Georgia: English-Only Driver's Tests

[Jiro]

I use my common sense, not make an assumption because the links written is about the people who live in America to ecnonmy and unemployment, not illegal or legal immigrants/migrants.

A person with common sense would know that drivers being uninsured are NOT DIRECTLY linked to economy.

But it´s still no excuse to blame all illegal immigrants for cause the car accidents.

Please kindly point out in my post where I blame ALL illegal immigrants for the cause of car accidents.

I am asking you because you know that they are being offer to get driving liecense by some of states in legal way in America. Right? If yes, how do you know it´s them who cause the road accidents?

I'm sorry but your post makes absolutely no sense to me. Again - use your common sense. Do you think the police would just ticket the drivers who are illegal immigrants? no.... they get arrested and reported to INS. and do you think the illegal immigrants will stick around and wait for police if they get in accidents?

Regardless of situation - it is very very unlikely that they get counted to DMV statistic. They get counted as "Illegal Immigrants" under INS statistic, not DMV.

 

[Jiro]

NJ mulls illegal immigrant driver's license issue

Undocumented immigrants like Alejandro Chavez hope New Jersey finds a way to issue driver's licenses for people who don't have legal residency in the U.S.

Chavez worked in the apple orchards of Washington, one of only four states that issue driver's licenses to illegal immigrants. Now he works on a New Jersey horse farm and can't drive legally.

A state panel wants driving privileges be extended to undocumented workers. But Gov. Jon Corzine says it's up to the federal government to set standards for acceptable identification.
Advertisement

Chavez says denying illegal immigrants the privilege to drive ignores the economic contributions of the state's nearly half a million undocumented immigrants.

Opponents argue illegal immigrant licensing can undermine security and reward law breaking.

 

[Jiro]

NCLR - National Council of La Raza (the largest national Hispanic civil rights and advocacy organization in the United States – works to improve opportunities for Hispanic Americans.)

Driver's Licenses

Overview
In recent years there has been much legislation and other activity in the states which impose harsh restrictions specifically on immigrants’ access to state-issued driver’s licenses and identification documents. These proposals go well beyond denying undocumented immigrants access to driver’s licenses and have the potential to exclude legal immigrants and even U.S. citizens from state-issued identification documents. Moreover, they are of great concern because they prohibit drivers from being properly licensed and insured, discriminate against immigrants and other groups, and make entire communities less safe.

Update: The REAL ID Act
In May 2005 the REAL ID Act was passed into law. The REAL ID Act places federal restrictions and requirements on state-issued driver's licenses and requires all states to change their driver's license laws to comply with the federal standards. For more information on the REAL ID Act, click here.
NCLR Position

NCLR believes that a state-issued driver’s license should be reliable proof of an individual’s identity and proof of authorization to drive a motor vehicle; it should not be tied to an individual’s immigration status. There are legitimate and sound avenues for individuals to prove identity which would allow state Departments of Motor Vehicles to fulfill their mission of ensuring safe roads without creating new licensing requirements that would make the driver’s license a de facto proof of legal residency in the United States.

I believe NCLR needs to STFU and not ask what we can do for them. They should do what they can for America for giving them opportunities that they cannot get in their hometown like better $$$ and life - apply for LEGAL RESIDENCY, do not sneak into this country illegally, pay the tax, and be a good citizen/resident.

REAL ID Act (passed in May 2005)

 

[Byrdie714]

rhetoric? here's a bigger picture? let's see -

1. many immigrants are converting their little communities in USA into a bigger community, demanding that we cater to them with translations and they didn't even bother learning English
2. they're milking our free services to their advantage so that they can send money to their families oversea and then move out when they collect enough money - in other word... they're a LEECH
3. population & diversity is rapidly growing and growing. Ever wonder why racism is still ongoing in here? Learn & speak English so we all can live together harmoniously
4. What's wrong with paying for your own translator? The states offer free English classes

I'm not trying to sound like Rush Limbaugh or xenophobic in here but it's a concern for me - financially, politically, and legally. I see our system being abused too often and this is the financial pit hole. Not war or bailout.

