US toddler shoots younger brother

jillio said:
I was wondering the same thing. Its 3 AM. You are awakened by someone coming in through your front door. You have to get up, get to the safe, get the safe unlocked, and get the gun out. How do you manage to do all that without alerting the intruder to your movements, and still manage to take the intruder by surprise?
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You hope the intruder is blind and deaf!
 
The poor child! She had no idea what was going to happen! Why would parents keep a loaded gun under a bed when they little kids! How dumb can a person be! Hello ! keep the gun some place where a kid can't get to it! This is a real horrible tragedy that everyone in that family has to live with the rest of their life!
 
whatdidyousay! said:
The poor child! She had no idea what was going to happen! Why would parents keep a loaded gun under a bed when they little kids! How dumb can a person be! Hello ! keep the gun some place where a kid can't get to it! This is a real horrible tragedy that everyone in that family has to live with the rest of their life!
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or keep the clip seperate from the gun and have the gun locked up when your not around, hence under the pillow, unless your a heavy sleeper (then again Id have the bedroom door locked so the kiddos cant get in
 
My dad was showing the family how to handle a hunting rifle , we were in the kitchen and my mom was standing near my dad . Dad said to always point the rifle toward the ground incase it loaded! Then he fired the rifle thinking it was NOT loaded , it went off and shot a hole in the floor! It would had killed our mom if dad held it up! Dad did kill the water heater , he shot a huge hole in it! That was the end of our lessons in how to handle a rifle! The rifle was packed up a put away!
 
whatdidyousay! said:
My dad was showing the family how to handle a hunting rifle , we were in the kitchen and my mom was standing near my dad . Dad said to always point the rifle toward the ground incase it loaded! Then he fired the rifle thinking it was NOT loaded , it went off and shot a hole in the floor! It would had killed our mom if dad held it up! Dad did kill the water heater , he shot a huge hole in it! That was the end of our lessons in how to handle a rifle! The rifle was packed up a put away!
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:shock:

Reminds me of the cop that was doing a demo at school about guns. Shot himself in the foot!

Holy crap!!
 
Babyface said:
or keep the clip seperate from the gun and have the gun locked up when your not around, hence under the pillow, unless your a heavy sleeper (then again Id have the bedroom door locked so the kiddos cant get in
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locking the bedroom it a great idea, but I bet a lot of parents would not think of it! Like the one that lost their child in this post!
 
whatdidyousay! said:
My dad was showing the family how to handle a hunting rifle , we were in the kitchen and my mom was standing near my dad . Dad said to always point the rifle toward the ground incase it loaded! Then he fired the rifle thinking it was NOT loaded , it went off and shot a hole in the floor! It would had killed our mom if dad held it up! Dad did kill the water heater , he shot a huge hole in it! That was the end of our lessons in how to handle a rifle! The rifle was packed up a put away!
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that's why we're always taught - always assume the gun is loaded. treat it like it's a loaded gun. period. no excuse. no if, no but.

if you hand gun to someone because he wants to see it or whatever the reason is, simple - safety on, remove magazine, eject bullet in chamber, open the action, and inspect the chamber. then.... give the gun to him :)
 
jillio said:
Couldn't agree with you more. It should simply be common sense. I was raised around firearms, and in fact learned to shoot by the time I was 6. Guns were always unloaded and locked up in my home, even though we were taught gun safety from the time we were toddlers.
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yes. gun safety is taught and learned. many gun owners are first-timer with no family member or friend to teach them. Safety Course is not required when obtaining firearm. I may want to push for gun safety course requirement.

jillio said:
But CAP laws are still designed to regulate the storage of firearms in the cases of people who are not using common sense. My whole point is, Jiro has always argued for less regulation on the basis that regulation does not save lives. However, in the states with CAP laws, which is a regulation imposed on gun owners, accidental gun deaths have gone down. But it still does not require for guns to be locked in a vault as was claimed.
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no..... no....... no...... that's not what I said. Not even close.

1. this is what you said to Foxrac - "But the law doesn't require them to keep guns locked away. Therefore, there is no law to punish them for not locking them away."
-I corrected you that the law exists to punish them for failing to secure their firearms that resulted in child/teen deaths.

2. I argued that MORE gun restrictions do not save lives nor made any intended impact that it was designed to do.

3. Safety Regulation and CAP Law do not equate to Gun Restriction. Gun Restriction Law LIMITS your ability in owning firearm - for ie.... one pistol per month. My one-line recommendation in addiction to CAP Law does not cause any hindrance in purchasing firearm because one can simply buy a $20 trigger lock along with firearm.
 
Jiro said:
yes. gun safety is taught and learned. many gun owners are first-timer with no family member or friend to teach them. Safety Course is not required when obtaining firearm. I may want to push for gun safety course requirement.


no..... no....... no...... that's not what I said. Not even close.

1. this is what you said to Foxrac - "But the law doesn't require them to keep guns locked away. Therefore, there is no law to punish them for not locking them away."
-I corrected you that the law exists to punish them for failing to secure their firearms that resulted in child/teen deaths.

2. I argued that MORE gun restrictions do not save lives nor made any intended impact that it was designed to do.

3. Safety Regulation and CAP Law do not equate to Gun Restriction. Gun Restriction Law LIMITS your ability in owning firearm - for ie.... one pistol per month. My one-line recommendation in addiction to CAP Law does not cause any hindrance in purchasing firearm because one can simply buy a $20 trigger lock along with firearm.
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Restrictions also include how you are legally permitted to handle that firearm once it is purchased.

