Arizona-Mexico Border

Maria

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How come President Bush didn't do anythin' about it when they asked for help ? "Homeland Security" was made in law after 9/11 by President Bush. :smash:

http://www.kriseggle.org/border.htm
( News along with photos )
 
Because the fact of the matter is that if Bush ever engaged in a battle of wits with a box of rocks, the box of rocks would win.

Arizona Park "Most Dangerous" in U.S.

"Our budget isn't considered part of homeland defense, so it wasn't a priority," Thompson said, as he drove past the 20-foot (6-meter) hole in the border fence that Eggle's killer drove through. "But how long will it be until someone figures out that you could easily drive a semi-truck with a nuclear device through here?"
 
Levonian said:
Because the fact of the matter is that if Bush ever engaged in a battle of wits with a box of rocks, the box of rocks would win.

Arizona Park "Most Dangerous" in U.S.

I just read the link - It's sad to see many problems growin' in our country. I wonder if, Immigration is obsoleted already for United States ? It looks like to me that the President Bush already knew about 9/11 when it happened... do you think it could be related to Arizona-Mexico problem, because of terrorists are now all over the places ? I've noticed that many agencies/laws are gettin' weak ( ADA, Immigration, Constitution, and everythin' )... not like before in history.... leavin' us on our own to fight for our survival.
 
CyberRed said:
I just read the link - It's sad to see many problems growin' in our country.
I agree. And I don't think there is any one cause that can be pointed out. It is many things in combination.
CyberRed said:
I wonder if, Immigration is obsoleted already for United States ?
I believe that is getting to be the case. If something doesn't change, we will become as overcrowded, and with as reduced economic opportunity as mant poorer nations. Perhaps it is time to adopt stricter immigration policies. Many nations require a person to prove they bring with them resources to support themselves for over a year, and some, to post bond equal to a return air fare.
CyberRed said:
It looks like to me that the President Bush already knew about 9/11 when it happened... do you think it could be related to Arizona-Mexico problem, because of terrorists are now all over the places ?
I am dismayed at the number of people who think the office of President conveys the power to do all things. Like the European kings of old. His power is very limited. He cannot do anything that Congress disapproves of. He does not make law, or judge criminals, or make war. He can only propose those things. And while people may not agree with Mr. Bush, he is certainly not stupid. I seriously doubt there is one person reading this who could deal with all the foriegn governments, domestic special interest groups, special ceremonies, requests for intervention here and abroad, and on and on that the President has to deal with in a day's time. He is not a stupid man. Neither was Bill Clinton, no matter how much I personally disliked him. And people who ascribe all of the nation's woes to the President are clueless.
CyberRed said:

I've noticed that many agencies/laws are gettin' weak ( ADA, Immigration, Constitution, and everythin' )... not like before in history.... leavin' us on our own to fight for our survival.
I feel like that is because what free-thinkers want. Not just here, but world wide. The government and people of Mexico feel like (and openly state) that they have a right to come and go from here as they please. That we somehow OWE them a slice of our success. They are "entitled" they think. Entitlements. You owe me because I exist. The opposite end of the spectrum is personal responsibility. We are individually responsible for our decisions, our achievements, our lives.
 
CyberRed said:
I just read the link - It's sad to see many problems growin' in our country. I wonder if, Immigration is obsoleted already for United States ? It looks like to me that the President Bush already knew about 9/11 when it happened... do you think it could be related to Arizona-Mexico problem, because of terrorists are now all over the places ? I've noticed that many agencies/laws are gettin' weak ( ADA, Immigration, Constitution, and everythin' )... not like before in history.... leavin' us on our own to fight for our survival.
Before I say anything... Codger made a error in his post. That's not what freethinkers want. Actually, it is what Bush's conservatives want.

Constitution? Check this out: http://www.alldeaf.com/showthread.php?t=16136 -- We, freethinkers want to keep the original Constitution while Bush's conservatives want to piss over all on it. Separation of Church and State is always, always the best idea (Founding Fathers INSIST that way). I also will cover about that in my new topic.