1. No different than little "Seoul Town" that we have with the Koreans carving out their little enclaves. Secondly--it's always the responsibility of the second generation immigrants to speak better English than their ancestors do.

2. LEECH? No--it's called freedom and capitalism. The same values that you hold dear to your little heart. Or don't you anymore?

3. Diveristy is growing not due to immigration--it's growing due to inter-marriages of different races.

4. Paying for translators due occur on a daily basis.

5. Your rant of "Speak English Only" is getting to be a little nerving especially towards us deaf people that don't speak English as we 'sign'. By pushing your belief onto us--you would be advocating the oral English approach. No if's, and's or but's.

Lastly--you may not sound like Rush Limbaugh but you are getting to sound like a deaf version of Kil Il Jong.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

A person with common sense would know that drivers being uninsured are NOT DIRECTLY linked to economy.

Why do you posted 3 links for ?

Please kindly point out in my post where I blame ALL illegal immigrants for the cause of car accidents.

Accord to most of your posts is fingerpoint to illiegal immigrants. Foxrac tried to convince you in some of his posts that it´s not just illiegal immigrants but Americans as well.

I'm sorry but your post makes absolutely no sense to me. Again - use your common sense. Do you think the police would just ticket the drivers who are illegal immigrants? no.... they get arrested and reported to INS. and do you think the illegal immigrants will stick around and wait for police if they get in accidents?

Regardless of situation - it is very very unlikely that they get counted to DMV statistic. They get counted as "Illegal Immigrants" under INS statistic, not DMV.

Oh, I thought you know that some states support driver´s licenses for illegal immigrants in America... :shrug:

 

[Liebling:-)))]

WOW!!! 1 year???? I took driver ed for a few weeks and studied just for an hour for test and then done! I got about more than 95% correct so I got the permit. I know Germany's driver ed is the TOUGHEST in the world.

Yes I am well aware of US driver ed in several debate threads, my American co-workers in real life and my German friends who attended USA for few years described about US driver´s ed. The driver´s ed in USA is similar to British driver´s ed, they both are very simple to answer... here in Germany... :Ohno:

I must answer over hundreds complicated questions and explain why...... and why we have road signs for... why... why... why.... what should we do if we see dying on the road... First Aid... explain... why...how... what I do... over hundreds questions... I must also answer what I know about First Aid... All MUST be accurate... Driving lesson cost a lot of money that´s why it takes most people including me few months to one year or more to study before apply for driving lesson, test, etc. to avoid to re-take the driving test after fail test because it cost us a lot of money... Yes, it´s VERY toughest ... I did it successfully for a first time... *phew* ... Sure, it´s a lot of money but it´s worth because it helps the people to obey traffic law to aviod for pay extra money for re-take the driving lesson and high penalty fine if they disobey traffic law due DUI...

damn! we should have that in here!! make them pay for their own translators!! I like that. Either pay for their own translator out of their pocket or learn English for free!

Yes, I understand your point and agree with you on this. I am against taxpayers to support the cost for foreign language interpreter or English class for immigrats because I beleive that they should moviate to learn by their own willing, not living comfortable under taxpayer´s cost... For me is

 

[Liebling:-)))]

You are just crossed up the topic that you support, you said all driver test must be written in english only and make them to pay for translators, however you want foreigners to learn how to speaking english before take driver test, it doesn't make any sense that you had said.

Get translator to help them, it doesn't make them to learn how speaking english, even you don't realized that most services under government like DMV offers translator for free due law, I don't know what kind of law is, just like ADA for deaf people to get interpreter

You want make same as in Germany, it's compare like apple to orange like you did mentioned in previous post, America is just different, no need to make similar to other countries to make them to learn how speaking english.

