Obama Embraces 'Death Panel' Concept in Medicare Rule

craigm26 said:
More like States "struggling" to find a balance between new federal health laws and their state-run programs?
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Regardless, the feds control all of the health professions through FDA and individual state laws don't mean a thing to the feds. The state might find itself in a pickle about followering federal laws but the government does not give a damn about the states.
 
craigm26 said:
What's FDA?
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Federal Drug Admininstration

They and only they can approve a drug to go on the market and also they alone can approve a medical procedure. Doctors are not allow to prescribe medicine or do anything without FDA's premission. Therefore, the feds control everything. Logicial conclusion!
 
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:facepalm: <I might need more coffee>

I see what you're saying but...no Feds don't control everything. How do doctors bill patients? Using what terminology set and values of labor developed by whom(not the feds!gasp!)?
 
rolling7 said:
Federal Drug Admininstration

They and only they can approve a drug to go on the market and also they alone can approve a medical procedure. Doctors are not allow to prescribe medicine or do anything without FDA's premission. Therefore, the feds control everything. Logicial conclusion!
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Who exactly would you want doing the extensive research necessary to approve a medication for use? Members of the mechanics union?

And a doctor's right to prescribe is not issued under the FDA. That comes from the DEA.
 
jillio said:
Who exactly would you want doing the extensive research necessary to approve a medication for use? Members of the mechanics union?

And a doctor's right to prescribe is not issued under the FDA. That comes from the DEA.
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1) Studies are done by private companies But the FDA still controls the end result. That is if or not more study is needed, the drug is too dangerous, the drug is not benefical. etc. In other words, the company's study results don't mean shit if the FDA will not approve.

2) That also hold true for any invasive operation that doctors want to preform meaning no doctor could treat you in a hospital using an unauthorized method. Disclaimer: emergancy is emergancy...all rules are out the door

3) Even with medicine that is over-the-counter, the FDA controls it! Think Plan B> The pill is allowed to be dispended over-the-counter but there are FDA rules about identification and how often the pill can be brought.

4) I agree with you about DEA but they only follow behind FDA. For example if FDA orders a recall and something is still being sold, then, and only then, does DEA go after the sellers.

5) Lets say you want to die on your own terms (forget the reason and all the bs for doing this) and you find a doctor in support of your decision. That doctor, as of now, CAN NOT prescribe anything for you to take because the FDA says NO!!!!

Now, says you, just who is in control of YOUR life??
 
I am probably going to offend some but here is fair warning


I think Obama misjudged the intelligence of the American people he leads. The vast majority of people read a headline the first and last sentence if that or they watch tv and listen to sides that are swayed one side or the other, such as this article. If you read it and I mean really read it you can clearly see the message that this message is trying to convey and if you are really reading you can also see hints of what the meaning really is, but most are lazy and don't read or investigate, or simply by human nature hear what they want to hear.

If anyone really wanted to take their life then they could do it prescription not needed.
 
rolling7 said:
1) Studies are done by private companies But the FDA still controls the end result. That is if or not more study is needed, the drug is too dangerous, the drug is not benefical. etc. In other words, the company's study results don't mean shit if the FDA will not approve.

Like I said...who do you want doing the research? I prefer that the medical research scientists do it, and review the results. Perhaps you would rather a used car salesman did it. The FDA has to have scientific evidence that the drug is not effacious for the purpose for which it is intended or that the risk outweigh the benefits. Again, who do you want interpreting research experiment results?
2) That also hold true for any invasive operation that doctors want to preform meaning no doctor could treat you in a hospital using an unauthorized method. Disclaimer: emergancy is emergancy...all rules are out the door

Incorrect. Any teaching hospital can do experimental procedures, provided the practitioner has been trained to do so. All you have to do is sign a release stating that you understand that it is an experimental procedure and accept responsibility for your decision.

