MSNBC: Texas to let teachers bring guns to school

[CrzyMeg]

NOOOOO! That's worse idea! :run aways like scared:
I sure anyone who will be student would tackle the gun from the teacher then shoot them? Then they have consequences for them! That it is not right thing to do with the guns!

I agreed with you. I with you. I am scared.

 

[jillio]

Yes, your post make sense that teacher´s job task to recognize student´s background behavior and work on it and help student to understand before it comes worst. It´s sad that admin. ignores the warning...

It make no sense why teacher use guns for? It solve nothing but worst... It makes them think gun is okay...

Exactly. You don't stop violence with more violence.

 

[jillio]

Well, I still say that, until the solutions you advocate are resolved by whomever (politicians, the medical folks, parenting, etc) quit their foot-dragging or clear out whatever obstacles are seemingly always in their way, this will have to do. Having been raised around guns (hunting, taking courses, plinking, etc,), I would have no compunction as a teacher these days to conceal carry and hope to never have to act on it (that 2% chance but it only takes one time). As well as you present your thinking on this, I have no problem disregarding it to a better day for your compassionate view.

Understood. We agree to disagree. You have life experience to validate your view, as do I. Rare is the time that we disagree.

 

[Jiro]

*nodding agreement, Jillio*

I would like to ask you a question, Jillio.

If anyone want to become teacher, they should study psychology to understand students´ kind of behavior?

They should certainly have a background that will allow them to recognize at risk behavior before it becomes violent. The problem seems to be that, even when teachers recognize at risk behavior, administration ignores the warnings.

oh great now you want to create a police state? This is beginning to sound very 1984 (George Orwell) to me. This is double-ungood. Now the teacher is a psychologist too? Don't we have school counselor for that? I thought you said the chance of school shooting is 1% so there's no need to identify potential ticking bomb.

What's next... requiring/encouraging store cashiers to learn psychology to identify possible domestic terrorist depending on what customer buys and their moods?

 

[fredfam1]

It sounds a good idea for a homeschool. I heard that some homeschools have a cult, and some others have a profound religious that could lead a brainwashing children.

I personally think that a homeschool is more opportunity than a private school because of cheaper cost and better education. A drawback is that some homeschools have a very poor social skills in the real world.

The following link tells what really happens when kids are homeschooled.
Any problems are ones that would have probably been their anyway because of who the parents are, not due to homeschooling. I have been homeschooling for twenty years and I always get compliments on my kids behavior as well a their intellect.

National Home Education Research Institute - Fact Sheet I

 

[Jiro]

Actually, Tousi, it doesn't address the issue head on. It addresses the surface. And school shooters are intent not just on taking the lives of others, but their own life, as well. Therefore, risking being shot is not a concern for people in this frame of mind. Saves the the trouble of shooting themselves.

right... so how do you stop a suicidal killer? lock the door? oh yea... professors died doing that.

Yes, your post make sense that teacher´s job task to recognize student´s background behavior and work on it and help student to understand before it comes worst. It´s sad that admin. ignores the warning...

It make no sense why teacher use guns for? It solve nothing but worst... It makes them think gun is okay...

worst? how? it will stop the massacre. what's better? 32 dead students or 1 dead killer?

Exactly. You don't stop violence with more violence.

uh no we stop the violence from getting worse. period. violence is there and will be there for a long while. what are you gonna do about it? implement your SES policy? not quite an overnight solution. safety is an utmost importance so how do you propose we stop that violence from escalating (as in... massacre)? with your shrink talk? you can go ahead and try to talk to him out of it but I'm going to stick with my gun

 

[Hwy99]

All I can say is that I don't want another Columbine High School scene. Guns don't need to be belong to anyone that cannot take care of it, the guns need a good owner to own it and keep it protect from being abuse or become illegalized.

 

[jillio]

oh great now you want to create a police state? This is beginning to sound very 1984 (George Orwell) to me. This is double-ungood. Now the teacher is a psychologist too? Don't we have school counselor for that? I thought you said the chance of school shooting is 1% so there's no need to identify potential ticking bomb.