I remember from several debate threads over the interpreter´s cost in America. ADers explained that every doctors, lawyers, school, company owners, etc are obligate to pay the interpreter´s cost for deaf/Deaf clients or patient out of their pocket accord ADA law.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

 

[Jiro]

Why do you posted 3 links for ?

to give you some idea on the scale of this problem

Accord to most of your posts is fingerpoint to illiegal immigrants. Foxrac tried to convince you in some of his posts that it´s not just illiegal immigrants but Americans as well.

and do you obviously think I didn't know that? Again - reread my post #14 and onward.

Oh, I thought you know that some states support driver´s licenses for illegal immigrants in America... :shrug:

please re-read my post #103 about Real ID Act

 

[Jiro]

1. No different than little "Seoul Town" that we have with the Koreans carving out their little enclaves. Secondly--it's always the responsibility of the second generation immigrants to speak better English than their ancestors do.

Yes that's fine because they legally immigrated here. It is typically expected of 2nd generation immigrants to speak English however quite a handful don't. That pisses me off. That's why Korean Town aka K-town grows bigger and more "homogeneous" within America... thus having everything translated in Korean. Same for C-town. But then that is a different issue. This is about DMV... if you want to be issued a driver license, then learn basic English (for free) or pay for your own translator/ion.

2. LEECH? No--it's called freedom and capitalism. The same values that you hold dear to your little heart. Or don't you anymore?

Yes... that's true. but here's a thing - we pay tax and we have legal residency status, they don't. It's disgusting to see them taking advantage of our American dream - freedom and capitalism. Many of "so-called immigrants" come and go after they reap in gold.

3. Diveristy is growing not due to immigration--it's growing due to inter-marriages of different races.

do you have a source that backs your claim?

4. Paying for translators due occur on a daily basis.

GOOD! However - at DMV, it's free for Spanish translation.

5. Your rant of "Speak English Only" is getting to be a little nerving especially towards us deaf people that don't speak English as we 'sign'. By pushing your belief onto us--you would be advocating the oral English approach. No if's, and's or but's.

Please keep English and ASL separate. They are a completely different issue. To clump them together as a concern for oral approach is a cheap ploy to redirect the actual issue at hand. Beside - deaf people take driver test in English, don't they? Just like Liebling took her driver test in German in Germany. and what do deaf people read and write in? English, right?

Lastly--you may not sound like Rush Limbaugh but you are getting to sound like a deaf version of Kil Il Jong.

Thanks god I wasn't drinking a milk

 

[Byrdie714]

Yes that's fine because they legally immigrated here. It is typically expected of 2nd generation immigrants to speak English however quite a handful don't. That pisses me off. That's why Korean Town aka K-town grows bigger and more "homogeneous" within America... thus having everything translated in Korean. Same for C-town. But then that is a different issue. This is about DMV... if you want to be issued a driver license, then learn basic English (for free) or pay for your own translator/ion.

Now you are speaking on the behalf of all Koreans everywhere that they immigrated here legally? I don't think so.....

Yes... that's true. but here's a thing - we pay tax and we have legal residency status, they don't. It's disgusting to see them taking advantage of our American dream - freedom and capitalism. Many of "so-called immigrants" come and go after they reap in gold.

Remember that many of these "illegal"s have different residency status that applies to them whether they are here illegally or not or on refugee status, etc.

do you have a source that backs your claim?

Just look at any job application that asks for ones ethnicity. There is a new box to check off. It's called "Combination of more than one race".

GOOD! However - at DMV, it's free for Spanish translation.

Which is okay due to the fact that a certain percentage of the population speaks a different language and the government is following the federal law that mandates that one has to provide language assistance in that particular language.

You think it's bad with Spanish? Seattle has 13 different languages that they have to translate which I'm sure NYC has more than that. No big deal. Fact of life.

Please keep English and ASL separate. They are a completely different issue. To clump them together as a concern for oral approach is a cheap ploy to redirect the actual issue at hand. Beside - deaf people take driver test in English, don't they? Just like Liebling took her driver test in German in Germany. and what do deaf people read and write in? English, right?