3) Even with medicine that is over-the-counter, the FDA controls it! Think Plan B> The pill is allowed to be dispended over-the-counter but there are FDA rules about identification and how often the pill can be brought.

Of course they do. I personally want my OTC meds controlled so that I know I am getting what I am supposed to be getting when I purchase it. And the limits on the time limits for a very few OTC are because of the abuse potential. Duh. Iguess you would rather that anyone be allowed to manufacture OTC meds out of their barn and put them on the shelves.
4) I agree with you about DEA but they only follow behind FDA. For example if FDA orders a recall and something is still being sold, then, and only then, does DEA go after the sellers.

Again, incorrect. And recalls are issued for a reason. I guess you would rather have unsafe medications being sold to the public.5) Lets say you want to die on your own terms (forget the reason and all the bs for doing this) and you find a doctor in support of your decision. That doctor, as of now, CAN NOT prescribe anything for you to take because the FDA says NO!!!!

Again, wrong. PAS is currently legal in 2 states in the U.S. and the FDA has virtually nothing to do with it.
Now, says you, just who is in control of YOUR life??
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I am in control of my life. You need to make an attempt to be in control of your knowledge before you post all of this innaccurate information. Fear is the possession of the uninformed.
 
Go back and re-read my post!!! "Studies are done by private companies" Just like you I would rather medical research scientists do the reviews but keep in mind the companies hire them and control the release of the study. Nevertheless, "if the FDA will not approve" it will be because the FDA's scientists trump the private company's scientists.

You are right that PAS is legal in 2 states but for the other 48, the FDA will not allow a doctor to prescribe nor use the drugs that the doctors in those two states use. So my point that the FDA controls PAS is valid until ALL states have legal PAS.

Thank you for saying that FDA controls OTC meds, you valiated my point that FDA IS in control.

Again, you are right that a teaching hospital can do experimental procedures. However, as you well know, before they can they have to get the FDA's approval and follow the rules written by FDA. So once again you have made my point for me that the FDA is in control.

As ember says "If anyone really wants to take their life then they could do it prescription not needed". My point was that people should be able to end their life painless but the FDA will not allow doctors (again, in 48 states) to help someone do so.

None of my information is innaccurate. You are just being nit-picky!
 
rolling7 said:
As ember says "If anyone really wants to take their life then they could do it prescription not needed". My point was that people should be able to end their life painless but the FDA will not allow doctors (again, in 48 states) to help someone do so.
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You want painless? You want cheap and legal? Drive down to the gas station. Fill your tank. Drive home. Pull into the garage. Close the doors of the garage. Tilt your seat back. Let the car run.
 
rolling7 said:
Go back and re-read my post!!! "Studies are done by private companies" Just like you I would rather medical research scientists do the reviews but keep in mind the companies hire them and control the release of the study. Nevertheless, "if the FDA will not approve" it will be because the FDA's scientists trump the private company's scientists.

You are right that PAS is legal in 2 states but for the other 48, the FDA will not allow a doctor to prescribe nor use the drugs that the doctors in those two states use. So my point that the FDA controls PAS is valid until ALL states have legal PAS.

Thank you for saying that FDA controls OTC meds, you valiated my point that FDA IS in control.

Again, you are right that a teaching hospital can do experimental procedures. However, as you well know, before they can they have to get the FDA's approval and follow the rules written by FDA. So once again you have made my point for me that the FDA is in control.

As ember says "If anyone really wants to take their life then they could do it prescription not needed". My point was that people should be able to end their life painless but the FDA will not allow doctors (again, in 48 states) to help someone do so.

None of my information is innaccurate. You are just being nit-picky!
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I read your post. I understood your post. My replies still stand.

Nit-picky? Yeah, when it comes to the truth, I am nit-picky. When it comes to people making totally innacurate statements in regard to something they know absolutely nothing about, I am nit-picky. If people are provided the facts, they don't end up having absurd opinions such as the one you are posting here.

