Pro-choice and death).....(only pro-choice and death comment)

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Cowpuppy said:
That may be your personal opinion-decision.
but mostly the conservative/religious pro-lifers.....don't claim to 'protect the innocent'.......thier battle cry is.....'sanctity of life'.....preciousness of life itself........that implies the worst of criminals as well as unborn innocents. They can't have it both ways. Hence, religious leaders don't believe in death penalty....but some self-righteous conservatives do. Such as Bush. Self serving scaredy cats. Nicey nice killers. Self-righteous killers.
I believe in death penalty but I don't claim to be conservative.
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There it is....that contradiction.
 
shel90 said:
I dont see the contradiction..either I am brain dead or I dont agree with u. :giggle:
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Arguing the sanctity of life with one hand, and supporting killing in our justice system. If they truly believe in the sanctity of life, then it applies to all human life, including the criminal.
 
jillio said:
Arguing the sanctity of life with one hand, and supporting killing in our justice system. If they truly believe in the sanctity of life, then it applies to all human life, including the criminal.
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Thanks for clarifying...hmm I will have to think on that one.
 
jillio said:
Babies are protected. If one kills a baby, one suffers the penalty. Under the law, it is not a baby until it is born, because the law uses the cocept of viability. It is your choice as to whether you accept the legal definition or not. You are not forced to accept it in your own personal value system. However, if you want the right not to accept it, then you have to allow others the right to accept it, if it is their choice.
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Are you sayin' a baby is not really human at all UNTIL it born? :eek3:
Are you tryin' to say that baby is not really alive UNTIL it born? :eek3:

If it's true, then how come fetus is not alive while it's heart is beating at four weeks of pregnancy?
 
Mann_K05 said:
Are you sayin' a baby is not really human at all UNTIL it born? :eek3:
Are you tryin' to say that baby is not really alive UNTIL it born? :eek3:

If it's true, then how come fetus is not alive while it's heart is beating at four weeks of pregnancy?
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I am saying that until it is born it is called a fetus. After it is born, it is called an infant, or a baby, if you will. And, according to the legal, medical, and scientific definition, it is not viable until it has reached the fetal stage.
 
PuyoPiyo said:
*nods* Same here, I would rather to be neutral and don't vote legal or illegal on the abortion, but I don't feel less-prolife because of it at all because I am against the abortion based on my preferrance ;)
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Yeah... I am also sick of "human selections" subject if you know what I mean. Sighs.
 
jillio said:
I am saying that until it is born it is called a fetus. After it is born, it is called an infant, or a baby, if you will. And, according to the legal, medical, and scientific definition, it is not viable until it has reached the fetal stage.
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Okay, you said a baby is just fetus because this baby dont exist until it born. Right?
 
Mann_K05 said:
Ah, are you expect us, prolifers, should ignore women's risk health cos we "don't care" about theirs? No, I respectfully disagree.

I believe in a prolife support various future plans for improvement things; reducing women's risk healths; fix the nature; such thing positive things. Ofc, they don't suppose legal abortion, myself as non-traditional prolifer, I don't support illegal or legal abortion either.

That's not make me less prolife however.

Just sayin'.
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Where did you see where I said that pro-lifers did not support women's health issues?
 
Mann_K05 said:
Okay, you said a baby is just fetus because this baby dont exist until it born. Right?
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I did not say that it was "just" a fetus, I said it was called a fetus. And a fetus cannot be aborted, and if someone kills a pregant woman while she in pregnant and in the fetal stage, the criminal will be charged with the death of the fetus, as well.

I said it could not be called a baby until it was born, under the legal definition of viability, the medical definition of viability, and the scientific definition of viability. Of course it exists. It exists as a fetus.

At other points of gestation it is also called a blastocyst, and an embyo. Neither of which are viable. A baby can also called a neonate.
 