Immigration? As a freethinker and intellectual, I don't like the idea of 'open' border. Many intellectuals & freethinkers don't. It invites the troubles (terrorists). Bush's conservatives are cheering about it, they wants to keep the open border. That's why there was the 'mutinies' at freepers' site when Bush announced that he will not do anything about open-border. These social conservatives (freepers) disagree with Bush's policies and Bush's conservatives slammed them hard then banned them from the site. These freepers decided to create a new site to fight for the border to close it down. If anyone don't believe me, check this out: http://www.alipac.us/article294.html (it is a conservative site). I am a member of that site too to fight to keep it close. For two reasons: National Security (stop terrorists) and secure our dwindling numbers of jobs & economic collapse (I will cover about that economic collapse in my new topic soon or later). What more is that, unforunately that it is not only Bush & republicans but these idiotic Democractic senates want to keep it open because of new potential voters. Capitalism corporations wants to keep it open too because of cheap labors. I guess these Capitalism corporations squeeze Bush's dick to ensure that border stays open.

ADA? I don't have enough information or link but I just feel that many Bush's conservatives hate the union so I guess they don't like ADA too? We, freethinkers & Intellectuals always want to keep the ADA/union to protect our workers' rights. Always. If you need the proof, you can go to freepers' site and ask or tell them to leave the union alone, you will be surprised by their harsh comments. In fact, it is quite entertaining.


CyberRed, one PC (Political Community) member have a interesting theory (bit conspiracy) that made us stop in our tracks. S/he was suggesting that maybe Bush and his conservatives wants to have the terrorist attack happen so he can 'force' senates to sign PATRIOT Act II/III which will threaten our dying Democracy and our rights. You can check the information about PATRIOT Act II: http://www.alternet.org/story/15541. Again, it is only theory.

Bush and his conservatives are drooling over on that new Act for a while now, many organizations feel uneasy and prepare to fight for our rights.

Beside these... Codger's comment: That we somehow OWE them a slice of our success. They are "entitled" they think. Entitlements. You owe me because I exist. The opposite end of the spectrum is personal responsibility. We are individually responsible for our decisions, our achievements, our lives.

America is originally belong to Native Americans. And... responsibility? I completely agree with him but unfortunately that Bush admin didn't see that way. Good example: Bush admin blamed women for Bin Laden's escape and when datas comes up that Bush or his admin don't like, they hide it. That is hardly being responsible....


Levonian said:
Because the fact of the matter is that if Bush ever engaged in a battle of wits with a box of rocks, the box of rocks would win.
:rofl:

CyberRed said:
What about you ? Do you really care ?
I know that question isn't for me but I want to answer anyway. Yes, I do care. That's why I joined a conservative site, ALIPAC to fight for our border. But of course I refuse to get involved with their hatred activities. Just sign the petition, join the discussion as long as they keep the hatred out of their talks, seek the information, etc.
 
Magatsu made a error in his post.
Magatsu said:
..... our dying Democracy....

*****America is NOT a Democracy! *****
Pledge of Allegiance:
"...and to the Republic for which it stands..."

United States Constitution, Article IV, Section 4:
"...shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government..."

The Federalist #10, James Madison:
"...democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths. Theoretic politicians, who have patronized this species of government, have erroneously supposed that by reducing mankind to a perfect equality in their political rights, they would, at the same time, be perfectly equalized and assimilated in their possessions, their opinions, and their passions..."

U.S. War Department Training Manual No. 2000-25; November 30, 1928:
DEMOCRACY: "A government of the masses. Authority derived through mass meeting or any other form of 'direct' expression. Results of mobocracy. Attitude toward property is communistic - negating property rights. Attitude toward law is that the will of the majority shall regulate whether it be based upon deliberation or governed by passion, prejudice, impulse, without restraint or regard to consequences. Results in demagogism, license, agitation, discontent, anarchy."

REPUBLIC: "Authority is derived through the election by the people of public officials best fitted to represent them. Attitude toward property is respect for laws and individual rights, and a sensible economic procedure. Attitude toward law is the administration of justice in accord with fixed principles and established evidence, with a strict regard to consequences. A greater number of citizens and extent of territory may be brought within its compass. Avoids the dangerous extreme of either tyranny or mobocracy. Results in statesmanship, liberty, reason, justice, contentment and progress. Is the 'standard form' of government throughout the world. A Republic is a form of government under a constitution which provides for the election of (1) an executive and (2) a legislative body who, working together in representative capacity, have all the power of appointment, all power of legislation, all power to raise revenue and appropriate expenditures and are required to create (3) a judiciary to pass upon the justice and legality of their governmental acts and to recognize (4) certain inherent unalienable rights. Take away any one of those four elements and you are drifting into democracy."