Not with the attitude of "speak English"--it isn't. You would need to re-phrase it--English only.

Thanks god I wasn't drinking a milk

Well--I call it as I see it.

 

[Jiro]

Now you are speaking on the behalf of all Koreans everywhere that they immigrated here legally? I don't think so.....

K-town is just few min from here. I grew up in towns with a significant Korean population. I attended high school with a significant Korean population. I live in town with a significant Korean population. I think I know more about it a little better than you What do you think why I cannot make friends with handful of Koreans students at my school? Because they cannot converse in English and they're 2nd generation immigrants!! A very very very few number of those Korean students were recently immigrated so that's understandable. It's simple - because they speak Korean at home and with friends thus not putting much emphasis on learning English. That's why they were placed in ESL program and they didn't give a shit at all. How disappointing....

Remember that many of these "illegal"s have different residency status that applies to them whether they are here illegally or not or on refugee status, etc.

refugee status is a legal status. so is political asylum. Illegal Immigrants are the one who snuck into America ILLEGALLY via shrimp boat, truck, makeshift raft boat, walking thru desert, etc. Illegal Immigrants have only one residency status - DEPORTATION.

Just look at any job application that asks for ones ethnicity. There is a new box to check off. It's called "Combination of more than one race".

i asked for source.... as in statistic or whatsoever that backs your claim, not job application.

Which is okay due to the fact that a certain percentage of the population speaks a different language and the government is following the federal law that mandates that one has to provide language assistance in that particular language.

that federal law needs to be overturned because it's a major financial pit hole. We both know who was the main driving force behind this federal law. This is what happens if we cave in to the biggest minority group who runs the show. I'm pissed that they take advantage of America to their own best interest.

You think it's bad with Spanish? Seattle has 13 different languages that they have to translate which I'm sure NYC has more than that. No big deal. Fact of life.

yep.... yep..... that's why we must take initiation to ensure that majority of RACES in America can speak English and TO CONTRIBUTE to America, not to use American resource to grow their own homogeneous-like communities in America.

Not with the attitude of "speak English"--it isn't. You would need to re-phrase it--English only.

Well - deaf people can read and write in English thus can communicate with hearing people with pen & paper so deaf people are fine. Immigrants can't so that's my problem and many Americans' problems too. ENGLISH PLEASE! Not ENGRISH.

Well--I call it as I see it.

 

[Jolie77]

Unfortunately - I see that this is not getting anywhere by basing it on English only. I'm not saying that it should be omitted. English is a vital language that needs to be known by all citizens of USA.

If they want to add other languages to it, That's fine but that should also not make it above English because English is one of the main language here in US.

As it was said in the OP -

Georgia is believed to be the only state that would have a law requiring that drivers take the written test in English without a translator or other aid.

My question is - Since it is mentioned that when one obtains a written test in English; They should at least learn to use English but however, without the translator or other aid? That's where I question this because if there's no other aid, How would they be able to learn it otherwise? What I mean is, They may know basic English which I believe should be necessary but the point where it does not have another aid; That's where I don't see how it would work.

I can understand the safety of other drivers when there's road signs or whatever is out there on the road that is being said in English -- but -- it also takes more than knowing it all to the point where others can obtain it differently.

 

[Byrdie714]

Just remember that when America was founded--it wasn't an English speaking country to begin with.......

 

[Byrdie714]

K-town is just few min from here. I grew up in towns with a significant Korean population. I attended high school with a significant Korean population. I live in town with a significant Korean population. I think I know more about it a little better than you What do you think why I cannot make friends with handful of Koreans students at my school? Because they cannot converse in English and they're 2nd generation immigrants!! A very very very few number of those Korean students were recently immigrated so that's understandable. It's simple - because they speak Korean at home and with friends thus not putting much emphasis on learning English. That's why they were placed in ESL program and they didn't give a shit at all. How disappointing....

