CPS teacher strike and Illinois area....

TXgolfer said:
You realize that both of your links disprove the bold, right? You give an absolute, yet one link says it "may or may not" and another link says some states DO hold private schools to the same requirements.
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It actually disproves more of your claim than mine....

While some private schools require teachers to be certified, many do not.
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TXgolfer said:
They are free to go. *shrug*
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sorry that my post has burst your bubble. your fast-talk gimmick didn't sell quite well.... and it's actually a very expensive problem.
 
Jiro said:
sorry that my post has burst your bubble. your fast-talk gimmick didn't sell quite well.... and it's actually a very expensive problem.
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*shrug* Only an idiot would stay in a job where they are unhappy with the workload AND compensation. Bullying is hardly a good example for the children. As I stated earlier.....disgusting.
 
TXgolfer said:
private school accreditation - Google Search

in fact if the school is not accredited the student often has additional hurdles for college admission.
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not even a problem if that non-accredited private schools have solid reputations :lol:

TXgolfer said:
For example...

https://www.admissions.uga.edu/article/home-educated-or-non-accredited-high-school.html
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I'm not seeing anything in there that said private schools are legally required by state to be accredited...... it's their choice to get accredited or not.
 
Jiro said:
I'm not seeing anything in there that said private schools are legally required by state to be accredited...... it's their choice to get accredited or not.
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Never said they were.
 
New Jersey Private School Directory
New Jersey Private Schools: 1,297
Number of Private School Students: 240,555
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New Jersey Public Schools: 2,481
Number of Students: 1,380,753
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According to http://www.advanc-ed.org/oasis2/u/par/search , it shows that there are only 8 private high schools and 65 private elementary schools that are accredited....


Illinois Private School Directory
Illinois Private Schools: 1,491
Number of Private School Students: 294,924
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Illinois Public Schools: 4,493
Number of Students: 2,100,403
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and there are 70 private high schools and 50 private elementary schools that are accredited... and 155 public high schools and 16 public elementary schools that are accredited...

Polly must be lying to you on purpose for not feeding her a cracker...... :aw:

In case you didn't know, most public schools are not accredited....
 
Jiro said:
Q&A: What's behind the Chicago teachers' strike? - CNN.com
Q. Why are teachers objecting to evaluations tied to performance?
A. The union says student performance is directly linked to conditions in the home or neighborhood, making it unfair for teachers to be punished if students don't do well in the the classroom for those reasons.

Q. How many jobs will be lost under the evaluation plan?
A. As many as 6,000 teachers could lose their jobs under the evaluation system, according to CTU President Karen Lewis, who has called the system "unacceptable." The mayor's office, the city and school officials have questioned that job-loss figure.

Q. How is the public reacting to the strike?
A. The reaction is predictably mixed in the pro-union town. Parents have had to juggle work schedules and lay out money for child care, but many remain supportive of the union's action.
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Those are the things I am concerned about.

Nowadays, parents are too lazy to have any part in their kids education. When kids go wrong in school, the parents are too quick to blame the teachers. The higher-ups will take the side of the parents and not the teachers. So, that makes the teachers underappreciated.

The evaluation system is also bad. I'm in a similar situation myself (not as a teacher). I have an unsupervised position with my employer. My performance is based on numbers that my client and employer receive from the places I work at. No matter how hard I work, the numbers don't reflect that. It reflects what customers buy. If sales figures are low, I get frowned upon. It actually improves my evaluation when my supervisor actually works with me (during random work-withs) and sees the hard work I go through and realizes what's really going on. Unfortunately, there's a high and fast turnover rate for my supervisors... a new supervisor every 6 months. So, it's back to square one each time. :(

In this situation, if parents don't like their children's report cards... they quickly blame the teachers. Look at the numbers, see poor evaluation scores... I guess the teachers are really bad. NOT!
 
Jiro said:
New Jersey Private School Directory



According to http://www.advanc-ed.org/oasis2/u/par/search , it shows that there are only 8 private high schools and 65 private elementary schools that are accredited....


Illinois Private School Directory


and there are 70 private high schools and 50 private elementary schools that are accredited... and 155 public high schools and 16 public elementary schools that are accredited...

Polly must be lying to you on purpose for not feeding her a cracker...... :aw:

In case you didn't know, most public schools are not accredited....
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:lol:
A) AdvancED is only one of many accrediting bodies
B) If your statement were true (and it's not) Universities would not make statements like these...