And, the FDA has absolutely nothing to do with whether PAS is legal. That is an issue put to the voters. Duh.
 
ember said:
I am probably going to offend some but here is fair warning


I think Obama misjudged the intelligence of the American people he leads. The vast majority of people read a headline the first and last sentence if that or they watch tv and listen to sides that are swayed one side or the other, such as this article. If you read it and I mean really read it you can clearly see the message that this message is trying to convey and if you are really reading you can also see hints of what the meaning really is, but most are lazy and don't read or investigate, or simply by human nature hear what they want to hear.

If anyone really wanted to take their life then they could do it prescription not needed.
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Exactly. And it occurs more often than most would want to believe, especially in the case of terminal illness.
 
jillio said:
I read your post. I understood your post. My replies still stand.

Nit-picky? Yeah, when it comes to the truth, I am nit-picky. When it comes to people making totally innacurate statements in regard to something they know absolutely nothing about, I am nit-picky. If people are provided the facts, they don't end up having absurd opinions such as the one you are posting here.

And, the FDA has absolutely nothing to do with whether PAS is legal. That is an issue put to the voters. Duh.
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Once again, you are right but when you say that the FDA has nothing to do with PAS being legal in two states, that is a limited truth. The FDA controls the other 48 and doctors in those states can not help people. These same doctors, who have their own opinion about life and death, could switch state to one of the 2 and then prescribe. So, logically, yes the FDA is in control.
 
On another matter. Does anyone know of a medical issue other than abortion that has been put before the voters. We all should know that those two, PSA and abortion, are hot topics within each state and I'm trying to think of any other possiblity that has been put before the voters. Thanks for the help, if you can think of one and share.

P>S> some may think a sentence of death as justice is a medical issue BUT lets leave that one out.
 
On another topic related to this, I'm trying to think of any medical issue other than abortion that has been presented to the voters of any state. Some may think that the sentence of death for justice is a medical issue BUT lets leave that one out. We should all know that PAS and abortion are hot issues for the voters and I'm just trying to learn if other issues have been brought up. Thanks for the help, if you can come up with one.
 
rolling7 said:
On another matter. Does anyone know of a medical issue other than abortion that has been put before the voters. We all should know that those two, PSA and abortion, are hot topics within each state and I'm trying to think of any other possiblity that has been put before the voters. Thanks for the help, if you can think of one and share.

P>S> some may think a sentence of death as justice is a medical issue BUT lets leave that one out.
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Allowing marijuana use for medical purposes is one. I am in favor of this. I mean, opiates are allowed, along with many other misused drugs. There are people that really do benefit from marijuana use in a medical setting. Why is morphine allowed, but not marijuana? :hmm:
 
Good point and I agree. I was thinking of this before my post but could not decide if mj is classified as a real drug. Like all kinds of booze, I have trouble thinking of mj as a real drug. Nevertheless, it has been put before the voters...so one point for you!
 
rolling7 said:
Once again, you are right but when you say that the FDA has nothing to do with PAS being legal in two states, that is a limited truth. The FDA controls the other 48 and doctors in those states can not help people. These same doctors, who have their own opinion about life and death, could switch state to one of the 2 and then prescribe. So, logically, yes the FDA is in control.
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You logic is very faulty. FDA has virtually nothing to do with PAS. And your attempt to try and make things the way you want them to be is faulty as well.
 
rolling7 said:
Good point and I agree. I was thinking of this before my post but could not decide if mj is classified as a real drug. Like all kinds of booze, I have trouble thinking of mj as a real drug. Nevertheless, it has been put before the voters...so one point for you!
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But the DEA, not the FDA, classifies it as a drug.:cool2 An illegal one. The DEA also classifies morphine as a narcotic drug and places limits on the amounts that can be prescribed by one doctor for one patient in a certain amount of time. Again, nothing to do with the FDA, but something the DEA oversees and regulates.
 
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