glee tonight

[jillio]

Using stereotypes in a show is never a good thing, for exactly this reason:



If Glee is trying to break down these stereotypes and get people to question their own perception, that's a good thing. But I don't see that with Glee. The ridicule that the audience feels for the director in the first scene is not assuaged by the signing scene because they're unrelated. Also, notice how that show ended? With the director still acting like a buffoon, and the cheerleading coach says, "read my lips" and gets condescending...

Breaking down the stereotypes and getting people to question their own perceptions is what was accomplished in the last scene. That is exactly what is portrayed by the hearing choir and the deaf choir coming together onstage. It is also why there is such a change in sentiment from the beginning of the show and the scene at the end.

 

[jillio]

to show the positive view, you must show the negative view. I don't believe the negative perception is being reinforced... it's just showing you the truth that nobody wants to acknowledge it because they do it. We see bullying scenes in movies/tv all the time. in the end? the victim fights back and wins.

same thing with Glee. It had a surprising ending.

Exactly. It is like everyone is sticking their head in the sand with the "That never happens!" statement. Yes, it does happen; day in and day out. Deaf students relate those experiences on a daily basis. There have been books written about just those experiences. To say it does not happen is to be extremely naive.

 

[jillio]

Yes, true. But let's not be complete downers here. There are also plenty of people who were affected positively by this show and were inspired to make a difference. Notice the new member or two who joined up just because they watched the show? I think that's good. Even if they initially have the wrong perception, their intention to help is what matters, and they will eventually be shown the right perception.

This show certainly didn't create a perfect bridge between the two cultures, but at least it was trying.

If it motivated one person to reach out, it was a success. Evidently, it motivated more than one.

 

[TWA]

To my way of thinking, and based on my experience, it was not an attempt to illicit humor. Perhaps you have some bias there that is skewing your perspective a bit? I have seen students made fun of in just this way day in and day out in the mainstream for over 20 years. Yet, anytime such an occurrance is talked about, everyone is outraged and says, "Oh, come on! That never happens! People aren't that mean and insensitive!"

The fact is, yes, people are that mean and insensitive. And those that have not seen it firsthand need to be aware that students are often treated in a very disrespectful and hurtful manner. And, yes, teachers, too, even those deaf teachers at the collegiate level.

Sorry, but I'm not sure what you're talking about here, Jillio. I think you're either not remembering the scene correctly, or misinterpreting my words. Nobody was making fun of the HoH director in the scene; he was the one acting like a buffoon and being rude to the hearing director, and it was a result of his hearing loss (he mishears the hearing director and thinks he's being asked for coffee, so he rudely asks for two sugars and cream; doesn't hear his phone ringing and when the hearing director mentions it to him he snaps, "I have it set to vibrate," and then at the end of the conversation he looks at his phone and says, "Oh damn I missed four calls."). So yes, the show was making fun of him in a way, but it was occurring outside the scene, outside the bounds of the show. It was not meant to be a social commentary, or raise awareness.

That scene was most certainly intended to elicit humor based on the actions of the HoH director. Watch it again.

As for having a bias, no I don't have a bias. Please don't make insinuations. Perhaps I do look at these things from a different perspective based on the fact that I am HoH. I misinterpret people's words day in and day out, but I can assure you I am not a jackass buffoon like how that HoH director was portrayed, nor are any d/Deaf/HoH people I know. We are not oblivious to the effects of our hearing loss, and we have all developed coping mechanisms for interacting with the hearing world.

 

[jillio]

Sorry, but I'm not sure what you're talking about here, Jillio. I think you're either not remembering the scene correctly, or misinterpreting my words. Nobody was making fun of the HoH director in the scene; he was the one acting like a buffoon and being rude to the hearing director, and it was a result of his hearing loss (he mishears the hearing director and thinks he's being asked for coffee, so he rudely asks for two sugars and cream; doesn't hear his phone ringing and when the hearing director mentions it to him he snaps, "I have it set to vibrate," and then at the end of the conversation he looks at his phone and says, "Oh damn I missed four calls."). So yes, the show was making fun of him in a way, but it was occurring outside the scene, outside the bounds of the show. It was not meant to be a social commentary, or raise awareness.

That scene was most certainly intended to elicit humor based on the actions of the HoH director. Watch it again.

As for having a bias, no I don't have a bias. Please don't make insinuations. Perhaps I do look at these things from a different perspective based on the fact that I am HoH. I misinterpret people's words day in and day out, but I can assure you I am not a jackass buffoon like how that HoH director was portrayed, nor are any d/Deaf/HoH people I know. We are not oblivious to the effects of our hearing loss, and we have all developed coping mechanisms for interacting with the hearing world.

I wasn't suggesting that you were a jackass buffoon, anymore than I see the HOH director as a jackass buffoon. I was suggesting that your experience as an HOH person could possibly make you relate to situations such as missed phone calls a bit more personally than was intended from the scene. I think that might possibly be the case, given this relpy.

I suppose we will never know the true intent unless the writers are consulted regarding the intent. For me, I prefer to see it as a positive social statement amongst the many negative ones that prevail still in this society regarding the deaf.

 

[TWA]

Breaking down the stereotypes and getting people to question their own perceptions is what was accomplished in the last scene. That is exactly what is portrayed by the hearing choir and the deaf choir coming together onstage. It is also why there is such a change in sentiment from the beginning of the show and the scene at the end.

The scene at the end did not reconcile the scene with the HoH director acting like a buffoon. The stereotype of the HoH misunderstanding buffoon that was put forth by that first scene will persist in the minds of the audience even if the signing scene creates a more heartfelt reaction to deafness. This is shoddy writing.

