Iran will do military exercise on how to close Strait of Hormuz

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Reba said:
God, Bible, Christ.
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Many billions of people believe in God. They are not non-believers. They simply don't subscribe to your beliefs. So, Alex was spot on in his fify.
 
Reba said:
Within what you call the Protestant group, the differences aren't always disagreements in doctrine but just preferences. I'm a member of an independent Baptist church but there are many other churches that I wouldn't have a problem attending or even joining, throughout the world, that don't call themselves "Baptist."

What you call disagreement, others call the priesthood of the believer and church autonomy.

Also, any person or group is free to call himself or itself Christian since there is no worldwide agency on earth that can regulate who uses that name. There is no trademark on "Christian."
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Why are all the different denominations necessary if it is not a disagreement over doctrine? Come on, Reba. You are not that naive. Someone says, 'Oh, no! I don't believe that is the way this Bible verse should be interpreted. I don't agree with that practice. I will start my own church based on what I believe the one true interpretation to be." It has been happening since Martin Luther disagreed with the Catholics.
 
jillio said:
Many billions of people believe in God. They are not non-believers. They simply don't subscribe to your beliefs. So, Alex was spot on in his fify.
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Many billions of people aren't posting at AD. The ones I'm talking about have stated in their posts that they don't believe in God. That makes them non-believers. It has nothing to do with my beliefs, so Alex was wrong-o.
 
Reba said:
Many billions of people aren't posting at AD. The ones I'm talking about have stated in their posts that they don't believe in God. That makes them non-believers. It has nothing to do with my beliefs, so Alex was wrong-o.
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Hmmm...I have only seen 2 people identify themselves as atheists in AD.

But the way you classified "believers" was according to your particular belief in the trinity. Many billions of people do not accept the premise of the trinity, and yet they believe and are devout followers of God. Using "non" to categoroize them instantly creates a negative, as if they are missing something they should have.
 
jillio said:
Why are all the different denominations necessary if it is not a disagreement over doctrine? Come on, Reba. You are not that naive. Someone says, 'Oh, no! I don't believe that is the way this Bible verse should be interpreted. I don't agree with that practice. I will start my own church based on what I believe the one true interpretation to be." It has been happening since Martin Luther disagreed with the Catholics.
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I didn't say "all," did I?

No, not all differences are doctrinal. Some are cultural, some are political, some are preferences. People can start denominations for whatever reason they want. Who's going to stop them? Not all practices have to do with doctrine. That doesn't mean none are doctrinal.
 
jillio said:
Why are all the different denominations necessary if it is not a disagreement over doctrine? Come on, Reba. You are not that naive. Someone says, 'Oh, no! I don't believe that is the way this Bible verse should be interpreted. I don't agree with that practice. I will start my own church based on what I believe the one true interpretation to be." It has been happening since Martin Luther disagreed with the Catholics.
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Let us take the Baptists alone for example: primitive Baptists, Independent Baptists, American Baptists... and that's a partial list. I have come to realize that my Grandfather Smith may not have been a Southern Baptist as my mother claims.
 
deafskeptic said:
Let us take the Baptists alone for example: primitive Baptists, Independent Baptists, American Baptists... and that's a partial list. I have come to realize that my Grandfather Smith may not have been a Southern Baptist as my mother claims.
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I think that perhaps I should have left out that line about family.
 
jillio said:
Hmmm...I have only seen 2 people identify themselves as atheists in AD.
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I don't know if they are identified as atheists but they stated things such as "I don't believe in God" or "God is a myth." That seems clear to me.

Is that some kind of a problem for you?

Since I didn't name any names, and I don't keep a list of who has self-identified as an atheist, and I don't read every single post at AD, I'll take your word that there are only two identified atheists at AD. Even two can make many posts.

But the way you classified "believers" was according to your particular belief in the trinity. Many billions of people do not accept the premise of the trinity, and yet they believe and are devout followers of God. Using "non" to categoroize them instantly creates a negative, as if they are missing something they should have.
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Someone who doesn't believe in the Bible, and has stated so, is a non-believer in the Bible. Someone who doesn't believe in God, and has posted such, is a non-believer of God. Someone who doesn't believe in Jesus Christ, and has said so in a post, is a non-believer of Jesus Christ. Those are the posted topics I referred to.

If the posters don't believe in those things, then why should they mind being referred to as non-believers?

Are you their spokesman?
 
Reba said:
I didn't say "all," did I?

No, not all differences are doctrinal. Some are cultural, some are political, some are preferences. People can start denominations for whatever reason they want. Who's going to stop them? Not all practices have to do with doctrine. That doesn't mean none are doctrinal.
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Cultural and political differences, when applied to religion, are simply differences in interpretations and beliefs. So it does really come down to doctrine.
 
Reba said:
I don't know if they are identified as atheists but they stated things such as "I don't believe in God" or "God is a myth." That seems clear to me.

Is that some kind of a problem for you?

