Deaf Education - One size does not fit all

[jillio]

We can perhaps add body language and gestures. All the situations you described above can be solved with pen and paper or speech or both.

Or, with technology. I know deaf that do not use pen and paper, but prefer to use their text pagers. Very efficient.

 

[jillio]

When I made those comments about my rights to equal access to language/communication, I was referring to the educational setting not outside of it. I know that the hearing population isnt going to learn ASL but I am talking about putting deaf children in a learning environment where communication is strained and stifled. I think that is just wrong.

If we place deaf children in the proper educational setting, they receive the services that actually make communication with the hearing world easier later on. Well educated and competent children become well educated and competent adults.

 

[jillio]

I don't know that its realistic to expect the entire hearing population to make such accommodation's. I believe that's just a result of sheer numbers. On the other hand, if you're talking about the family circle, educational settings and work environments, then yes, I agree wholeheartedly. The pathalogical view and oralism are not going anywhere and for some, those approaches work and for some they don't. Just as for some a toolbox approach is best and for some TC or Bi-Bi is more effective.

As long as the majority of the hearing community defines deafness as a disability, they place themselves in the position of being responsibile for making those accommodations. The pathological view places any person with a disability in the role of dependent, and shifts the burden of accommodation onto the don-dependent. If they wish to hold onto that view of disability, then they must accept the social responsibilities that are inherent in their viewpoint.

 

[Cheri]

I'ts going to be harder for deaf kids no matter how you slice it. Teaching two languages puts additional load on these kids. Life is not easy and I wouldn't risk a childs chances to succeed in the real world by taking the easy way out.

I agree because for one take one good look at how Helen Keller learned how to sign and how to speak she made a remarkable break through in communication and she's deaf and blind.

Learning oral was tough, I did not play as much as other kids I spend summer at summer school for speech training, now I look at myself and how grateful that I've learned very good speech skills, it beats writing everything down on a notebook pad.

Children will miss out not only on a quaility of education but also on crucial life and communication skills if no speech skills.

Bi bi method is given a lesson in deaf culture and an identity that they can be proud of, but what is so proud of being deaf? Am I proud of being deaf, no but this is what been given to me and I accepted that..

 

[jillio]

What exactly would you consider meeting half way? I am just curious. When I give that some thought the first thing that comes to my mind is reading and writing.

The first step would be to ask the deaf individual how they would prefer to communicate, or what the hearing individual needs to do from the deaf person's perspective to facillitate the communication. Don't just assume because a deaf person can use voice, that they can hear and understand what you are saying without additional visual cues.

 

[jillio]

I don't think it's possible to sum that up on one word.

But it can be summed up in 4 words: cultural and linguistic minority.

 

[jillio]

Well..If I speak, people hear how well I can speak so they assume I can hear pretty well. It seems like in their minds (I am assuming) the better the deaf person speaks, the better he/she can hear but what they dont realize that is not the case. Even trying to explain that, it seems like they dont believe it or dont really want to work at making sure that they are facing me so I can read their lips. Instead, they start turning their faces away and start jabbering away so when I tell them to pls look at me, I get the rolled eyes or they get that pissed off look. At the end, I am the one who feels like I am the one who is at fault for not trying even though I did. I hope I am being clear.

I worked hard in speech therapy so my speech is very clear for someone with my degree of hearing loss but I need support from hearing people in their willingness to make sure I understand what is being said around me or that I am able to see their lips at all times. Most of the time, I dont get that and when I ask for it, I get an attitude from them which in turn, makes me feel like shit. That is why I ended up becoming so withdrawn and scared to reach out in my 20s. Now that I am more wise and have experienced full access to communication, I am able to look back and know that it wasnt my fault. I did all I can but if hearing people dont want to meet me halfway, then what more can I do? I am limited to some degree cuz of the severity of my hearing loss and I shouldnt be felt as a burden. That is why I seek other ASL users than non ASL users. I hate that feeling so why should I have to put myself thru that daily? I am done with that. Life is too short and I want to enjoy it and feel good about myself.

We need to stop concentrating so hard on the issue of speech that we ignore the other aspects of development.

 

[rockdrummer]

The first step would be to ask the deaf individual how they would prefer to communicate, or what the hearing individual needs to do from the deaf person's perspective to facillitate the communication. Don't just assume because a deaf person can use voice, that they can hear and understand what you are saying without additional visual cues.

I try to never make assumptions but it does happen. What I mean about reading and writing is when a deaf person encounters a non-signing hearing person.

 

[rockdrummer]

But it can be summed up in 4 words: cultural and linguistic minority.

Put that on a tee shirt... I bet many deaf would wear it.

 

[rockdrummer]

We need to stop concentrating so hard on the issue of speech that we ignore the other aspects of development.

I don't think anyone here is suggesting that speech be the utmost priority and that it should take precedence over education. I believe the point is to include it in the cirriculim.

 

[jillio]

This explains well the importance of English literacy.

Source: Options in Deaf Education-History, Methodologies, and Strategies for Surviving the System

Unfortunately, we seem to be reducing communication to a very concrete definition of being able to communicate needs and wants to the larger hearing society. Communication is so much more than that. Without a strong foundation in a language that allows one to communicate on a more abstract level, to discuss feelings, impressions, thoughts, reactions, observations, to ask questions, and to communicate understanding of the world around oneself, true communication has not been achieved. That is the problem with restricting a deaf child to an oral only environment. The language use may be suffiecient to communicate on a very concrete level, but the imaginative use of language is not there. These kids are quite often restricted in their ability to use language to express novel and creative thought through language. That is why I say that we need to stop devoting their entire childhood to providing them skill to communicate with the hearing only, and give them an environment that allows them to develop intellectually, socially, cognitively, and emotionally. Once that has been achieved, the skills to communicate with the hearing world will develop to a greater degree. And, in the process, we have a child whose developmental needs have been met on ALL levels, and at the appropriate stages. It's a win-win situation. We are creating much of the deficit that we complain about.

 

[jillio]

If Total Communication program uses sign language, voice, fingerspelling and lipreading then how can that not be possible? Even if a child who cannot communicate orally gets additional support from signs and vice versa.



Humm..just spilting them in groups would just solve that problem? It's like putting all black in one group and all white in another group. I just don't see any equal access in that program.

TC generally uses sim-com. That provides a confusing linguistic environment for the child. They end up getting less than effective models for both sign and English.

 

[jillio]

One of the major problems as I understand it is that you can't compare one bi bi program to another. You can't compare one TC program to another becuase as many have mentioned before, there are programs out there that claim to be bi-bi and that claim to be TC but are really not by definition. This is because of many factors of which few, if any are controlable. Personally I believe that exposing a deaf child to all methods is a good approach. I think there is importance in the education no doubt. But there is also importance in communication with the majority. ASL while a beautiful language and an efficient means of communication, does have it's drawbacks. A deaf child is going to have a bit more of a load on his back than hearing children with regards to education not only in a bi bi program but also in a TC program. It's an extra load to have to learn two languages and a further load to have to learn speech. It's a tough road for these kids but with a TC approach I believe they will be better prepared for life in the real world.

Exposing to all methods does not necessarily exposing to all methods simultaneously. It is not an extra load cognitively if they are not exposed simultaneously. Imagine 2 teachers in front of a hearing class room teaching algebra and history at exactly the same time. Would you come away with sufficient understanding of either? Of course not. It requires a form of splint attention of which people simply are not capable cognitively. One cannot give full attention to 2 things that require that degree of concentration at once. Think of it this way: When you are driving in a familiar area, it is easy to carry on a conversation with a passenger and navigate your car through the roads at the same time. But if you are in an area of heavy traffic, unfamiliar with the area, and looking for a specific address, you cannot continue to carry on a conversation and drive at the same time. You will stop talking, and use your cognitive powers to accomplish the task of negotiating the heavy traffic and looking for the address you need. Once the traffic thins out, and you are back in familiar territory, you can resume your talking and driving at the same time. It is the same thing in a classroom. If we expect children to learn well, we cannot place them in a situation that creates a cognitiveoverload, and expect them to give full attention to 2 tasks that require split attention.

 

[jillio]

Put that on a tee shirt... I bet many deaf would wear it.

I'm not deaf, but I would certainly wear it!

 

[jillio]

I don't think anyone here is suggesting that speech be the utmost priority and that it should take precedence over education. I believe the point is to include it in the cirriculim.

Unfortunatly, rd, it does happen every day, and particluarly for all of the mainstreamed children that are pulled out of their regular classrooms to attend speech therapy. Speech, imo, should not be part of an academic cuiiculum, but a rehabilitation effort.

 

[Cheri]

Cuz deaf kids can't hear so speech and spoken language isn't fully accesible to them or so what I thought?

Deaf children do not need to hear with their ears to be taught speech. You should know that we rely more on our vision in a sense we hear with our eyes. There is a mirror in speech therapy where deaf children can look at themselves to pronounce words and the sounds of each begin letter of a word. They are capable to understand speech by placing a hand to their throat and their mouth and the speech therapist's mouth and throat too.

Yes it is gonna get very difficult to learn but they can do it all they have to do is try harder.

 

[Angel]

I agree because for one take one good look at how Helen Keller learned how to sign and how to speak she made a remarkable break through in communication and she's deaf and blind.

Learning oral was tough, I did not play as much as other kids I spend summer at summer school for speech training, now I look at myself and how grateful that I've learned very good speech skills, it beats writing everything down on a notebook pad.

Children will miss out not only on a quaility of education but also on crucial life and communication skills if no speech skills.

Bi bi method is given a lesson in deaf culture and an identity that they can be proud of, but what is so proud of being deaf? Am I proud of being deaf, no but this is what been given to me and I accepted that..

!! Helen Keller is my hero!

 

[Cheri]

TC generally uses sim-com. That provides a confusing linguistic environment for the child. They end up getting less than effective models for both sign and English.

It wasn't confusing to me it beats learning just one like oralism and ASL itself.

 

[Cheri]

!! Helen Keller is my hero!

She is mine too.

 

[rockdrummer]

Exposing to all methods does not necessarily exposing to all methods simultaneously. It is not an extra load cognitively if they are not exposed simultaneously. Imagine 2 teachers in front of a hearing class room teaching algebra and history at exactly the same time. Would you come away with sufficient understanding of either? Of course not. It requires a form of splint attention of which people simply are not capable cognitively. One cannot give full attention to 2 things that require that degree of concentration at once. Think of it this way: When you are driving in a familiar area, it is easy to carry on a conversation with a passenger and navigate your car through the roads at the same time. But if you are in an area of heavy traffic, unfamiliar with the area, and looking for a specific address, you cannot continue to carry on a conversation and drive at the same time. You will stop talking, and use your cognitive powers to accomplish the task of negotiating the heavy traffic and looking for the address you need. Once the traffic thins out, and you are back in familiar territory, you can resume your talking and driving at the same time. It is the same thing in a classroom. If we expect children to learn well, we cannot place them in a situation that creates a cognitiveoverload, and expect them to give full attention to 2 tasks that require split attention.

I don't think anyone suggested simultaneous exposure.