What in the world are you talking about? I said absolutely none of the above. Again, you are out of ammo, gun man. Give it up. And identifying the ticking bomb will reduce even that 1% chance. It is a proactive solution to prevent the occurrance. You propose that we do nothing until someone crosses the line and becomes a shooter, and then shoot back. Very intelligent solution, jiro.:roll: BTW, have you even read 1984?
What's next... requiring/encouraging store cashiers to learn psychology to identify possible domestic terrorist depending on what customer buys and their moods?

Now you really are reaching for straws, but unfortunately, you are still coming up short. The harder you try to refute my points, the more illogical you become, whioch is a pretty good indicator that you have no idea what you are talking about from the very beginning.

 

[jillio]

right... so how do you stop a suicidal killer? lock the door? oh yea... professors died doing that.

You fail to take note of the fact that more than one professor attempted to act proactively regarding this situation, and their concerns were ignored by the officials. It is the officials failure to address the concerns regarding this student's mental health status that caused the problem.

worst? how? it will stop the massacre. what's better? 32 dead students or 1 dead killer?

Remeber, jiro, this topic is about high schoo teachers, and the high school environment is quite different than the college environment. That must be considered when proposing viable solutions. Take a little time to look below the surface.

In a college atmosphere, chances are even greater that, despite professors being armed, an incident of this nature will lead to more deaths than just the shooter.:roll:

uh no we stop the violence from getting worse. period. violence is there and will be there for a long while. what are you gonna do about it? implement your SES policy? not quite an overnight solution. safety is an utmost importance so how do you propose we stop that violence from escalating (as in... massacre)? with your shrink talk? you can go ahead and try to talk to him out of it but I'm going to stick with my gun

What are you talking about, "implement my SES policy?" It is not my policy, it is theory. And it is also well substantiated theory that fewer inequities in SES and social stratification reduce crime.
I certainly don't propose to solve violence by using violence, and neither does anyone else that has a brain in their head. Quite frankly, your facination with violence, guns, and death makes one question your stability. You might well be the one that someone is attempting to talk down the next time. Your ideas are those of the radical survivalist.

 

[Jiro]

All I can say is that I don't want another Columbine High School scene. Guns don't need to be belong to anyone that cannot take care of it, the guns need a good owner to own it and keep it protect from being abuse or become illegalized.

so.... still a polite version of gun ban

 

[Jiro]

What in the world are you talking about? I said absolutely none of the above. Again, you are out of ammo, gun man. Give it up. And identifying the ticking bomb will reduce even that 1% chance. It is a proactive solution to prevent the occurrance. You propose that we do nothing until someone crosses the line and becomes a shooter, and then shoot back. Very intelligent solution, jiro. BTW, have you even read 1984?

yup it's a good book. read it twice. you? It's why I'm a strong staunch on gun rights and several other rights... something that you want to squash simply because you do not trust in people's personal responsibility.

and how do you propose identifying the ticking bomb among millions of students? yea nice proposal. It's still not a solid solution. that's still not going to help any of 1% who will become the victims.

and no it's not about an intelligent solution. it's about life or death. It's either you or him. Simple as that... just the way the world has been since the life was born. Since none of you or the politicians have no effective proposal to deal with school shooting... allowing teacher/student to have CCW guns on campus is a logical temporary solution. Why be a victim?

What are you talking about, "implement my SES policy?" It is not my policy, it is theory. And it is also well substantiated theory that fewer inequities in SES and social stratification reduce crime.
I certainly don't propose to solve violence by using violence, and neither does anyone else that has a brain in their head. Quite frankly, your facination with violence, guns, and death makes one question your stability. You might well be the one that someone is attempting to talk down the next time. Your ideas are those of the radical survivalist.

I call it your SES policy because it's what you believe in the most. You believe it is very effective and you're a strong believer in it. hence - "your SES policy." If you were to become the President, you'd be implementing bills/proposals based on SES, right? hence.... "Your SES Policy"

And no I'm not fascinated with violence, guns, and death. I fail to see why you do not value your life. You must be so used to living inside the guarded castle. I guess you don't know what's the life like past the Great Wall of China.