And I still say the law does not punish for not having a gun locked up. It punishes for "careless storage." "Careless storage is not limited to "locked up." If it were, the law would use the wording "locked up" and not "careless storage." Nor does the law mandate that guns be "locked up", as you so claimed. In fact, the law doesn't mandate storage policy at all, but simply addresses the issue of "careless storage" AFTER a child has already gotten ahold of the gun and injured or killed another person, or used it in another act of violence.
 
jillio said:
Restrictions also include how you are legally permitted to handle that firearm once it is purchased.
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Yes that would be a form of gun restriction in order to obtain this firearm - you're required to know how to use it and be certified for it like Class D driver license and CDL. However - I don't support this idea. Thankfully, this kind of law does not exist unless you're applying for CCW permit.

jillio said:
And I still say the law does not punish for not having a gun locked up. It punishes for "careless storage." "Careless storage is not limited to "locked up." If it were, the law would use the wording "locked up" and not "careless storage." Nor does the law mandate that guns be "locked up", as you so claimed. In fact, the law doesn't mandate storage policy at all, but simply addresses the issue of "careless storage" AFTER a child has already gotten ahold of the gun and injured or killed another person, or used it in another act of violence.
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yes but half of your statement was incorrect so I feel it's my obligation to correct it and to inform others of this Child Access Prevention Law aka CAP. Like I said - the law is designed to be broad because it comes with common sense. The more specific the law is, the more useless this law is. That's why CAP is designed to be as broad as possible because it's pretty obvious that you're supposed to lock it up otherwise why would you be charged with CAP law?

and yes there are many laws that are used to charge people with such as DWT, DUI, child endangerment, etc. AFTER the incident occurred. That's why I'm proposing adding my one-line to it... to require them to provide proof of purchase of gun safety locks or face fines (weekly fines). If you want to focus on gun restrictions to prevent child accidental deaths, then you'll have to apply same principle to thousand of other laws regarding children. Impractical, costly, and unenforceable.
 
Jiro said:
Yes that would be a form of gun restriction in order to obtain this firearm - you're required to know how to use it and be certified for it like Class D driver license and CDL. However - I don't support this idea. Thankfully, this kind of law does not exist unless you're applying for CCW permit.


yes but half of your statement was incorrect so I feel it's my obligation to correct it and to inform others of this Child Access Prevention Law aka CAP. Like I said - the law is designed to be broad because it comes with common sense. The more specific the law is, the more useless this law is. That's why CAP is designed to be as broad as possible because it's pretty obvious that you're supposed to lock it up otherwise why would you be charged with CAP law?

and yes there are many laws that are used to charge people with such as DWT, DUI, child endangerment, etc. AFTER the incident occurred. That's why I'm proposing adding my one-line to it... to require them to provide proof of purchase of gun safety locks or face fines (weekly fines). If you want to focus on gun restrictions to prevent child accidental deaths, then you'll have to apply same principle to thousand of other laws regarding children. Impractical, costly, and unenforceable.
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Exactly what half of my statement was incorrect? You said there were laws requiring guns to be locked up, and cited the CAP laws. I corrected you that is not what these laws state at all. If you are after accuracy, let's stick to what the CAP laws actually say, and what they provide for.
 
Babyblue said:
I agree that the parents were irresponsible.

And should have had the gun locked or at least the room.

Jiro

Quick question.

If your guns are locked in a vault, and you have a double locking mechanism. How prepared are you for an intruder in your home?

By the time you get your gun ready. The intruder has done the deed.
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Yes, that´s what I repeated to question the gun supporters in several gun control debate threads.
 
Babyface said:
screw gun resrtrictions, support your NRA doot doot
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Foxrac said:
Yup, GO NRA!!!!
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way to condone problems like:

Licensed gun dealers have no requirements to report multiple sales of long guns, like the semiautomatic assault style weapons sought by terrorist organizations. So someone can buy long guns by the hundreds and there is no requirement that these sales will be reported to law enforcement.

Licensed gun dealers have to report to federal law enforcement whenever someone buys two or more handguns in 5 business days. But if someone buys a gun, say, every six days the sales do not get reported.

Licensed dealers are allowed to sell guns after three days even if a background check is not completed. As many as 5 percent of background checks are not complete within 3 days. During a 2 1/2 year period, more than 10,000 felons were able to buy guns because their background check was not completed in 3 days.

Police can only trace a serial number back to the first retail sale of a new gun by a licensed gun dealer. Therefore, if someone buys a secondhand gun from a "private" seller, the gun can't be traced back to its illegal seller or the purchaser.

If federally licensed gun dealers fail to report stolen or missing guns, they generally face only misdemeanor charges even though thousands of guns are stolen annually from gun stores. The rifle used by the metro DC snipers was allegedly stolen from a gun store, the same store that "lost or misplaced" 238 guns in three years.

Gun owners are not required to report thefts of their guns to law enforcement. Nearly half a million guns are stolen annually.

Common carriers -- like trucking companies -- do not have to report missing gun shipments.

Licensed dealers convicted of felonies may continue to conduct business through all appeals. which and take a decade

No gun manufacturer has any policy restricting sales of their guns to dealers or wholesalers with a history of selling guns used in crime.

Federal inspectors are barred from conducting surprise inspections of a gun dealer more than once a year and they have no power to impose fines or suspend licenses even if the inspectors have evidence that the dealer is continuing to sell guns that are used in crime.
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points I happen to agree with from a gun control site

US gun policies have many holes that need to be addressed.
 
Babyface said:
well they didnt lock the door and look what happened your right
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locking a door doesn't do shit if someone breaks into the home and steals the gun...

that gun ends up on the streets and crimes are committed with.

it is still irresponsible
 
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