of any party.
 
deafdyke said:
CSign, why are you so offended at the idea that mentally disabled kids may need a specialized placement for ALL of the day?
Yes, there are some HF mentally disabled kids, who would fit in very well in some "just dhh" classes, but most of them are still going to STRONGLY lag behind the "just dhh" kids. And I mean strongly......I remember vividly doing an activity with some people with my syndrome. I kept getting paired up with people who were very affected and didn't even KNOW what was going on.....Yes, I know not all mentally disabled folks are like that.....
I also think that a lot of parents are overestimating the value of the mainstream.......
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What are you even talking about?!?!

Why don't we stop lumping students with cognitive challenges in one group? Is it such a difficult thing to understand that perhaps students have varying needs and abilities, and would benefit from mainstream placement, even if for only part of the day?

You really need to stop acting like you know how parents think. You don't.
 
deafdyke said:
Shel, I'm wondering.....do you also hold the same position about autistic (and not just talking about "oh they have "social issues" so that automaticly means high functioning autistic/Aspergers "autistic) and behavorial kids as well? I think CSign thinks that we're delibratly excluding mentally disabled children. Like" oh we don't want THOSE kids in our classroom!" Nope.
Other kids with additional specialized educational needs also may need a specialized program.
And yes, I agree 100% with you. Inclusion sounds good.....but due to the fact that kids with additional special needs function differently, then "just dhh", usually it doesn't work out that well.
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Actually, yes. People have essentially stated/implied that children with cognitive challenges shouldn't be mainstreamed. Go back and re-read some threads.
 
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