Each year, the University of Georgia receives applications for admission from students who are educated at home. Occasionally, we also have applicants who attend non-accredited high schools. Per the Board of Regents of the University System of Georgia (USG), students who are home educated or who attend a non-accredited high school must satisfy certain criteria in order to be considered for admission to any public two- or four-year college or university in Georgia.
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https://www.admissions.uga.edu/article/home-educated-or-non-accredited-high-school.html

Alternative Admission
The UO welcomes applications from students who have not met the standard admission requirements or have graduated from nonaccredited high schools. Below are the factors that will be considered in assessing applications for alternative admission.
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Alternative Admission | Admissions

Non-Accredited High Schools
Graduates of non-accredited high schools must have a minimum ACT of 26 or SAT (Reading + Math) of 1180 and must meet the course unit requirements as outlined in the general admission requirements.
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Additional Admission Categories : Welcome to Undergraduate Admissions : Texas State University
 
TracyK said:
4) In addition to health benefits, salary, safety, and evaluation requirements, Chicago teachers are being asked to extend the teaching day by 90 minutes AND add 10 additional days of school. Originally, this additional work time was to be imposed with NO change in wages. 180 days * 90 minutes = 16,200 minutes/270 hours PLUS 10 additional school days. Essentially this is a pay cut for all teachers.
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That's something I don't agree with. That is like your boss asking you to clock out, but stay an extra hour so you can do extra work.

My "education friends" are paid based on a specific number of days a year. Yet, they are asked to come in and spend their extra time preparing the rooms before school start. Some of the things they're expected to do forces them to work 12-hour days just to get ready. This happens often (usually before Open House or before PTA meetings).
TracyK said:
7) The pitfall of viewing a K-12 education as free child care (which admittedly many parents do) is that we compare teachers to the role of babysitter. This diminishes the professional respect for teachers, and diminishes their perceived value to society.
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This is a major turn-off for me... especially with hearing parents of deaf children. There are a lot of hearing parents around here who just stick their deaf children with CIs and dump them in school like it's a daycare. They don't even bother to learn sign language or have any part in their kids' lives. They actually give their hearing children more attention than their deaf children.
TracyK said:
9) Teachers spend more time with MOST people's children than the children's own parents. They have the capability to mold our future. We need to support them and compensate them accordingly. We need to acknowledge the work they do and how difficult it is. They are on the front lines. A couple of weeks ago, in my small Illinois town, a HS student brought a gun and shot it in the classroom. A teacher saved the lives of many by subduing the student, he is a first year teacher making 28K. To even see the other side of 70K, he will have to teach for 35 years, and keep going to school to get more than a modest annual raise.
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That's what disappoints me. They're getting so low of an income that it will take them forever to pay off their college loans. :(

I have friends who are teachers in special education. Some of the kids they work with have serious behavior problems. Those behavior problems are bad enough that it stresses those teachers out physically and mentally. They don't even have enough people helping them out. Yet, they get paid the same as those teachers who are with regular kids.
TracyK said:
11) Look at the salaries of coaches in college compared to professors. What is celebrated in schools? Sports success! How many extra curricular sporting events vs. academic events? How many hours does the average parent spend taking kids to camp, practice, games vs hours spent on homework?
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That's unfortunate... especially when alumnus make donations based on game wins and not the school's improved education.
TracyK said:
13) Basing a teacher's pay on the students' test performance only addresses one contributing factor of academic success. Other factors: socioeconomic status (many of the Chicago students are well below poverty level), parental involvement, academic materials available BOTH in and outside of class, reading level (yes you could have a student testing in YOUR 7th grade class who is reading below grade level SIGNIFICANTLY - you get them and they impact YOUR evaluation).... the list goes on.
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That's what I'm concerned about. My parents did their part and made sure I did what I was supposed to do. If I failed, it was MY fault... not my parents. (I actually failed a semester of English and had to take summer school to make up for it.)

It's good to hear these things from an actual teacher. I have friends that work in the education field and know how they feel based on what they tell me. Sometimes, they just sit there full of frustration and pour out everything from their stressful day at work. At the end, I feel helpless. :(
 
TXgolfer said:
:lol:
A) AdvancED is only one of many accrediting bodies
B) If your statement were true (and it's not) Universities would not make statements like these...



https://www.admissions.uga.edu/article/home-educated-or-non-accredited-high-school.html



Alternative Admission | Admissions



Additional Admission Categories : Welcome to Undergraduate Admissions : Texas State University
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Middle States Commission is one of the 6 biggest accreditation agencies.

According to MSCSS, only 193 public high schools, 101 private high schools and 251 "religious denomination high schools" are accredited in NJ. Those schools including mine that are accredited are typically on top 50-100 best schools in the state. As for rest.... they're not accredited.

