What if?

jillio said:
Please point out exactly where that was done? If you are referring to correction of a concept being termed something quite the opposite, and a concept many most likely will encounter in the educational process, then it is a different thing entirely. Innocence and not guilty are basically the same concept. Just different terminology for the concept depending upon the perspective.
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You posted:

"You would not be innocent under our justice system. You are responsible for your actions, even if the intent of those action was different."

Our (American) justice system is very specific about the terminology used. They are technical legal terms. It has nothing to do with perspective. Under our justice system, one is either guilty or not guilty. Under our justice system, there is no concept of "innocent."

If you want to discuss the moral concept of innocence, that's fine. But it's not a concept under our justice system.

The concepts of innocence and not guilty are not the same.
 
jillio said:
Please point out exactly where that was done? If you are referring to correction of a concept being termed something quite the opposite, and a concept many most likely will encounter in the educational process, then it is a different thing entirely. Innocence and not guilty are basically the same concept. Just different terminology for the concept depending upon the perspective.
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A wild guess here .... post #38
 
Reba said:
You posted:

"You would not be innocent under our justice system. You are responsible for your actions, even if the intent of those action was different."

Our (American) justice system is very specific about the terminology used. They are technical legal terms. It has nothing to do with perspective. Under our justice system, one is either guilty or not guilty. Under our justice system, there is no concept of "innocent."

If you want to discuss the moral concept of innocence, that's fine. But it's not a concept under our justice system.

The concepts of innocence and not guilty are not the same.
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To the law. In an informal discussion not guilty = you didn't do it. Innocent = you didn't do it. As I stated, we are not enforcing law on the forum. We are having an informal discussion.
 
jillio said:
To the law. In an informal discussion not guilty = you didn't do it. Innocent = you didn't do it. As I stated, we are not enforcing law on the forum. We are having an informal discussion.
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Then why did you say, "under our justice system" if you didn't mean it?

"Not guilty" does NOT mean "you didn't do it." It means it couldn't be proven that you did it.

Even in an informal discussion we must be accurate.
 
Reba said:
Then why did you say, "under our justice system" if you didn't mean it?

"Not guilty" does NOT mean "you didn't do it." It means it couldn't be proven that you did it.

Even in an informal discussion we must be accurate.
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Under our justice system is not an indication that law is being enforced on this forum.
 
jillio said:
Under our justice system is not an indication that law is being enforced on this forum.
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No one said law was being enforced in the forum.

If you want to be inaccurate, go for it. Please just don't misinform other people along the way.
 
Reba said:
No one said law was being enforced in the forum.

If you want to be inaccurate, go for it. Please just don't misinform other people along the way.
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No one was misinformed here at all.
 
Babyblue said:
Want to create this thread in regards of the granny shooting and missing her target.

Going along with the. "what ifs."

What if a person was being attacked. Which I feel they have every right to defend themselves. The question I have is.... what if the victim pulled a gun shooting at the perpetrator, doing so, missing the targeted person and hit an innocent bystander?? Harming that person in a major way, or killing an innocent person?
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sue. that's why it's a burden to pack a heat. it's your choice to carry one and also your choice to accept the consequence
 
Babyblue said:
Perhaps.

Since he created a scene.

What if the victim was not license to carry a gun... or is, but had no type of training to use it.
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this is nothing new. If the victim was not licensed to carry a gun - she will be criminally-charged with illegal possession of firearm and most likely couple other charges. Because of her age - the judge will probably be lenient on her and suspend her sentence but she'll face a hefty fines and possibly a civil lawsuit if the bystander got shot by her. There was a similar case - the pregnant woman was driving "recklessly" to go to ER cuz her water broke. She crashed. She was given tickets for running thru red and some others. tough luck.

Babyblue said:
Would it matter how the victim handled it?
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always. it's a serious responsibility.

Babyblue said:
By saying for an example.... Should a victim chose to give up and give the robber what they want? Or put others at risk by shooting freely?
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well - everybody makes a choice. every choice has a consequence.
 
Babyblue said:
Agree, perhaps... Depending on the local laws.


But what if the victim was a felon himself that prohibits him/herself from having a gun themselves? And they shot at the perpetrator, and missed hitting a bystander?

Then what?
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ah... a classic legal puzzle. A felon shooting in self-defense that resulted in fatality. What was he charged with? just illegal possession of firearm. that's it. There are dozens of cases like this.

I heard about this case a little while ago. it was.... interesting. Convicted Felon Faces Charges for Defending Self Against Violent Home Invader | LearnAboutGuns.com 
 
Jiro said:
ah... a classic legal puzzle. A felon shooting in self-defense that resulted in fatality. What was he charged with? just illegal possession of firearm. that's it. There are dozens of cases like this.

I heard about this case a little while ago. it was.... interesting. Convicted Felon Faces Charges for Defending Self Against Violent Home Invader | LearnAboutGuns.com*
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Well, a felon most certainly would not have a concealed carry permit, and he would also be guilty of possession of a gun under disability.
 
jillio said:
Well, a felon most certainly would not have a concealed carry permit, and he would also be guilty of possession of a gun under disability.
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I don't understand the disability part.
 
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