Lord Alexander Tytler on the fall of the Athenian republic:
"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves money from the public treasure. From that moment on the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most money from the public treasury, with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's great civilizations has been two hundred years. These nations have progressed through the following sequence: from bondage to spiritual faith, from spiritual faith to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependency, from dependency back to bondage."

We are a constitutional representative republic! I know that today's educational system ramrodded by the NEA wants you to believe we are a democracy, and they teach our children that we are. But it is a lie!
 
Yep. I already know that it is not Democracy but that's what Bush brainwashed all of us. "We shall bring the Democracy to Iraq!" "It is our Democracy to piss on all of you!" All craps from Bush and ex-presidents.

It will be nice if we can bring it up to White House and tell Bush & Congress to stop using "Democracy" in their bytes? (and included future presidents if there is any...)

Edit: Yes. I admitted that I slipped up with that error in my post. Thanks for pointing it out ;)
 
Magatsu, I certainly did not point it out to single you out. I see this in the work my kids bring home from school, in the media, in every political forum from both parties. Presidents have been doing it since Roosevelt. Inclusively. All of them. It grates on my nerves when I hear Bush say it. And when I heard Clinton and Owl Gore. And Bush Sr., Reagan, Ford, Carter, Nixon, Johnson, Kennedy and all the way back to Eisenhower (don't remember any further back!) :shock: One would think a person so astute of our government as to be elected President of these United States would get it right! Sigh....perhaps George Orwell's newspeak is here.
 
Yeah, I found it disturbing as much as you do. I was taught in Middle & High School that our government system is Democracy until few years, I found out that it isn't. It pissed me off that I was 'trained' to believe this crap.

Well, at least I no longer buy their craps. Offtopic: I wonder if have you ever read George Lakoff's works? His excellent book: Moral Politics : How Liberals and Conservatives Think

Oh wait.. George Orwell? You mean, 1984? or Animal Farm?
 
a bit off point. It is a little more strict at the Canada/US border when I was in Canada few days ago. They have automatic photographer and scanners and even a drug sniffing dog. I never saw that before. They even require to prove them my birth cerficate and my ID/Drivers license, but that will soon change by 2008, most people will require to have passport when crossing borders. There is about 60 million Americans with passport so far.
 
sequoias said:
a bit off point. It is a little more strict at the Canada/US border when I was in Canada few days ago. They have automatic photographer and scanners and even a drug sniffing dog. I never saw that before. They even require to prove them my birth cerficate and my ID/Drivers license, but that will soon change by 2008, most people will require to have passport when crossing borders. There is about 60 million Americans with passport so far.
Cool. That's what we need that for Mexico-USA border...
 
Magatsu said:
Cool. That's what we need that for Mexico-USA border...

yeah, we need that for Mexico, too....Mexico also have lots of drug smuggling and other crimes, I'm sure.
 
sequoias said:
a bit off point. It is a little more strict at the Canada/US border when I was in Canada few days ago. They have automatic photographer and scanners and even a drug sniffing dog. I never saw that before. They even require to prove them my birth cerficate and my ID/Drivers license, but that will soon change by 2008, most people will require to have passport when crossing borders. There is about 60 million Americans with passport so far.

I already have my own passport and it's still good for 10 years. Bought it at Post Office when I used to live in Juneau, Alaska for my trips to Yukon Terrority through Skagway, Alaska by train. :)

Strange enough, when I entered Yukon Terrority in Canada... everythin' was soo cool and friendly. But, when I returned to Alaska, they ( USA border inspector ) were mean and asked me for my ID card. I did showed them my Alaska ID card. They were not satisfied with it and asked me where I was born from ... geez whiz. Told them that I was born in New York City and, then they finally stopped questionin' me. My passport was stuck in my other baggage and it was under my seat. LOL

I guess, I know why they questioned me because, of my race. My skin is olive and I looked more Italian. Grr
 
I wonder, if Mexico could afford to pay for ( to set up one ) "Border Inspection" just like America and Canada have ?

I wonder, if we have Border Inspection in Arizona right before Mexico's line ?
 
Codger said:
Magatsu, I certainly did not point it out to single you out. I see this in the work my kids bring home from school, in the media, in every political forum from both parties. Presidents have been doing it since Roosevelt. Inclusively. All of them. It grates on my nerves when I hear Bush say it. And when I heard Clinton and Owl Gore. And Bush Sr., Reagan, Ford, Carter, Nixon, Johnson, Kennedy and all the way back to Eisenhower (don't remember any further back!) :shock: One would think a person so astute of our government as to be elected President of these United States would get it right! Sigh....perhaps George Orwell's newspeak is here.