 

[shel90]

I need to watch it with Jillio and TheWriteAlex's point of view in mind and see if I see the same thing or not.

 

[jillio]

The scene at the end did not reconcile the scene with the HoH director acting like a buffoon. The stereotype of the HoH misunderstanding buffoon that was put forth by that first scene will persist in the minds of the audience even if the signing scene creates a more heartfelt reaction to deafness. This is shoddy writing.

Again, that is a matter of opinion. I saw reconciliation, you do not. Reconciliation occurred in the form of acceptance between members of the younger generation. That is where it usually occurs. The older generation is far too set in their experiences to actually allow it to happen.

 

[jillio]

I need to watch it with Jillio and TheWriteAlex's point of view in mind and see if I see the same thing or not.

Yeah, I'd be interested in hearing what you think. I'm viewing it from a cultural perspective colored by some very real life experiences.

 

[TWA]

I wasn't suggesting that you were a jackass buffoon, anymore than I see the HOH director as a jackass buffoon. I was suggesting that your experience as an HOH person could possibly make you relate to situations such as missed phone calls a bit more personally than was intended from the scene. I think that might possibly be the case, given this relpy.

I suppose we will never know the true intent unless the writers are consulted regarding the intent. For me, I prefer to see it as a positive social statement amongst the many negative ones that prevail still in this society regarding the deaf.

I'll ask again: Do you REALLY think an HoH person acts like the way the deaf choir director acted in the scene with the hearing choir director? And you really don't think that he was acting like a jackass? I would be willing to bet that if that scene were showed to 100 hearing people who had no exposure to deafness, the majority of them would say he acted like a jackass.

Now, I am a writer and teacher of writing, and I most certainly can determine their intent, or their attempted intent. Only a poor writer is not able to clearly show his/her intent. So it's either one of two cases here: shitty writing, or shitty intent. I tend to think it's a little of both.

 

[TWA]

As a side note. I got nothing but love for you, Jilly! I don't think we're going to change each others' opinions though, so maybe we should just drop it.

 

[shel90]

I'll ask again: Do you REALLY think an HoH person acts like the way the deaf choir director acted in the scene with the hearing choir director? And you really don't think that he was acting like a jackass? I would be willing to bet that if that scene were showed to 100 hearing people who had no exposure to deafness, the majority of them would say he acted like a jackass.

Now, I am a writer and teacher of writing, and I most certainly can determine their intent, or their attempted intent. Only a poor writer is not able to clearly show his/her intent. So it's either one of two cases here: shitty writing, or shitty intent. I tend to think it's a little of both.

Oh geez..I seriously gotta watch it and have a fit!

 

[jillio]

I'll ask again: Do you REALLY think an HoH person acts like the way the deaf choir director acted in the scene with the hearing choir director? And you really don't think that he was acting like a jackass? I would be willing to bet that if that scene were showed to 100 hearing people who had no exposure to deafness, the majority of them would say he acted like a jackass.

Now, I am a writer and teacher of writing, and I most certainly can determine their intent, or their attempted intent. Only a poor writer is not able to clearly show his/her intent. So it's either one of two cases here: shitty writing, or shitty intent. I tend to think it's a little of both.

I am certain there are some who do. Why wouldn't there be? There are as many varied personalities in the deaf as there are in the hearing. An asshole is an asshole, no matter his/her hearing status. I never said he didn't act like a jackass. I simply said his character's behavior was not an attempt to make fun of the population as a whole.

No, you cannot determine anyone's intent without their specific input regarding such. You, just as anyone, could misinterpret based on your own experience and perceptions. The writers perceptions may be completely different from your own, and therefore, his intent may be protrayed differently from what you would expect. And I know that you already realize that intepretation of intent in any kind of writing is a subjective experience based on the reader.

 

[Jiro]

OK - I finished watching whole thing.

1. HOH director and Quinn (main character - choir director) - there were some awkward scenes of conversation between them. there was miscommunication - "you don't have to make fun of me with that hand gesture" & coffee stuff.

IMO: I actually chuckled. it's just showing people what we deafies deal with on daily basis. Happens to me all the time. I told people wrong stuff that was not related to discussion.

2. Sue - that female older woman - she looks like an evil condescending woman so we'll ignore that part because it's not really that important.

3. I find it interesting that some of us have negative perspective view about it and other had positive reaction about it. It's really subjective because it depends on our previous life experience with it...

at this point.... we all will have to just agree to disagree

 

[jillio]

As a side note. I got nothing but love for you, Jilly! I don't think we're going to change each others' opinions though, so maybe we should just drop it.

Same here! A little debate should not pose a threat.

 

[anakin]

2. Sue - that female older woman - she looks like an evil condescending woman so we'll ignore that part because it's not really that important.

sue is evil, of course! except when it comes to her sister. you'd have to keep up with glee to know. :P

 

[TWA]

Same here! A little debate should not pose a threat.

 

[jillio]

Thanks! About time for me to get some of that rest the doctor told me to get, anyway!

 

[Jiro]

oh dang it - forgot to add a thing. Overall - this episode was interesting... with deaf and hearing together. It's cool to see some deaf exposure on major tv network channel. I want more!

However - I was not pleased about this episode showing high school students performing sexually-suggestive dance. That irks me. I have a strong distaste toward to popular sitcoms filled with sexually-charged contents especially if the sitcoms' geared toward to teens. Yes I know ya'all know me as a dirty old man but that's because I'm older and ya'all are older. Kids should be doing kid stuff and watching kid stuff... not sleeping around or getting knocked up.

 

[Jiro]

Thanks! About time for me to get some of that rest the doctor told me to get, anyway!