So...what you think about the health care bill?

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Really, tell me about the kind of historians?

Simplistic generalizations don' really cover a complex issue.
 
kokonut said:
What's more, I certainly do not mind seeing that top 20 Senators that make the most money are mostly Democrats. But what I do mind is the insinuation that I cannot use my creativity and hard work to earn the money I worked for and have those assholes tell me what I can or cannot do with my money. Keep socialism away from me and my family.
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I understand about not wanting the govt telling us what to do with our money. What it is just for health care since there are VA and Medicaid. What we do in our daily lives with our money such as saving, investments and etc is totally free from the govt?
 
sallylou said:
Really, tell me about the kind of historians?

Simplistic generalizations don' really cover a complex issue.
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Just like mathematicians there are many fields of math that fall under it. Same for historians, there are many specialities and fields that fall under it.
 
kokonut said:
There are all kinds of historians. Again, history shows that greater and greater govt control over people's freedom and liberty isn't the answer.
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Then Europe and Asia would had fallen apart a long time ago.

I honestly think the reason why things are falling apart nowadays is because we're seeing the long-term effects of the fall of the Soviet Union. With no one to contend with, the United States just became too big (economically) to remain a uni-superpower for long.

We need another major player on the political/economic stage to stabilize us.
 
Reba said:
Are you a conservative? If not, who made you the conservative spokesman?

FYI, yes, I earned what I have. No, I don't mind sharing it with people who have less. No, I don't want the government to tell me how to "share" it.

I "give" more than 1/3 of my gross income to Federal taxes.

I give about 15% of my gross income to what the IRS calls "charity." That doesn't include what I give in other material items, cash, time, and services that aren't tax deductible. I prefer to make that choice rather than have it taken from me.

I support 2nd Amendment rights, and freedom of religion. Those are Constitutional rights. Those rights are for liberals and conservatives.

I don't even know what you mean having a "pile" that I would want to "defend."

No, I don't want to tell you (or anyone) who to worship. As a Christian, I want to share the joy and peace that a relationship with Jesus Christ provides but I can't force anyone to worship because worship that's forced is meaningless.

"Different" doesn't mean uniformed or stupid.

Yes, I did go to college and paid my dues. What's wrong with that?

Are you saying that only conservative people want to keep what they've earned, to spend it the way they want? Does that mean liberal people want the government to take all their money?

Guess what? There are poor, unemployed conservative people, and there are rich, employed liberal people.

Conservative people live without health insurance, get laid off from jobs, have pre-existing conditions, and die from cancer just like every one else. It has nothing to do with "karma."
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Reba, if AllDeaf were a tournament, you would be the undefeated champion.
 
shel90 said:
I understand about not wanting the govt telling us what to do with our money. What it is just for health care since there are VA and Medicaid. What we do in our daily lives with our money such as saving, investments and etc is totally free from the govt?
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Why move on to something else when there is $60 billion dollars a year on waste and fraud in Medicare, for example, to something that covers just about everybody under the rock, including illegal aliens. If Medicare isn't as efficient as people hoped it would have been what do you think this boondoggle will be like then? It'll be 20 times worse. The bureaucratic mess alone would simply be mind-boggling. It'll be the mother of all socialized messed up programs.
 
Banjo said:
The last time I checked, it's still a large part of the healthcare system.
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No. It made out to be the "de-facto" healthcare. It's not health care per se because they know they can get away with it by knowing how the system works, unfortunately to the wallets of taxpayers of U.S. citizens.
 
kokonut said:
You pay what you can afford. Not all insurance companies are the same.
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So, only the middle class and upper class are entitled to better healthcare simply because they have the money while the lower class aren't good enough.

HMO is a joke. Nobody can benefit from it.
 
Banjo said:
So, only the middle class and upper class are entitled to better healthcare simply because they have the money while the lower class aren't good enough.

HMO is a joke. Nobody can benefit from it.
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That is what it seems like the support is for.

There has to be a solution unless people want to keep things the way they are.
 
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Not so much, kokonut. Historians generally pick a particular place and era. You can always tell what a history professor studied because she spends too much time on it in a general history course. I think that people don't give historians enough credit. It's a really hard course of study. Souggy is no light weight.
 
souggy said:
Then Europe and Asia would had fallen apart a long time ago.

I honestly think the reason why things are falling apart nowadays is because we're seeing the long-term effects of the fall of the Soviet Union. With no one to contend with, the United States just became too big (economically) to remain a uni-superpower for long.

We need another major player on the political/economic stage to stabilize us.
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Remember WWII and Nazi Germany? It was falling apart then had we Allies not defeated Hitler and his Axis partners.

We're going to have to contend with China now. But then again they are experiencing the tantalizing taste of capitalism, so....
 
sallylou said:
Not so much, kokonut. Historians generally pick a particular place and era. You can always tell what a history professor studied because she spends too much time on it in a general history course. I think that people don't give historians enough credit. It's a really hard course of study. Souggy is no light weight.
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Yep. History on an university level is no easy feat.
 
sallylou said:
Not so much, kokonut. Historians generally pick a particular place and era. You can always tell what a history professor studied because she spends too much time on it in a general history course. I think that people don't give historians enough credit. It's a really hard course of study. Souggy is no light weight.
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Most definetly! Souggy is very well-educated in his field of work. I have learned a lot from him already because I am a layman when it comes to history and philosophy.
 
I got certified to teach math and history in undergrad. Both of those were challenging. My math prof had the attitude that his class counted because we were destined to teach math (which was correct because that's what schools need). Miss him since he died.
 
sallylou said:
Not so much, kokonut. Historians generally pick a particular place and era. You can always tell what a history professor studied because she spends too much time on it in a general history course. I think that people don't give historians enough credit. It's a really hard course of study. Souggy is no light weight.
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I remain correct. The word "history" deals with the past. That's already a given. Everybody knows that. It's the historian's field of study that are wide ranging that I'm referring to. Art historian (pick any period you want), historians on aviation, historians on the holocaust, genealogists, historians on WWII, historians on the Nazi era, science historians, legal historians, maritime historians and so on. It's not simply a particular place and era but which and what history being studied upon.
 
kokonut said:
History has it that giving govt greater and greater control over people's freedom and liberty isn't the answer. Nor has it ever worked to people's satisfaction.
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but it worked during FDR :dunno:
 
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