Since I didn't name any names, and I don't keep a list of who has self-identified as an atheist, and I don't read every single post at AD, I'll take your word that there are only two identified atheists at AD. Even two can make many posts.


Someone who doesn't believe in the Bible, and has stated so, is a non-believer in the Bible. Someone who doesn't believe in God, and has posted such, is a non-believer of God. Someone who doesn't believe in Jesus Christ, and has said so in a post, is a non-believer of Jesus Christ. Those are the posted topics I referred to.

If the posters don't believe in those things, then why should they mind being referred to as non-believers?

Are you their spokesman?
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Ahhh...but you just said "non-believer". :cool2: You had to be questioned before you identified your definition of a non-believer as someone who did not believe in the trinity. I still think Alex hit it on the head.

I don't know that anyone minds being referred to as a "non-believer". Just pointing out that you have a specific definition attached to whom you consider a "non-believer" based on whether they subscribe to your particular belief system or not.

Yes, I am.
 
jillio said:
Cultural and political differences, when applied to religion, are simply differences in interpretations and beliefs. So it does really come down to doctrine.
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Are you talking about your religion or mine?
 
About Iran and the Strait Hormuz...ahem...just saw this today: Iran squeezes UAE with stopping imports - Tehran Times

"Experts say the cut of trade relations will harm the UAE largely as the Arab state’s exports to Iran are four times greater than its imports from the Islamic Republic.

According the statistics released by Iran’s Customs Administration, the value of trade ties between the two neighbors over the last eight months stood at around $15 billion, of which 12 billion dollars were the United Arab Emirates’ exports to Iran. The figure shows that a loss of Iran’s market would harm the UAE economy.

Iran’s punitive measure against the UAE, although is said to be temporary, shows that the Islamic Republic has the capability to take pre-emptive steps against any hostile activities. "
 
jillio said:
Ahhh...but you just said "non-believer". :cool2: You had to be questioned before you identified your definition of a non-believer as someone who did not believe in the trinity. I still think Alex hit it on the head.
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No, it means that some people either don't know how to read or choose to see what they want to see. The subjects of non-belief were right there in the same sentence. What else would it refer to? Non-belief in Martians?

Again, you're trying to make hash out of nothing.

I don't know that anyone minds being referred to as a "non-believer". Just pointing out that you have a specific definition attached to whom you consider a "non-believer" based on whether they subscribe to your particular belief system or not.
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Since I didn't refer to anyone by name, and since "anyone" doesn't mind, then I guess you can rest easy tonight.

Yes, I am.
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I wasn't aware that you were the official spokesman for un-believers. I missed that announcement. I didn't even know that they needed one.
 
DeafCaroline said:
About Iran and the Strait Hormuz...ahem...just saw this today: Iran squeezes UAE with stopping imports - Tehran Times

"Experts say the cut of trade relations will harm the UAE largely as the Arab state’s exports to Iran are four times greater than its imports from the Islamic Republic.

According the statistics released by Iran’s Customs Administration, the value of trade ties between the two neighbors over the last eight months stood at around $15 billion, of which 12 billion dollars were the United Arab Emirates’ exports to Iran. The figure shows that a loss of Iran’s market would harm the UAE economy.

Iran’s punitive measure against the UAE, although is said to be temporary, shows that the Islamic Republic has the capability to take pre-emptive steps against any hostile activities. "
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How dare you get us back on topic!

j/k :lol:
 
DeafCaroline said:
About Iran and the Strait Hormuz...ahem...just saw this today: Iran squeezes UAE with stopping imports - Tehran Times

"Experts say the cut of trade relations will harm the UAE largely as the Arab state’s exports to Iran are four times greater than its imports from the Islamic Republic.

According the statistics released by Iran’s Customs Administration, the value of trade ties between the two neighbors over the last eight months stood at around $15 billion, of which 12 billion dollars were the United Arab Emirates’ exports to Iran. The figure shows that a loss of Iran’s market would harm the UAE economy.

Iran’s punitive measure against the UAE, although is said to be temporary, shows that the Islamic Republic has the capability to take pre-emptive steps against any hostile activities. "
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It's interesting to watch as things start to develop.....it's like reality TV or something.
 
Reba, I have never, not once, on AD stated that I don't believe in God. (Though I object to the term "atheist" being referred to almost as a dirty word.) I just don't believe in a Christian construction of God in man's image. I challenge anyone to find a post where I have said otherwise.

Why I changed your wording(aside from the tongue-in-cheek aspect) is because I do not like how you took ownership of the verb "believe." Your diction suggested that anyone who didn't believe in what you believe in is not just someone who believes differently, but does not believe at all; is not on the same level as you; or spiritually inferior, if you will. That's just not the case. I know your religion teaches you otherwise, but you will just have to accept that you are only allowed to say that in your own house of worship and amongst those who feel the same way. To call anyone a "non-believer" because they do not believe what you believe is bigotry and ignorance. I will not tolerate it, and I will be aggressive at attacking that anywhere in a public forum. To do otherwise would be to disobey one of the categorical imperatives by which I live.
 
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