How to Decide on Cochlear Implant Surgery for Children

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rockdrummer said:
A said:
yep. I guess beautiful speech is like music to people's ear. I have speech, but I don't sound beautiful to them. No wonder they laugh and mock me. It's the beautiful speech they only care about.
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How old are you or the people that mock you? Sounds like an immature group to me.
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Ha, I can relate. A lot of them come from teachers and TAs.
 
jillio said:
CIs can allow for both perception and discrimination, to be true. However, they do not always do so. And I think parents need to know the difference, and what the real life implications are.

Yes, a very different story.
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right but you can't discriminate sound if you can't percieve it. For some the CI will allow for sound perception which then can lead to making use of those sounds. Unless I have misunderstood something, you would have zero chance of discrimination if you don't have perception.
 
rick48 said:
I guess it depends on one's perspective.

For a a young profoundly deaf girl who could not benefit from either HAs or FM trainers but with a cochlear implant was able to not only hear sounds but to develop excellent speech with relative ease, maybe not a "miracle" but pretty damm good and definitely worth her parents' decision and the abuse they took from the Deaf community.

Also, the reality is that there are now thousands of other children just like her, again not "miracles' but living and loving proof as to the tremendous impact that a cochlear implant can have upon one's life.

On the whole the cochlear implant community seems to have a more optimistic view towards life.
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This kind of comment implies that deaf people without CIs do not have a good view towards life and that attitude could be the reason you got "abuse" from the Deaf community. Who wants someone to make implications like these that we lack an optimistic view on life? :roll:
 
shel90 said:
This kind of comment implies that deaf people without CIs do not have a good view towards life and that attitude could be the reason you got "abuse" from the Deaf community. Who wants someone to make implications like these that we lack an optimistic view on life? :roll:
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I think what Rick was saying is in comparison to his perception of Jillio's view. Not to deaf people without CI's. I would leave it to him for clearification though.
 
souggy said:
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Now you understand where the mistrust come from?
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I can not imagine that if a teacher is mocking a deaf kid that other teachers and staff would be ok with this. If I were working at a school and I saw a teacher doing this I would grab that teacher and say WTF? If I see this again you will be reported. It would be hard to believe this is a widespread problem.
 
rockdrummer said:
I think what Rick was saying is in comparison to his perception of Jillio's view. Not to deaf people without CI's. I would leave it to him for clearification though.
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Jillio's post that his post was in reference didnt mention about the CI community..just about how CIs arent the "miracles" the industry made them to be and then Rick made a reference to the Deaf community hence the reason how I took his wording.

However, you are probably right..thanks for bringing another interpretation to that comment.

Rick, if I was wrong in interpreting that comment then my apologies.
 
rockdrummer said:
I can not imagine that if a teacher is mocking a deaf kid that other teachers and staff would be ok with this. If I were working at a school and I saw a teacher doing this I would grab that teacher and say WTF? If I see this again you will be reported. It would be hard to believe this is a widespread problem.
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Totally agree with you there 100%.
 
rockdrummer said:
How old are you or the people that mock you? Sounds like an immature group to me.
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Why, you have a hard time believing me? They come in all ages in all sort of places .from my workplace, schools, etc. Some of them mock, some of them complain or criticize. Or think it is cute and giggle about it. Some of them think it is soooooo cute that they ask me to say it again.

I also had people who tell me that I speak well as a compliment when I tell them I'm deaf. which is really confusing because other people make fun of me. What the world?

people say they want CI for beautiful speech and compliment like crazy when their deaf child don't sound like a deaf person. Sooooo.... what's the opposite of beautiful speech? It is something they don't want, but trying to be very nice about it but I know how they truly feel. Therefore, people are obsessed with beautiful speech.

I want to change this attitude toward speech because for years,people try to make them sound more like hearing and make them use their voice. Many have been abused over it even though technologies have improve that lessened that type of abuse. Before technologies, people were desperate to get deaf people to use their voice and not sign. Even my hearing grandma was abused by her very own father for trying to sign to her deaf sisters. Her father wanted them to use their voice. My grandma told me that her father was really denial about them being deaf too. He did not want to accept it. They didn't have the technologies as they do today, so it was very hard for them to use their voice. About my grandma, it is not just the deaf who was abused, but the hearing people around them get abused/suffer as well.. like her. Even CODA kids have to deal with this type of attitude. Technologies and abuses may have improved, the attitude and acceptance have not.

If you want to use CI as a form of communication. fine. But don't use it because you want beautiful speech. Because speech is the reason why many deaf was abused, ignored, discriminated, being made fun of, etc.
 
