Do people remember Clinton Era?

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Hear Again said:
Actually, Clinton was not responsible for the first attack of terrorism against the United States.

The first terrorist attack to happen on U.S. soil occurred in 1982 under the Reagan Adminstration in which FALN, a Puerto Rican separatist group, exploded bombs outside of the 26 Federal Plaza in Manhattan, New York FBI Headquarters and a United States courthouse in Brooklyn. In addition, three NYPD officers sustain serious injuries trying to diffuse a second Federal Plaza bomb.
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we're not talking about that. that is irrelevant. I'm talking about Clinton's ineptitude in handling national security matter.
 
Jiro said:
I see.... so you only care about "deaths." Just because nobody died from Clinton's lie doesn't mean he's any better than Bush. He was an embarrassment to our country. Again - it's understandable that booming economy and surplus budget shined Bill Clinton so bright that you can't see his flaws in national security and military conflicts.

How convenient of you to turn a blind eye on any lies.... as long as nobody gets hurt (or died).
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You're saying that Clinton was flawed in national security and military conflicts. Funny how America is more afraid under Bush than Clinton....and yet Bush is supposed to be great for military tactics?

Im assuming that Clinton was an "embarrassment" to our country because of the sex scandal. Hasn't it occurred to anyone that this overblown "embarrassment" was brought upon by the media? Do you know how many political leaders out there do "bad things"? Do you think its because they haven't been caught? I guarantee it is because the media kept its mouth shut about it out of respect. Do you know how many foreigners asked "Why are Americans disrespecting their president like this?" during the sex scandal? Not that I respect Clinton for that, but talking about impeachment, etc... That was just too much.
 
Jiro said:
and in both cases - Saddam FAILED to cooperate with UN inspectors and USA repeatedly. Bush gave AMPLE amount of warnings... again Saddam played with the fire and he got burnt. bad boy....
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Your point is moot since U.S. inspectors failed to find any WMDs.
 
Jiro said:
and in both cases - Saddam FAILED to cooperate with UN inspectors and USA repeatedly. Bush gave AMPLE amount of warnings... again Saddam played with the fire and he got burnt. bad boy....
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The fact is George Bush´s father FAILED during Gulf War... They claim that they won at Gulf war but didn´t arrest Saddam. We were like :scratch: We would consider the war victory IF they ARRESTED Saddam during Gulf War.... until his son took and changed Clinton´s administration... and remember Gulf War and determined to have Iraq War long months BEFORE WTC attack... Bush use WTC attack as his advantage to send troops to Iraq War when he KNEW Obsama bin Laden IS in Afangistation, not Iraq.
 
PowerON said:
Is that okay if I have sex with someone in your bedroom? You would be mad and hate me like forever.
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He wasn't in a friend's bedroom. He was in the Oval Office, which at the time, was his office.
 
Jiro said:
we're not talking about that. that is irrelevant. I'm talking about Clinton's ineptitude in handling national security matter.
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In what cases? Bosnia? Iraq?

A little too easy to say "Oh there were military problems because Clinton left a mess." Anyone can say that about Bush too "Oh the economy still sucks because Bush left a mess." Sorry, that's just throwing blame.
 
Jiro said:
Like I said - at what cost? Your freedom? I am vehemently opposed to Clinton's ideal of "Police Nation"


Several variations of Ben Franklin's quote -
"They that can give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

"Those Who Sacrifice Liberty For Security Deserve Neither."

"He who would trade liberty for some temporary security, deserves neither liberty nor security."

"He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither."

"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both."

"If we restrict liberty to attain security we will lose them both."

"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."

"He who gives up freedom for safety deserves neither."

"Those who would trade in their freedom for their protection deserve neither."
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And like I say, the benefits justify the means. You are constantly complaining about a crime rate that is skyrocketed to the point that you feel the need to go armed. Can't have it both ways, Jiro. High crime rate and need to go armed, or lowered crime rate and safer environment for the whole population. I prefer the lowered crime rate. It indicates that we are actually doing something to solve the core problem instead of attempting to cover it with a band-aid and in effect, making it worse.
 
Daredevel7 said:
In what cases? Bosnia? Iraq?