The world is that simple. People will kill you for nothing if they want. They'll kill you just because you look at them in the eyes for a brief second. They'll kill you just because. sorry but your talk of social stratification and SES theory is not going to help you out of it. I operate on simple logic. "it's either you or me." I'm not inciting any violence. I'm merely protecting myself from becoming a victim of violence. If you choose not to carry gun to defend yourself from violence, that is your choice and I'm fine with that. it's your life. But I find it offensive that it's unfair for all of us to follow a choice like yours. THANKS GOD SUPREME COURT STRUCK DOWN THE GUN BAN AND RE-CLARIFIED AMENDMENT 2! UP YOURS, ANTI-GUNNERS LIBERALS!

Don't we deserve to protect ourselves if our life is in dire danger? That's not warmongering behavior.

 

[Reba]

Really? I guess it could be that you have a cold heart?

What?!

Just because I corrected your statement I "have a cold heart?"

Are you well?

 

[Reba]

Concealed carry means the gun owner carries the gun on his or her person. That means not leaving it in a locked desk or cabinet or purse. It should be loaded and accessible to the owner. Otherwise, what's the point? You can't have a quick response in an emergency if the gun is in a locked cabinet in another room, broken down and unloaded. Concealed carry is why they make holsters for under the arm, around the thigh or ankle, etc. It should be close at hand and hidden from sight.

I would never keep my gun in a purse, gym bag, or brief case at a school.

 

[Chase]

Concealed carry means the gun owner carries the gun on his or her person. That means not leaving it in a locked desk or cabinet or purse. It should be loaded and accessible to the owner. Otherwise, what's the point? You can't have a quick response in an emergency if the gun is in a locked cabinet in another room, broken down and unloaded. Concealed carry is why they make holsters for under the arm, around the thigh or ankle, etc. It should be close at hand and hidden from sight.

I would never keep my gun in a purse, gym bag, or brief case at a school.

All very well said, reflecting careful thought and good training, the farthest thing from hopelessly flawed, feel- good wishful half-thoughts.

 

[jillio]

yup it's a good book. read it twice. you? It's why I'm a strong staunch on gun rights and several other rights... something that you want to squash simply because you do not trust in people's personal responsibility.

And you see, jiro, that is where you are once again in error. You are assumming that because I do not see the need nor the wisdom in teachers being armed that I am anti-gun statutes. Again, stop looking at the surface, and employ a bit of critical thinking. You are far too quick to make judgement from a suface impression....and that is a very dangerous quality in someone who is armed.
and how do you propose identifying the ticking bomb among millions of students? yea nice proposal. It's still not a solid solution. that's still not going to help any of 1% who will become the victims.
The ticking bombs in the Columbine and Virginia Tech shootings were both identified prior to the occurrance. The problem is that no one acted on the very valid information that was provided. Instead, they ignored the warning signs and the seriousness of the situation, thus allowing it to occur.
and no it's not about an intelligent solution. it's about life or death. It's either you or him. Simple as that... just the way the world has been since the life was born. Since none of you or the politicians have no effective proposal to deal with school shooting... allowing teacher/student to have CCW guns on campus is a logical temporary solution. Why be a victim?

If you truly believe that it is necessary to go armed at school, then you are already living your life as a victim.


I call it your SES policy because it's what you believe in the most. You believe it is very effective and you're a strong believer in it. hence - "your SES policy." If you were to become the President, you'd be implementing bills/proposals based on SES, right? hence.... "Your SES Policy"

Quite obviously you have no understanding of the implication of SES in inequities that create crime ridden areas. Please educate yourself before you speak. As it stands at this time, you are merely displaying your ignorance, and that doesn't do much to validate your position. And, please, never presume that you know what I "believe in most." Your understanding of the issues is hardly sufficient and your thinking hardly fluid enough to comprehend that which you are assuming.