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A said:
.

. Even though technologies and abuse have improved, the attitude and acceptance have not.
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:werd: I was here 30 yrs ago and to the day, their attitude and acceptance looks same to me. :|
 
A said:
Why, you have a hard time believing me? They come in all ages in all sort of places .from my workplace, schools, etc. Some of them mock, some of them complain or criticize. Or think it is cute and giggle about it. Some of them think it is soooooo cute that they ask me to say it again.

I also had people who tell me that I speak well as a compliment when I tell them I'm deaf. which is really confusing because other people make fun of me. What the world?

people say they want CI for beautiful speech and compliment like crazy when their deaf child don't sound like a deaf person. Sooooo.... what's the opposite of beautiful speech? It is something they don't want, but trying to be very nice about it but I know how they truly feel. Therefore, people are obsessed with beautiful speech.

I want to change this attitude toward speech because for years,people try to make them sound more like hearing and make them use their voice. Many have been abused over it even though technologies have improve that lessened that type of abuse. Before technologies, people were desperate to get deaf people to use their voice and not sign. Even my hearing grandma was abused by her very own father for trying to sign to her deaf sisters. Her father wanted them to act hearing and use their voice. they didn't have the technologies as they do today, so it was very hard for them to use their voice. Even though technologies and abuse have improved, the attitude and acceptance have not.

If you want to use CI as a form of communication. fine. But don't use it because you want beautiful speech. Because speech is the reason why many deaf was abused, ignored, discriminated, being made fun of, etc.
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I totally agree with you on that one 100%!

I was banned from learning ASL as a child so I grew up orally. The point of that is for me to be able to "communicate" with hearing people, right? Well, I was always left out, made fun of, isolated, and etc...speech did not do much for me like ASL did when I finally learned it.
 
What does Werd mean? weird? am I weird?
 
ok, I see it often, but I never knew what it mean.
 
faire_jour said:
Once piece done in the last five years.

Actually, I'm exaggerating because it would take more than one. I have read many that show that kids get tons of language benefit from CI's. So, maybe 10....
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They're available. Inf act, links and citations to many more than that have been posted here ad nausium.
 
rockdrummer said:
right but you can't discriminate sound if you can't percieve it. For some the CI will allow for sound perception which then can lead to making use of those sounds. Unless I have misunderstood something, you would have zero chance of discrimination if you don't have perception.
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Well, that is true. But simple perception does not translate to discrimination, particularly when we are talking about the speech ranges. There are those that can perceive sound in the speech range, but be unable to discriminate a single syllable without visual cues. Too many parents and general ed teachers (not to mention special ed teachers) have no concept of the distinction.
 
shel90 said:
Jillio's post that his post was in reference didnt mention about the CI community..just about how CIs arent the "miracles" the industry made them to be and then Rick made a reference to the Deaf community hence the reason how I took his wording.

However, you are probably right..thanks for bringing another interpretation to that comment.

Rick, if I was wrong in interpreting that comment then my apologies.
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You didn't misinterpret.
 
A said:
Why, you have a hard time believing me? They come in all ages in all sort of places .from my workplace, schools, etc. Some of them mock, some of them complain or criticize. Or think it is cute and giggle about it. Some of them think it is soooooo cute that they ask me to say it again.

I also had people who tell me that I speak well as a compliment when I tell them I'm deaf. which is really confusing because other people make fun of me. What the world?

people say they want CI for beautiful speech and compliment like crazy when their deaf child don't sound like a deaf person. Sooooo.... what's the opposite of beautiful speech? It is something they don't want, but trying to be very nice about it but I know how they truly feel. Therefore, people are obsessed with beautiful speech.

I want to change this attitude toward speech because for years,people try to make them sound more like hearing and make them use their voice. Many have been abused over it even though technologies have improve that lessened that type of abuse. Before technologies, people were desperate to get deaf people to use their voice and not sign. Even my hearing grandma was abused by her very own father for trying to sign to her deaf sisters. Her father wanted them to use their voice. My grandma told me that her father was really denial about them being deaf too. He did not want to accept it. They didn't have the technologies as they do today, so it was very hard for them to use their voice. About my grandma, it is not just the deaf who was abused, but the hearing people around them get abused/suffer as well.. like her. Even CODA kids have to deal with this type of attitude. Technologies and abuses may have improved, the attitude and acceptance have not.

If you want to use CI as a form of communication. fine. But don't use it because you want beautiful speech. Because speech is the reason why many deaf was abused, ignored, discriminated, being made fun of, etc.
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Wonderful post. And I certainly don't have a difficult time believing you. I have seen the same.
 
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