Yep, you are correct. I remember my kids showed me their school paperworks. I was like :-o ... all of their school paperworks were not like my old days when I was taught in schools. My time was different than my kids'.

For example : They taught other foreign countries' religions, but not allowed to teach about our country's religion ( God ).
And, yes you are correct about George Orwell's newspeak is already here. Double standard, don't ya think ?
 
President George W. Bush has a soft spot for illegal aliens. After all, he did propose green cards for all of the illegal aliens a while ago. :-/
 
Banjo said:
President George W. Bush has a soft spot for illegal aliens. After all, he did propose green cards for all of the illegal aliens a while ago. :-/
That's what causes the mutiny at Freeper site sometimes ago. I think it is dumb. Many people will lose their jobs to these illegal aliens. Don't get me wrong, I do have the sympathies for these illegal aliens who escape from Mexico to get the better lives for their families or future families but... well, no comment about that. I get the feeling that none of these Congress, Bush and Bush Admin have any faint idea how to repair this messy situation. It happens to President Clinton and other ex-presidents too, none of these people have any idea how to repair.
 
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CyberRed said:
Yep, you are correct. I remember my kids showed me their school paperworks. I was like :-o ... all of their school paperworks were not like my old days when I was taught in schools. My time was different than my kids'.

For example : They taught other foreign countries' religions, but not allowed to teach about our country's religion ( God ).
And, yes you are correct about George Orwell's newspeak is already here. Double standard, don't ya think ?
I heard a new term for it the other day, new to me anyway. Diaprax? Is that right? Where they change the meaning of harmless sounding words and pepper them in until no one remembers the original meaning? I'll have to look it up and get back here.

EDIT: Diaprax is a word coined by Dean Gotcher, founder of the Institute for Authority Research. Dean has traveled the United States and given over 1,000 live presentations to Christians explaining this wicked technique that is surreptitiously destroying our families, our government, and even our Christian churches.

After reading and digesting 600+ social psychology books, Mr. Gotcher joined the word dialectic and the word praxis to create the term DIAPRAX. Dialectic is a philosophical term that describes the use of dialogue to resolve conflict between opposing ideas or opinions. The word Praxis simply means “to practice.” Therefore, Diaprax is the practice of the dialectic.

These terms are derived from the ungodly 18th century philosophical model that is known as the Hegelian Dialectic. Named after the German philosopher Georg Wilhelm Hegel (although considerably refined since its inception in Hegel’s era), this world view has now completely enveloped the world.

In its simplest form, the Diaprax system is a process whereby the entire world will eventually dialog until they reach a consensus. The 3 part formula consists of 3 essential components: Thesis, Antithesis, and Synthesis. Simply put, a “thesis” is combined with the opposing view, the “anti-thesis,” and the result is called the “synthesis.”

In the Bible we see Satan cause the fall of man through the use of Diaprax (the practice of the dialectic). Eve tells the Serpent that God has commanded that of the tree in the midst of the garden, that they “shall not eat of” it. That is the thesis. Then Satan offers an opposing opinion (the antithesis) that flies in the face of the Word of God, telling Eve about the benefits of eating the forbidden fruit. Eve joins the two views and comes up with the synthesis — the fruit is “good food,” “pleasant to the eye” and will “make one wise.” Through Adam and Eve’s reasoning, God’s eternal truth was reasoned away, and the curse of death replaced the gift of eternal life.

On the political front, the once great American Republic is Diapraxing itself into a totalitarian police state, and falling in line with the One-World United Nations government that the Scriptures declare will arise in the last days. After “dialoguing to consensus” on the subject of security versus personal freedom, the public has moved from the absolute guarantee of The Bill Of Rights (the thesis) and forfeited personal freedoms (the synthesis) because the compromise is necessary in order for the government to “protect” us — the threat to our security being the antithesis.

The consensus (the result of the social Diaprax) has concluded that “peace and safety” is more important than individual freedoms.

The process works in literally thousands of environments and is now running at full speed. Interestingly enough, the American Peoples Encyclopedia states that the Diaprax “can come to rest only at the apex of a hierarchial system.” Its early 20th century fruits were Communism and Fascism."
 
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