jillio said:
Where did you see where I said that pro-lifers did not support women's health issues?
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Personly, I'm pro-life for myself, but prochoice for everyone else.
I would never have an abortion, but I'm not gonna stand in line and scream that someone else shouldn't have one.
I do think that we could reduce the abortion problem by: forcing insurance companies to cover GOOD quality effective birth control, making the morning after pill over the counter, promoting good healthy relationship training (like a lot of girls seem to be very brainless when it comes to relationships. I remember reading a Teen People mag where a girl said that she had sex with someone, b/c she was afraid that if she didn't boys wouldn't like her any more) I also think that parents of potential special needs kids really need to be counseled. Most info out there on the various and sundry disabilites is so out of date, its not even funny!
I'm against the death penalty in most cases, but I do think that there ARE some cases where the death penalty is justified. There are people out there who are just PURE evil, and who will never ever be rehabilitated.
I also think that some people have been brainwashed into thinking that ALL abortion is evil. What about if the mom has an etopic pregnancy? (a condition where the sperm fertilizes the egg in the fallopian tube. This is a condition, that if not treated KILLS) What about if a baby's died in utereo?
What if it has a 100% fatal condition? (like anacephely)
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That would make you pro-choice. You have chosen a pro-life position for yourself, and support that every other individual has the right to make that same choice for themselves. That's what people don't seem to understand. Being pro-choice does not necessarily mean that your personal moral values would allow you to ever have an abortion, but that you understand that it is everyone's right to choose what they can and cannot accept for themselves on this issue, and you have no right to impose your moral values or your religious views regarding abortion on others. - Jillio
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What I see, you told him that he is pro-choice because of his opinion. Well, take a look here. There are a lot of good points.
 
Mann_K05 said:
What I see, you told him that he is pro-choice because of his opinion. Well, take a look here. There are a lot of good points.
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That website has absolutely nothing to do with my post. And I said that dd was pro-choice because she makes the choice not to have an abortion for herself, but she also support everyother woman's choice to make that decision for herself. She is not trying to take anyone's choice away. That is the very definition of pro-choice.
 
jillio said:
I did not say that it was "just" a fetus, I said it was called a fetus. And a fetus cannot be aborted, and if someone kills a pregant woman while she in pregnant and in the fetal stage, the criminal will be charged with the death of the fetus, as well.

I said it could not be called a baby until it was born, under the legal definition of viability, the medical definition of viability, and the scientific definition of viability. Of course it exists. It exists as a fetus.

At other points of gestation it is also called a blstocyst, and an embyo. Neither of which are viable.
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Hmm... I see.
Okay, a fetus is existed by then. Let me ask you, what is a fetus derevse (sp) for? I wonder?
 
Mann_K05 said:
Hmm... I see.
Okay, a fetus is existed by then. Let me ask you, what is a fetus derevse (sp) for? I wonder?
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I'm sorry. I don't understand your question. Could you explain for me, please?
 
jillio said:
That website has absolutely nothing to do with my post. And I said that dd was pro-choice because she makes the choice not to have an abortion for herself, but she also support everyother woman's choice to make that decision for herself. She is not trying to take anyone's choice away. That is the very definition of pro-choice.
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Okay, fine by then. I only showed you some reasons, that's all.

I seriously think you should not call her a pro-choice while she believed in abortions is wrong except women's risk health. That's not means she is less pro-lifer. Just thought.
 
Mann_K05 said:

It's okay, I suck at grammar. Aha :D

EDIT: What fetus deserves for?
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Under the law, a fetus has the same rights as an infant. That is why a person can be prosecuted for murder if they kill a fetus. But abortions are not done at the fetal stage, either. If a fetus dies in the womb at this stage, labor is induced and it is called a "still birth." If the woman goes into labor at this stage, it is called a premature birth.
 
jillio said:
Babies are protected. If one kills a baby, one suffers the penalty. Under the law, it is not a baby until it is born
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I respectfully disagree, human life begins in the womb, not after birth, a heart beat is a breathing life. Why should a unborn baby have to die because of someone's mistake? It's still killing an innocent human life.
 
Cheri said:
I respectfully disagree, human life begins in the womb, not after birth, a heart beat is a breathing life. Why should a unborn baby have to die because of someone's mistake? It's still killing an innocent human life.
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And, you are entitle to hold that view for yourself, and make your personal choices based on th belief you hold. But, if you want to be allowed to make that choice for yoruself, then you must allow others the right to make their choices for themselves, whether they are the same choices you make or not.
 
Pro-lifer support abortion to be illegal.
Pro-lifer support fetus´s right/life before mother´s life and risk health.

Pro-choicer support abortion to be legal.
Pro-choicer support mother´s choice and respect mother´s wish for save her risk life before fetus´s life.

I asked a Pro lifer ADer at other thread either he consider abortion as murder if mother decide to abort fetus to save her risk life or not? He answered: He also consider it as murder as well if mother put her risk life first before fetus life. He explains that surgery can SAVE mother´s risk life... *sigh* Okkkkaayyy... I respect his view and told him that he is a true pro-lifer. If anyone who consider mother´s risk life first before fetus´s life then is pro-choice.
 
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