Pro-choice and death).....(only pro-choice and death comment)

[Reba]

The letter of the law?

Florida Closes Clinics and Suspends License of Notorious Abortionist

By Peter J. Smith

ORLANDO, Florida, August 17, 2006 (LifeSiteNews.com) – The State of Florida has suspended the license of a notorious Florida abortionist for performing illegal late term abortions and ordered two abortion clinics shut down Wednesday.

On Wednesday, Florida’s health secretary ordered the suspension of abortionist James Pendergraft after state investigators discovered that Pendergraft performed an abortion on a woman 28 weeks pregnant in July 2005, and gave her controlled substances without a proper license.

The state investigation also found that two of Pendergraft’s Orlando abortion clinics were also performing illegal third trimester abortions, and spurred the health secretary to issue an emergency order suspending Pendergraft’s license stating that he showed "a flagrant disregard for the laws of the state of Florida and a willingness to endanger the lives and health of pregnant patients."

Florida state law forbids the abortionists from performing third trimester abortions outside of hospitals.

The state’s order closes the Orlando Women’s Center and the EPOC Clinic, although three other abortion clinics owned by Pendergraft shall remain open. The state’s emergency suspension order prevents Pendergraft from practicing in Florida until the state Board of Medicine takes final action. Pendergraft is appealing the rulings.

Pendergraft has gained a history of notoriety in Florida, ever since he first was jailed for 7 months in 2001 on charges of conspiring to extort millions of dollars from Marion County. In 2005, Pendergraft’s abortion clinic employees refused to heed the pleading of a young mother to call 9-1-1, who wanted help to save her born-alive child, who survived an abortion. Instead, still attached to the umbilical cord, the child died in the arms of his distraught young mother, who rocked and cooed him for the duration of his 11 minutes of life amid the squalor of the clinic’s restroom.

The Florida Board of Medicine considered revoking Pendergraft’s license for the treatment of the mother, Angele, and the sanitation violations of the clinic; however members voted to dismiss the case in April.

Florida Closes Clinics and Suspends License of Notorious Abortionist

 

[Reba]

Kansas Investigation into Child Rape Blocked by Two Secret Abortion Clinics
Supreme Court sealed the names of abortion mills fighting AG Kline over late-term abortion records

WICHITA, Kansas., February 25, 2005 (LifeSiteNews.com) - Kansas Attorney General Phill Kline has asked for the records of 90 women who had abortions after 22 weeks gestation at two unnamed abortion clinics in an investigation into reports of child sex abuse of minor girls. Currently, abortion clinics are exempt from reporting child sex abuse, even if they become aware of it. The two clinics, whose names have been sealed by the Kansas Supreme Court, are blocking the release of the records citing privacy concerns of their patients.

"Rape is a serious crime and when a 10, 11, or 12 year old is pregnant – they have been raped under Kansas law," said Kline in a press release dated February 24, 2005. "The child's privacy is always protected…no one has the right to rape or victimize a child or woman whether in private or public. There are two things child predators want: access to children and secrecy and as Attorney General, I am bound and determined to give them neither."

Operation Rescue believes that one of the unnamed clinics is late-term abortionist George Tiller's Women's Health Care Services in Wichita.

"We can put two and two together," said Operation Rescue president Troy Newman. "Tiller brags about being the largest late term abortion facility outside Communist China. Certainly no one in Kansas does as many late-term abortions as Tiller. We fully support the Attorney General's investigation and pray that he will gain access to these records and catch the child rapists that these clinics are covering for."

"We see very, very young girls going into Tiller's abortion mill on a regular basis and have reported this," said Cheryl Sullenger, a sidewalk counselor who offers help to women considering abortions outside Tiller's infamous abortion clinic. "Some appear to be as young as 10 or 11 years old. Whether you support abortion or not, everyone should be shocked that these clinics are not only protecting child sexual predators, but are also enabling them to continue to abuse by keeping their dirty little secrets."

Kansas Investigation into Child Rape Blocked by Two Secret Abortion Clinics

 

[jillio]

Did anyone bothered to read the links I provided?

Yes.

 

[jillio]

The letter of the law?


Florida Closes Clinics and Suspends License of Notorious Abortionist

Quite obviously, this man had violations relating to his practice of medicine across the board. Why didn't he have a liscense to dispense controlled substances. Most likely explanation is that his liscense to dispense had been revoked or suspended by the medical board due to violations in prescribing. While I agree that this man should not be practicing medicine in any capacity, due to ethical and legal violations, there are practitioners who do not perform abortions but prey on the public in other ways. Remember the "diet doctors" of recent history? What about the surgeons who perform surgery for which they are unqualified and ill trained, thus resulting in patient deaths? What about the general physicians who are guilty of malpractice for stepping outside their scope of practice? You can find cases of malfeasance in any sub-specialty of medicine. It does not just occur with those pratitioners that perform abortion.

 

[jillio]

Kansas Investigation into Child Rape Blocked by Two Secret Abortion Clinics

Operation Rescue and sidewalk counselors: there's a telling phrase or two. Physicans in any capacity are mandatory reporters, and can loose their license for not reporting suspected child abuse of any form. Where the confidentiality comes in is releasing the names and any details of medical treatment received.

The attorney general rquested the medical records of 90 women. No where does it state that any of these women were 10, 11, or 12 years of age. And the records were no doubt suponaed to ascertain whether there was a medical basis for an abotion performed at 22 weeks or later.

I believe the statement "some appear to be as young as 10 or 12" is an important distinction.

 

[Reba]

Operation Rescue and sidewalk counselors: there's a telling phrase or two. Physicans in any capacity are mandatory reporters, and can loose their license for not reporting suspected child abuse of any form. Where the confidentiality comes in is releasing the names and any details of medical treatment received.

The attorney general rquested the medical records of 90 women. No where does it state that any of these women were 10, 11, or 12 years of age. And the records were no doubt suponaed to ascertain whether there was a medical basis for an abotion performed at 22 weeks or later.

Yes, they were investigating the late-term abortions.

Kansas Attorney General Phill Kline has asked for the records of 90 women who had abortions after 22 weeks gestation

"Tiller brags about being the largest late term abortion facility outside Communist China. Certainly no one in Kansas does as many late-term abortions as Tiller.

Those offenses are specific to not following the abortion law.

I believe the statement "some appear to be as young as 10 or 12" is an important distinction.

You're right. Maybe they were actually as "old" as 14. Is that any better? They're still minors who were taken advantage of.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Abortionists can ignore the laws now just like they did when abortion wasn't generally legal. What makes you think they all follow the law now?

Do you mean that they also can ignore Partial Birth Abortion law, too when they know US partial birth abortion law was banned in 2003?

 

[Liebling:-)))]

After read Cheri´s links, it sound that partial birth abortion are continue when partial birth abortion was banned in 2003.

Why can´t they abort an earlier than 12 weeks, not after 12 weeks... ?

 

[jillio]

Yes, they were investigating the late-term abortions.





Those offenses are specific to not following the abortion law.



You're right. Maybe they were actually as "old" as 14. Is that any better? They're still minors who were taken advantage of.

And at 14, parental consent is required. Maybe we should be looking at the parents as well as the doctors. And wehther the law was broken would be dependent upon whether there was a medical basis for an abortion at 22 weeks as specified by law. If there was, and it is documented in the medical records, then the physicans were not in violation. I think we can safely assume that is why the medical records were suponeaed.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Partial birth abortions, or second tri-mester abortions are not performed because a parent decides that they cannot care for a child financially.

Yes that´s right. If they cannot afford to take care of child then abort earlier than 12 weeks or give a child up for an adoption. I see no excuse if they change their mind later (after 12 weeks or more) for want to rid of child.

That decision is limited to 1st trimester, elective abortion only. Likewise with mental retardation. For a second trimester abortion that fetus has to be found to have birth defects incompatible with life. In other words, even if the pregnancy is carried to term, the child would not survive.

As you mention "1st trimester". Do you mean earlier abortion up to 12 weeks? If yes, then I support it, not after 12 weeks. I only support their decision for abort after 12 weeks only if there´re severe reason like life threatening, severe defect, etc.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

The law is very restrictive regarding the second trimester abortions, and you posted those restrictions earlier. People do many things that are illegal in America. There are stories that 2nd trimester abortions are being performed illegally. But if they are being done at the rate some would have us believe, why aren't these physicians being prosecuted?

I cannot understand... If they decides to not keep a child then do that early abortion instead of wait until late abortion (partial birth abortion) then...?

 

[Cheri]

The Partial Birth was not banned before the year of 2003, That procedure was used in the second trimester, not only for the health risk of the mother and the unborn. George Bush was the one who signed the Partial-birth abortion ban act in 2003.

 

[jillio]

Yes that´s right. If they cannot afford to take care of child then abort earlier than 12 weeks or give a child up for an adoption. I see no excuse if they change their mind later (after 12 weeks or more) for want to rid of child.





As you mention "1st trimester". Do you mean earlier abortion up to 12 weeks? If yes, then I support it, not after 12 weeks. I only support their decision for abort after 12 weeks only if there´re severe reason like life threatening, severe defect, etc.

Yes, that's what I meant.

 

[jillio]

I cannot understand... If they decides to not keep a child then do that early abortion instead of wait until late abortion (partial birth abortion) then...?

Exactly. Second trimester abortions are legal only if the mother's life is at risk, or the fetus has been determined to have a birth defect so severe that they would not survive if the pregnancy was carried to term. In most cases, the child would not survive the birth process. A woman cannot just decide, late in the pregnancy, that she just doesn't want to be pregnant any more, and walk in off the street and demand that a doctor give her an abortion. And, Partial Birth Abortion refers to a specific procedure for doing second trimester abortions. It is not legal. When doctors do a medically therapeutic abortion in the second trimester for medical reasons regarding the life of the woman or the life of the fetus, they have to use a different procedure other than Partial Birth.

 

[Cheri]

There are stories that 2nd trimester abortions are being performed illegally. But if they are being done at the rate some would have us believe, why aren't these physicians being prosecuted?

I did not know the laws back then, So it's too late to prosecuted against the abortionist of what happened 22 years ago.

 

[Cheri]

Exactly. Second trimester abortions are legal only if the mother's life is at risk, or the fetus has been determined to have a birth defect so severe that they would not survive if the pregnancy was carried to term.

Again not true, for a long time they allowed the second trimester abortions. It wasn't banned until 2003.

Read for yourself. Partial Birth Abortion

 

[jillio]

Again not true, for a long time they allowed the second trimester abortions. It wasn't banned until 2003.

Read for yourself. Partial Birth Abortion

Cheri, that simply is not true. Until 1973, all but a few states forbid abortion at any point in the pregnancy unless it was medically indicated. After Roe v Wade, elective abortion was deemed legal, but only to the end of the first trimester. Elective abortion in the 2nd trimester has neve been legal. And Partial Birth refers to a technique, not a time period. Partial Birth technique was banned in 2003. A doctor can still do a medically indicated 2nd trimester abortion if the mother's life is at stake or if the fetus has a birth defect that is so severe it will not be able to live. They just can't do it using the Partial Birth technique.

a form of late-term abortion that the Act calls partial-birth abortion. The U.S. Supreme Court has ruled that the term "partial-birth abortion" in the act pertains to a procedure that is scientifically called intact dilation and extraction.[

The above is directly from your Wiki link.

 

[jillio]

I did not know the laws back then, So it's too late to prosecuted against the abortionist of what happened 22 years ago.

We aren't talking about 22 years ago. We are talking about 2nd trimester abortions being performed now. And 22 years ago, a 2nd trimester abortion was still illegal unless it was done for the reasons I have already cited.

 

[Cheri]

http://www.priestsforlife.org/testimony/pbawitness.htm' A witness to Partial-birth abortion

How many partial birth abortions did you personally witness?

"Two full-term abortions. They were done at nine months."

What do you know of the circumstances surrounding these abortions? Why were they being done?

"One of the mothers already had three or four and she didn't want any more."

"The other girl was single. She didn't have a husband and had no means of support. I asked, 'Why don't you put the baby up for adoption?' She said, 'I don't know how it would be treated.'


One was a 40 year old woman who had a 19 year old son, and she was getting a divorce so she didn't want the baby. The other was a teenage mom who hid the pregnancy from her parents, and then the parents found out she was pregnant and made her abort the baby. They are typically performed at 20 to 24 weeks, but sometimes later.

Quote Page 3: Partial Birth (D&X) Abortion

 

[jillio]

http://www.priestsforlife.org/testimony/pbawitness.htm' A witness to Partial-birth abortion

How many partial birth abortions did you personally witness?

"Two full-term abortions. They were done at nine months."

What do you know of the circumstances surrounding these abortions? Why were they being done?

"One of the mothers already had three or four and she didn't want any more."

"The other girl was single. She didn't have a husband and had no means of support. I asked, 'Why don't you put the baby up for adoption?' She said, 'I don't know how it would be treated.'


One was a 40 year old woman who had a 19 year old son, and she was getting a divorce so she didn't want the baby. The other was a teenage mom who hid the pregnancy from her parents, and then the parents found out she was pregnant and made her abort the baby. They are typically performed at 20 to 24 weeks, but sometimes later.

Quote Page 3: Partial Birth (D&X) Abortion

Your first link doesn't work. And an abortion cannot be performed full term. That is called induced labor.

Why are you beating a dead horse? Partial birth abortion has been banned for 5 years. They don't do that procedure any more. Finsihed. Done with.

All of these quotes are nothing more than hear say.