And no I'm not fascinated with violence, guns, and death. I fail to see why you do not value your life. You must be so used to living inside the guarded castle. I guess you don't know what's the life like past the Great Wall of China.

Oh, but I do value my life. I also value of the life of others. You might want to try that viewpoint sometime. And exactly what does the Great Wall of China have to do with anything? Try to focus and stick to that which is relevent.

The world is that simple. People will kill you for nothing if they want. They'll kill you just because you look at them in the eyes for a brief second. They'll kill you just because. sorry but your talk of social stratification and SES theory is not going to help you out of it. I operate on simple logic. "it's either you or me." I'm not inciting any violence. I'm merely protecting myself from becoming a victim of violence. If you choose not to carry gun to defend yourself from violence, that is your choice and I'm fine with that. it's your life. But I find it offensive that it's unfair for all of us to follow a choice like yours. THANKS GOD SUPREME COURT STRUCK DOWN THE GUN BAN AND RE-CLARIFIED AMENDMENT 2! UP YOURS, ANTI-GUNNERS LIBERALS!

You are living in a make believe world of paranoia, and are exhibiting just the attitude that leads to the situations that you claim will be corrected by more people going armed. You operate on nothing logical, and that is your biggest problem. You operate on illogical fear and emotion. And the world is not that simple unless you are incredibly simple minded.

Don't we deserve to protect ourselves if our life is in dire danger? That's not warmongering behavior.

And once again, the numbers show that your life, in a school setting is not in dire danger. The danger exists in your mind and your survivalist mentality.

 

[Jiro]

oh well. pointless in further argument with you... beating around the bush and we both simply have a different viewpoint. while you go ahead and believe the danger exists in my mind and crap.... know that 3 states such as Utah, Oregon, and Nevada are in discussion to adopt this similar idea. certain universities in Ohio and Virginia have allowed students to carry CCW.

(Correct me if I'm wrong about the states)

North Texas school district will let teachers carry guns

Trustees at the Harrold Independent School District approved a district policy change last October so employees can carry concealed firearms to deter and protect against school shootings, provided the gun-toting teachers follow certain requirements.

In order for teachers and staff to carry a pistol, they must have a Texas license to carry a concealed handgun; must be authorized to carry by the district; must receive training in crisis management and hostile situations and have to use ammunition that is designed to minimize the risk of ricochet in school halls.

Superintendent David Thweatt said the small community is a 30-minute drive from the sheriff's office, leaving students and teachers without protection. He said the district's lone campus sits 500 feet from heavily trafficked U.S. 287, which could make it a target.

"When the federal government started making schools gun-free zones, that's when all of these shootings started. Why would you put it out there that a group of people can't defend themselves? That's like saying 'sic 'em' to a dog," Thweatt said in Friday's online edition of the Fort Worth Star-Telegram.

 

[jillio]

You're correct, jiro. No need to continue the facade of discussion until you are actually able to substantiate your views with actual knowlege and fact.

 

[Hwy99]

so.... still a polite version of gun ban

How can you say that while I say that guns should be protect by being illegal?

 

[Jiro]

You're correct, jiro. No need to continue the facade of discussion until you are actually able to substantiate your views with actual knowlege and fact.

and until you are actually able to educate yourself to demystify the myths and unfounded fears of "gun culture"

you have not substantiated your views with actual knowledge and facts either to defend your position. All you said was "oh this is bad idea... oh it's just 1%.... 3%....." and still no effective solution for short-term and long-term. Just some quack idea like - ministry of thought. in short - you came up with basically NOTHING.

 

[jillio]

and until you are actually able to educate yourself to demystify the myths and unfounded fears of "gun culture"

you have not substantiated your views with actual knowledge and facts either to defend your position. All you said was "oh this is bad idea... oh it's just 1%.... 3%....." and still no effective solution for short-term and long-term. Just some quack idea like - ministry of thought. in short - you came up with basically NOTHING.

Whatever you say, jiro. It's all here in black and white. Pretty obvious who has been completely unable to substantiate their claims and come up with half baked solutions.:roll: