All Made in USA & American Made

[diehardbiker]

Suppose your shopping for car, and that car from factory A cost you $5,000 dollars and the payment for monthly is 99 bux, while car from Factory B cost $12,000 and have monthly payment of 250 dollars a month.

Which one are you gonna buy from?

Remember the monthly payment is based on interest rate, that is why 2nd one got little higher payment.

Exactly and if you look at the Factory " A " and Factory " B "

Factory " A " makes $ 5.75 an hour.

Factory " B " makes $ 11.50 an hour.

Which one do you think quality and morale will go through the roof ?

 

[Endymion]

Suppose your shopping for car, and that car from factory A cost you $5,000 dollars and the payment for monthly is 99 bux, while car from Factory B cost $12,000 and have monthly payment of 250 dollars a month.

Which one are you gonna buy from?

Remember the monthly payment is based on interest rate, that is why 2nd one got little higher payment.

In this particular instance, I agree with DHB65.

Heath, its important that workers be treated fairly, but it's also important to the firm to keep production costs low. If the market value of labor is at $8.00, you do want to pay $8.25 or $8.50 if you know the employees will be more enthusiastic about increasing productivity and keeping costs low.

You, however, do not want to pay $11.00/hr because employee productivity doesn't increase as much (we call this diminishing returns to capital). The point is to find a pay rate that creates maximum productivity and maximum potential profit for the firm.

If not, what happens is usually customers and shareholders become disgruntled and picky, which is exactly what DHB65 said.

There are many other factors, of course, but this is the bare-bones wireframe gist of it.

 

[Heath]

Yeah, The nuts and bolts of running a business is never easy. I am more of a people's man than a money man.

Because my belief is that if you take care of people first then the money will take care of itself.

 

[Endymion]

You can also think about it this way. If you're paying 20 people at $8.25 an hour, then you spend $165 per hour for all your labor, excluding overhead and all other costs.

Now, if you give everyone raises to $11/hr, you can only afford 15 workers for a total of $165 per hour.

Unfortunately, that means now the company must send five employees home. You earn more money, but there are less jobs available. This means now you might be able to buy the new motorbike you wanted, but John C. Doe is sent home and he has to feed his kids Ramen.

Again, this is a bare-bones wireframe look at the subject.

 

[Heath]

I shudder to think about sending a man home from work when he really does need that job. That made me think if I owned a business.

I hate to say this but I would have to send the single guys home from work and keep the ones that have a wife and kids on the job unless the single guy is an excellent worker then I am keeping my guy there at work.

I also do not just buy American made goods. I buy from Germany, Italy Britian, Canada etc.

But as long as it is not made in China or Taiwan because I know I will get inferior products that are lousy on the quality in the Oriental countries.

 

[diehardbiker]

Don't forget that employer do have to pay half of SS taxes, workman compensation, etc... that can add up quickly on top of the wages! Most people don't know how expensive this can be! Whats more, of the budget pie in most companies, there is huge chunk of the pie goes to where? LABOR COST! average now around 70%, the rest is overhead cost, even CEO's salary!

Just think about this, for every dime increase in wage, it can end up millions of dollars in annual pay out! Here is good senario! Say, a dime increase on pay for 5,000 employees, the annual increase cost would be $1,040,000 (A million dollars already!) PLUS increase SS taxes owed to uncle sam! That is around what CEO generally gets paid! Just a dime per employee!!! This is astrondished!

What is worse is that it does not include overtime. Just standard hours, that is all.

Don't believe it? Use your own calculator and see for yourself!

You can also think about it this way. If you're paying 20 people at $8.25 an hour, then you spend $165 per hour for all your labor, excluding overhead and all other costs.

Now, if you give everyone raises to $11/hr, you can only afford 15 workers for a total of $165 per hour.

Unfortunately, that means now the company must send five employees home. You earn more money, but there are less jobs available. This means now you might be able to buy the new motorbike you wanted, but John C. Doe is sent home and he has to feed his kids Ramen.

Again, this is a bare-bones wireframe look at the subject.

 

[Cheri]

Diehardbiker, if you want to spout vehemently against the AFL-CIO , by all means then make your own thread on this

You have to learn to accept disagreement even if you don't like it, You cannot just say go create a new thread when you already brought it up to begin with.

 

[Endymion]

I shudder to think about sending a man home from work when he really does need that job. That made me think if I owned a business.

I hate to say this but I would have to send the single guys home from work and keep the ones that have a wife and kids on the job unless the single guy is an excellent worker then I am keeping my guy there at work.

I understand your point, but I am not certain I agree. You probably would find multiple lawsuits hot on your tail in a flash. Heath, Inc would go into money trouble pretty quick.

The principle is the same as, "Hey, you look like you're deaf. You have SSI, don't come to work for me, the hearing guy needs the money." You would be upset, wouldn't you?

Plus we single people have needs too. What if a single person is housing five homeless children and helping them? Or what if she is $50,000 in debt because of medical expenses? She needs the job just as much as the married worker.

I also do not just buy American made goods. I buy from Germany, Italy Britian, Canada etc.

Buy on quality. Like if I'm choosing wine, I'd much prefer Chianti from Italy than something made in Tinyville, Ohio. Unless, of course, Tinyville Chianti turned out to the best in the world.

But as long as it is not made in China or Taiwan because I know I will get inferior products that are lousy on the quality in the Oriental countries.

Not necessarily. The Chinese and Taiwanese do have their perks. You can't tell quality by location. It's like always expecting "McDonald's" to have delicious hamburgers. Then you go to the McDonald's on 23rd and Broadway and you find out the kitchen staff sneeze in the food regularly.

 

[Banjo]

Care explain what happened to 25 steel mills that once in production in Pittsburgh. Now only 2 left....

Working in a steel mill is dangerous. People has gotten killed in these places. So why should one work for peanuts working in a place like that and without or little benefits?

In fact, my brother-in-law was instantly killed on duty and he worked there for more than 9 years. This happened over a year ago. It wasn't his fault either, it was a material that got loose and hit him in the back of his skull. It's pretty much common knowledge that steel mills tend to violate many safety rules and compromise everybody's safety. Thank god for the union, my niece now has a fund established for life for the loss of her father.

You won't find a lot of people willing to work for eight bucks per hour working in a steel mill these days.

Care to explain back in 1970, you could buy nice caddy for 5k bux, now it is 50K+[/QUOTE]

Remember, there's something called inflation. Plus cadillic is considered a luxury car model line-up in today's world. It's aimed at the people who want to burn their money, not the middle-class folks.

Care to explain why IBEW (International Brotherhood of Electricial Workers)refused to hire deafies?

How is this relevant to the subject? That's just a case of discrimination, nothing more.

Care to explain how my utiltiy bills got SHOT up by 80%, the utility company became unionized a year ago.

That's only because the company is trying to reap the same profits they've generated in previous years. Greed, greed, and greed, that's all it is.

There are many workplaces that aren't unionized and their salaries haven't went up at all in years, even some haven't went up in more than a decade yet the costs of living are going up, up, up and not down. It's nearly impossible to get some changes made without an union especially under a corporation.

I have bet that you looking for cheaper products, same way with companies looking for cheaper labor, so that they can sell you products at lower prices.

That's competition, and the reason why everything is so cheap is due to cheap labor. Yet they're still ripping you off because the materials they use to build these products are ridiculously cheap and third-world countries build them for the USA.

You still haven't justified the reason why General Motors is cutting 35,000 jobs in North America even though their profits were pretty darn good.

You're pretty biased when it come to unions, I'll say that. There are both good and bad sides to having corporations, but I do believe that America has a bad case of over-corporatizing. Do we really need all these big box retailers? Do we really need 5,000 TV channels? Do we really need to be bombarded with 500,000 advertisements a day from the internet, gas pump handles, bank machines, urinals, ashtrays, taxis, billboards and our own mail box?

A big NO!

Having competitors is good, but these aren't competitors, they're killers. They kill small businesses, they do whatever they can to crush the small businesses to small pieces.

Microsoft is a fine example to begin with, so is Wal-Mart. The only reason why I make SOME of my purchases at Wal-Mart is because you cannot find them anywhere else because they've killed all the small businesses. I can't find DVDs in small stores, at least not where I live. I have needs, I wouldn't mind buying them at small stores if they actually do sell what I'm looking for.

Honestly, I don't think too much of seeing the same store in every town I pass by. It lacks originality and isn't refreshing at all. It makes all places more of the same instead of different from each other.

Which one would I want to live in... Wal-Country or Canada?

Canada.

 

[Heath]

You all bring up good points and the situation is always dicey at best. There are no set answers and no 100% absoutles. For every answer in a business, there is always another problem to deal with which is normal and it is part of doing business.

 

[Endymion]

Banjo,

Just an interesting bit of information unrelated to the discussion. Did you know that at one time in the United States, corporations had very, very restricted rights and limited powers?

The 1886 landmark decision Santa Clara County vs. Southern Pacific Railroad opened the doors and endowed corporate entities with almost all the rights of a national citizen.

 

[Banjo]

Banjo,

Just an interesting bit of information unrelated to the discussion. Did you know that at one time in the United States, corporations had very, very restricted rights and limited powers?

The 1886 landmark decision Santa Clara County vs. Southern Pacific Railroad opened the doors and endowed corporate entities with almost all the rights of a national citizen.

Then wouldn't you say that it led to a large amount of abuse among the workers leading to the birth of many unions. By the way, where the heck is Hoffa? ;-)

 

[Endymion]

Then wouldn't you say that it led to a large amount of abuse among the workers leading to the birth of many unions. By the way, where the heck is Hoffa? ;-)

Oh a lot of problems came up. I find it funny that the Sherman Antitrust Act (1890) came four years after that, along with a lot of other legal decisions.

Labor exploitation was MUCH worse back at the turn of the 1900s. Since then, forward progress has been made through many political efforts, including enactment of the Fair Labor Standards Act (1938) and the Occupational Safety and Health Act (1970).

But corporate exploitation happens on a lot more levels than just labor relations. We have the Securities Act of 1933, which helps prevent securities fraud by requiring all securities sold in the US to be registered. There are also the Investment Advisers Act of 1940 and the Glass-Steagall Act of 1932 which was repealed recently by the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act of 1999.


Oh yea, and ...


Hoffa's buried in my back yard. The bastard tried to touch my then-girlfriend so I showed him goooooooooooood.

 

[pek1]

Diehardbiker, if you want to spout vehemently against the AFL-CIO , by all means then make your own thread on this and if you want to quit complaining go to a job that is union backed then you will be all smiles. I am Pro-Union.

You're Republican and Pro-Union??? :roll: That is a shocker!!!! You have to be kidding?!!

 

[pek1]

Really? Then care to explain why General Motors is actually making more and more money than they ever did yet they are cutting more than 30,000 jobs?

(scoff)

Sorry, but it's the corporations who are being the cheapskates. The same goes for Wal-Mart... only god know how much money they make by keeping so many people on min. wages.

Take a look at Wal-Mart stock, then look at Northwest Airlines stock, then compare their salaries. No, Heath, you would say you wouldn't pay your employees that much money (as if it's a lot), just say you "won't" pay them that much, as paying them more may help them pay their own bills and live in the United States. I, personally, am 100% in favor of NAFTA and CAFTA, as well as all trade, as it is better for all countries.

 

[pek1]

Suppose your shopping for car, and that car from factory A cost you $5,000 dollars and the payment for monthly is 99 bux, while car from Factory B cost $12,000 and have monthly payment of 250 dollars a month.

Which one are you gonna buy from?

Remember the monthly payment is based on interest rate, that is why 2nd one got little higher payment.

diehardbiker65,

I'm in the market right now for a brand new car or truck. Among the ones I am considering are: Subaru Forester (test drove one today); Honda Ridgeline; Honda CRV; Honda Element; Toyota Tundra; Toyota Highlander. Do you know what I am basing my information on? Research, research and more research. The price doesn't move me, the quality of the vehicle does, as well as its testing and resale value. I also have the latest issue of the new car guide by Consumer Reports. http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/home.htm

 

[pek1]

I also do not just buy American made goods. I buy from Germany, Italy Britian, Canada etc.

But as long as it is not made in China or Taiwan because I know I will get inferior products that are lousy on the quality in the Oriental countries.

Heath,

Two things: Define "American Made" and, what makes you think everything made in China and Taiwan are inferior, because the people there aren't "white" like you?

 

[Endymion]

I'm in the market right now for a brand new car or truck.

The new car market is very unscrupulous. You may already know about the information I'm mentioning, but I have literature on all the things the salesmen of the industry pull on you to get you to pay well above MSRP. It also explains how to keep your purchasing price just slightly above MSRP and how to avoid complete rip-offs, like $1,200 rust insurance for your brand new car.

Let me know if you want that stuff--I'm always glad to share!

 

[Banjo]

Let me know if you want that stuff--I'm always glad to share!

Psst... me too. I'm also looking for a car. A new one, that is.

 

[pek1]

The new car market is very unscrupulous. You may already know about the information I'm mentioning, but I have literature on all the things the salesmen of the industry pull on you to get you to pay well above MSRP. It also explains how to keep your purchasing price just slightly above MSRP and how to avoid complete rip-offs, like $1,200 rust insurance for your brand new car.

Let me know if you want that stuff--I'm always glad to share!

Sure! Would love to have some information...pm me, will give you my e-mail address, Endymion.