A little too easy to say "Oh there were military problems because Clinton left a mess." Anyone can say that about Bush too "Oh the economy still sucks because Bush left a mess." Sorry, that's just throwing blame.
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Very true... :lol:
 
Jiro said:
we're not talking about that. that is irrelevant. I'm talking about Clinton's ineptitude in handling national security matter.
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Clinton managed to fight nuclear proliferation, liberalize world trade, engage Russia and China and save lives in Haiti, Bosnia and Kosovo under a partisan Republican Congress.
 
Hear Again said:
So does that make Clinton's lie worse than those told by Reagan about sending arms to Iran and aid to the Nicaraguan Contras or Nixon's lies about misusing the CIA, his dishonesty about his personal taxes and his involvement in the Watergate cover up?

I don't think so. A lie is a lie is a lie -- no matter who tells it.
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Clinton's lie did not put the American public at risk.
 
Daredevel7 said:
You're saying that Clinton was flawed in national security and military conflicts. Funny how America is more afraid under Bush than Clinton....and yet Bush is supposed to be great for military tactics?

Im assuming that Clinton was an "embarrassment" to our country because of the sex scandal. Hasn't it occurred to anyone that this overblown "embarrassment" was brought upon by the media? Do you know how many political leaders out there do "bad things"? Do you think its because they haven't been caught? I guarantee it is because the media kept its mouth shut about it out of respect. Do you know how many foreigners asked "Why are Americans disrespecting their president like this?" during the sex scandal? Not that I respect Clinton for that, but talking about impeachment, etc... That was just too much.
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that's not what I said. If you read my previous posts carefully - I said both Clinton and Bush lack military experience and made POOR military judgments. I stated that Clinton was an embarrassment to our country because he crippled our defense capability and our military was in a shamble.

As for his sex scandal? That doesn't even make a blip in my radar. I'm sure Slick Bill had a good laugh with other leaders about it and just that it sucks that he got caught.
 
Jiro said:
because of Saddam wanted us to think he did. My point is not moot since Saddam toyed with us and taunted us. As the result - he made a fatal miscalculation.

Saddam admitted he miscalculated, FBI agent says
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Ooooh, so 4,000+ people died for his miscalculation. I see.

I guess Saddam didn't listen to his mom when she told the story about "The boy who cried wolf."
 
Jiro said:
like I said - LIE or NOT - Clinton exhibited a very POOR military decisions that resulted in deaths... a typical trait in Democratic Presidents who lack or have military experience. Do not even tell me about JFK. It's a joke. As far as I'm concerned - he probably never saw a battle. If he did - it's thru his binocular from a safe distance. Again - JFK made very poor military decisions... remember Bay of Pigs?

Again - both JFK and Clinton were good men but just a lousy Commander-in-Chief. I would not serve under them.
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Ever read PT 109? I would suggest you do. It will serve to correct your mistaken ideas regarding JFK.
 
Jiro said:
that's not what I said. If you read my previous posts carefully - I said both Clinton and Bush lack military experience and made POOR military judgments. I stated that Clinton was an embarrassment to our country because he crippled our defense capability and our military was in a shamble.

As for his sex scandal? That doesn't even make a blip in my radar. I'm sure Slick Bill had a good laugh with other leaders about it and just that it sucks that he got caught.
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Ah I see, thought the embarrassment was from the sex scandal. Okay gotcha. I figured you thought both sucked in military judgments, my Clinton/Bush comment was more for the general population.

One thing I notice, Jiro, you say how everyone sucks. Curious.. does anything or anyone make you happy? :)
 
Liebling:-))) said:
The fact is George Bush´s father FAILED during Gulf War... They claim that they won at Gulf war but didn´t arrest Saddam. We were like :scratch: We would consider the war victory IF they ARRESTED Saddam during Gulf War.... until his son took and changed Clinton´s administration... and remember Gulf War and determined to have Iraq War long months BEFORE WTC attack... Bush use WTC attack as his advantage to send troops to Iraq War when he KNEW Obsama bin Laden IS in Afangistation, not Iraq.
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Failed? uh.... no last time I checked - the mission was successful. GHB made a decision that he believed Iraq's military capability was severely crippled thus Saddam posed no threat anymore and he still didn't pose any threat at all. BTW - most of wars are not necessarily won by arresting or killing the leader. Look at WW2 against Japanese.

It was probably a wise decision by GHB to not arrest Saddam. At least Saddam can keep Iraq in a working condition - working electricity & water... keeping Iraq in order... no civil wars... etc.
 
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