It must be different on the east coast than it is on the west coast.

refugee status is a legal status. so is political asylum. Illegal Immigrants are the one who snuck into America ILLEGALLY via shrimp boat, truck, makeshift raft boat, walking thru desert, etc. Illegal Immigrants have only one residency status - DEPORTATION.

If an illegal immigrant came to America to claim political asylum, refugee status due to war etc, should be deported? No.

i asked for source.... as in statistic or whatsoever that backs your claim, not job application.

And I told you. Just pick up any job application and it will ask for Affirmative Action laws. The law was passed to modify AA to include multiple races.

that federal law needs to be overturned because it's a major financial pit hole. We both know who was the main driving force behind this federal law. This is what happens if we cave in to the biggest minority group who runs the show. I'm pissed that they take advantage of America to their own best interest.

As a 3rd generation American on my mother's side and a 12th generation on my father's side-- I don't have an issue with seeing different signs in different languages in this country. Secondly I support this law to have different languages to be translated into another language due to the percentage of population speaking another language besides English.

Remember that the Census Department, HHS, are all involved with this as well. I think what is happening in Georgia is that they are having an issue dealing with Spanish speaking and showing their xenophobic fears.

Wait a minute--isn't Georgia the Dixie flag waving loving state? No suprise there. :roll:

yep.... yep..... that's why we must take initiation to ensure that majority of RACES in America can speak English and TO CONTRIBUTE to America, not to use American resource to grow their own homogeneous-like communities in America.

They will especially if they want to continue on with higher education to obtain a better job.

Well - deaf people can read and write in English thus can communicate with hearing people with pen & paper so deaf people are fine. Immigrants can't so that's my problem and many Americans' problems too. ENGLISH PLEASE! Not ENGRISH.

Then we need to revamp the ESL process for the immigrants to learn English. English isn't the easiest language to learn. Some of the immigrants that I have worked with found ASL easy to understand and have come to rely on ASL in order to understand the English grammar and syntax. And have come away being successful at it.

 

[Jiro]

Just remember that when America was founded--it wasn't an English speaking country to begin with.......

The Constitution, Declaration of Independence and such were written in English, yes? Mind you - just to be clear between us... I'm not advocating for English ONLY. I'm only asking for ALL people residing in America to KNOW English. For example - China has 8 MAJOR dialects but also has over thousand minor dialects. How does Chinese government solve the communication issue? one common language for all Chinese - Mandarin. I don't care if English is your first language, second, third, or whatever... but please at least KNOW English that we all can communicate in America.

 

[Jiro]

It must be different on the east coast than it is on the west coast.

well you have a very strong Hispanic community on that side and I'm sure a lot of them cannot speak or understand English.

If an illegal immigrant came to America to claim political asylum, refugee status due to war etc, should be deported? No.

well that's not my problem. That's for INS and/or State Department to deal with. Beside - why would they apply for driver license right after coming to America? Anyway - I want driver license to be issued to those with LAWFUL IMMIGRATION STATUS.

And I told you. Just pick up any job application and it will ask for Affirmative Action laws. The law was passed to modify AA to include multiple races.

You claimed that the growing diversity rate in America is due to interracial marriage. Do you have a source (preferably with number) that backs your claim?

As a 3rd generation American on my mother's side and a 12th generation on my father's side-- I don't have an issue with seeing different signs in different languages in this country. Secondly I support this law to have different languages to be translated into another language due to the percentage of population speaking another language besides English.

Remember that the Census Department, HHS, are all involved with this as well. I think what is happening in Georgia is that they are having an issue dealing with Spanish speaking and showing their xenophobic fears.

Wait a minute--isn't Georgia the Dixie flag waving loving state? No suprise there. :roll:

ouch

They will especially if they want to continue on with higher education to obtain a better job.

yep... and I wish majority of immigrants to do same especially the 2nd generation and onward. oh well.. fact of life as you said...