You're still failing to prove your claim. All you do is jester around and poke a hole in any way you can without proving your own claim.

Another fact for you - there is no federal regulation or federally recognized list of accreditation agencies for secondary education.... only higher education. So each state has its own criteria for its own public schools and it's up to them to get accredited by regional accreditation agencies or not.
 
Kids are back in school today - the real problems haven't gone away

VamPyroX said:
That's something I don't agree with. That is like your boss asking you to clock out, but stay an extra hour so you can do extra work.
:(
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:ty: Thanks for taking the time to read my post - I can be rather verbose :giggle:

I am thrilled to see Chicago kids back in school; I will be more thrilled when we address the BIG issues related to education. I do NOT have the answers, but their are so many people smarter than me in this country - I hope we can get some of them together and solve the problems in our school system.

The way I see it the problems are:

1) How we fund schools (through property taxes) which result in significant differences between communities (low value property=less school money). Read Jonathon KozolSavage Inequalities to get a very sad view of this.

2) Parental involvement. This is a big one and really has more to do with available time. As long as we MUST have two working parents in a family to live and companies that do not give adequate personal time (see Europe for more family/school friendly working hours) parents will not have the ability to be involved at a level necessary.

3) Lack of social norms and niceties of the past - respecting our elders, respecting authority, respecting ALL others, respecting ourselves, and respecting property (obviously a brief list).

4) Sustainable no tolerance policies. Public schools need the ability to remove anyone who negatively impacts the learning environment, permanently, if necessary. This needs to be supported by parents, teachers, administrators, and everyone else.

5) Finally, year round schooling. This is not a popular stance, BUT, if teachers worked year round the public would more likely be able to view
Just my thoughts - Chicago kids may be back in school :applause: but the issue remains an elephant in the room..... :hmm:
 
TracyK said:
The way I see it the problems are:

1) How we fund schools (through property taxes) which result in significant differences between communities (low value property=less school money). Read Jonathon KozolSavage Inequalities to get a very sad view of this.
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Yes, this is a problem. There should be at least some kind of national base provision for necessities, and then let the higher property areas add frills.

2) Parental involvement. This is a big one and really has more to do with available time. As long as we MUST have two working parents in a family to live and companies that do not give adequate personal time (see Europe for more family/school friendly working hours) parents will not have the ability to be involved at a level necessary.
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I'm kind of torn on this one. One group of students that has historically seemed to be successful in America have been the first generations of immigrants. Their parents were poor, often segregated from the general community, didn't speak English, and worked long, hard hours away from home. Their parents never got "personal time" from work, and they rarely could help their kids with the homework. So, what happened? How did those poor immigrant neighborhoods turn out so many successful Americans?

On the other side, away from urban poverty is rural poverty and lack of opportunities. My dad grew up on a Depression-era Indiana farm, raised mostly by his poor grandparents. He attended a one-room rural school house until high school. Then he traveled a long commute for that school. He eventually got his bachelor's degree in three years in electrical engineering, and worked for Bell Labs, Lockheed, various Navy aeronautical commands, and NASA. He acquired a few patents and innovation bonuses along the way.

It wasn't just him. Many of his coworkers of his generation had similar backgrounds. They didn't have much parental help, and they usually carried their own workload on the farm in addition to doing school work. So, what is the difference between then and now? :hmm:

Even in my generation, my parents didn't help me with homework. It was my "job." My parents divorced, my mom had to work, and money was very tight. It never occurred to me that they were responsible for my success or failure.

:dunno:

3) Lack of social norms and niceties of the past - respecting our elders, respecting authority, respecting ALL others, respecting ourselves, and respecting property (obviously a brief list).
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Yes, that is a major problem, across the board.

4) Sustainable no tolerance policies. Public schools need the ability to remove anyone who negatively impacts the learning environment, permanently, if necessary. This needs to be supported by parents, teachers, administrators, and everyone else.
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Some of these no tolerance policies are nonsensical. The principals should be allowed to exercise some wisdom and discretion in discipline situations. They shouldn't have to call the police for back up every time a second grader points a spoon handle at another kid.

5) Finally, year round schooling. This is not a popular stance, BUT, if teachers worked year round the public would more likely be able to view
Just my thoughts - Chicago kids may be back in school :applause: but the issue remains an elephant in the room..... :hmm:
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I'm not sure about year-round schooling. Do the majority of teachers want that?

I'm curious why it takes more time (longer days and more days) to teach kids. Are they slower learners now?
 
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