Then we need to revamp the ESL process for the immigrants to learn English. English isn't the easiest language to learn. Some of the immigrants that I have worked with found ASL easy to understand and have come to rely on ASL in order to understand the English grammar and syntax. And have come away being successful at it.

sounds good then. As long as they can communicate in English with many... fine with me. I don't care if it's grammatically incorrect but as long as the message's understood by many... good enough with me.

For example - "You crash! you fault! no me!" it's certainly a LOT better than those speaking NO English.

 

[Byrdie714]

The Constitution, Declaration of Independence and such were written in English, yes? Mind you - just to be clear between us... I'm not advocating for English ONLY. I'm only asking for ALL people residing in America to KNOW English. For example - China has 8 MAJOR dialects but also has over thousand minor dialects. How does Chinese government solve the communication issue? one common language for all Chinese - Mandarin. I don't care if English is your first language, second, third, or whatever... but please at least KNOW English that we all can communicate in America.

If you re-read my statement, I stated that:

Just remember that when America was founded--it wasn't an English speaking country to begin with.......

 

[Byrdie714]

well you have a very strong Hispanic community on that side and I'm sure a lot of them cannot speak or understand English.

Si. Yo hablo Espanol muy bien. In actuality--in this town, it's mostly Eastern Europeans. They are kind of....scary.

well that's not my problem. That's for INS and/or State Department to deal with. Beside - why would they apply for driver license right after coming to America? Anyway - I want driver license to be issued to those with LAWFUL IMMIGRATION STATUS.

Job? Secondly it is our problem because the INS/State Department is who we fund.

You claimed that the growing diversity rate in America is due to interracial marriage. Do you have a source (preferably with number) that backs your claim?

I'll see if I can find it. It may be tomorrow when I get back to you with the statistics. However--when you apply for a job--don't be suprised to see that on the AA questionnaire.

ouch

yep... and I wish majority of immigrants to do same especially the 2nd generation and onward. oh well.. fact of life as you said...

You have to remember that everyone controls their own destiny.

sounds good then. As long as they can communicate in English with many... fine with me. I don't care if it's grammatically incorrect but as long as the message's understood by many... good enough with me.

For example - "You crash! you fault! no me!" it's certainly a LOT better than those speaking NO English.

Sounds like the older Korean woman I dealt with the other day! Is that from experience Jiro?

 

[Jiro]

Si. Yo hablo Espanol muy bien.

AY AY! Yo tambien! (no not really LOL) Como estas, mi amigo??? I proudly support bilingual program & multicultural education at schools to remove racial stereotype/barrier and racism but first - I want all of us to know English

In actuality--in this town, it's mostly Eastern Europeans. They are kind of....scary.

lol I knew you'd say that. West Coast is too commonly known as California area.

Job? Secondly it is our problem because the INS/State Department is who we fund.

Job? they can take a bus to job or get a carpool like everybody else. I doubt they would live in affluent neighborhood or related. people like them usually live in city or poor neighborhoods where there are a handful means of transportations.

I'll see if I can find it. It may be tomorrow when I get back to you with the statistics. However--when you apply for a job--don't be suprised to see that on the AA questionnaire.

oh yes I don't doubt you that it's in the form but I'm doubting your claim that growing diversity is due to interracial marriage more than incoming immigrants.

Sounds like the older Korean woman I dealt with the other day! Is that from experience Jiro?

yep... my family and I used to speak broken English.

 

[Foxrac]

NJ mulls illegal immigrant driver's license issue

Illegal immigrant and non-english speaking aren't compare. :roll:

There's almost all states don't allow illegal immigrants to get license, except for 4 states but they will get pull by police and arrest, especially highway patrol and police in CA will do random check when stop them.

Make english only on driver test will never solve the problem for illegal immigrants because it is totally different situation, only way to stop illegal immigrants, it need make mandatory for landlord or any people who issue an rent to ask them for ID or immigrant status, same goes with workplace.

Some immigrants are come to US for investors and need have driver license from US to drive, especially for long residence or permanent, even language isn't matters, ask to hire translator because they don't want it, it's very dumb situation.