I am against oralism because....

RedFox said:
Wow, the quote from this page is interesting. I wonder how that sign language developed and what the oralists think of it. If the oralists were around back then, they might've tried to make them use a spoken language. But that might be hard if the spoken languages had some sounds that they didn't share, like the English 'th' sound that many other languages don't have.


I've seen some books about this sign language. I bet the oralists banned such books from the oral only schools.
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I'm sure they did. Just like they forbid the Native Americans from using their own languages in the mission schools.
 
That website you gave has a bunch of supposed sign languages that are not even real languages. Home signs are gestures not a language, pigeon sign is made up, I could go on and on.

Its a bit insulting to the deaf to equate made up gestures with an actual language, the languages of the deaf, like ASl.

Oh, and besides, wikipedia has never been creditable as anyone can edit it with any type of information they wish. They have actually done research on the wikipedia site and found that it has more errors and mistakes then it does fact.
 
Actually, pidgin languages are naturally evolved, not made up, and are considered viable by linguists. And all signs were made up at some point. There has to be a first time a sign was ever used as a symbol. That is how languages evolve. Same with words. All words originated somewhere, all signs origninated somewhere.
 
Cheri said:
Just because he says the wrong things, it was unnecessary to have five or six members ganging up on him like that. I just felt bad for the dude.
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I, independently of anyone else, started out soft-pedaling so he should have grabbed that lifeline/hint to be civil. Others, too, responded individually so it wasn't a "gang". Why didn't you come in each of those places where he was "saying the wrong" things and help him/us out?
 
RedFox said:
Sure, the guy living in the house I'm moving to wants to learn some sign and learned a bit from a friend who knew a bit from a project. There, that's 2 hearing people using sign language with no deaf people around because I haven't moved there yet. The world didn't end. :D

There are people at my work who want to learn some signs too, so I'll teach them sometimes. I won't mind if hearing people signed to each other. It'd be good practice.

Allowing and encouraging hearing people to use sign languages with each other means less influence for the oral-only camp.
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Yup, I agree, literally anyone and everyone except the ones who only wanna know the naughty stuff, lol.....
 
You could look at the sources listed on the bottom of the Wikipedia pages if you don't trust the text on the page.
 
RedFox said:
ASL is open to everyone. After all, it stands for American Sign Language, not American Deaf Sign Language.

I can think of a good use for signed languages for hearing people to use between themselves. What if one of them had a cold, sore throat or some other condition that made them hoarse or otherwise made it hard to speak? If they happened to know a signed language, they'd still be able to communicate in places that don't have paper or computers. I wonder what the oralists would think of that. :D

Another use would be to communicate over long distances like between floors at an atrium without yelling. A really cool use would be to give signed tours of coral reefs on scuba dives.

Check out this page for examples of sign language usage by hearing people. Take that oralists! :P
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deafdyke said:
RedFox, in addition some hearing people use ASL as a second language due to disabilites like apraxia or tracheostomies. Note. I am not speaking of the MR/autistic people who use a handful of signs for augmentive communication purposes.
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I have said similiar stuff before....

Guess who is being deaf figuratively. Not us!
 
Bottesini said:
I have really bad social skills. Sometimes I just hope people will cut me a little slack and forgive me if I am at my worst.
I am not always nice either. But I am working at it day by day. Sometimes when you get angry, it is hard to stop yourself. I know you guys are just trying to make him see a different view too.
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Thank you for your honesty, Botti....
 
Bottesini said:
Me too. I was also really angry when I was young. And I pretty much grew up ok. I hope.
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This is to apologize to Jasin. He was very offended and sad that I would characterize him as young and angry.

I am very sorry I hurt your feelings Jasin.
 
Bottesini, can you read the contents of this URL for me and let me know if it strikes a chord with you? This includes the Three Phony Types near the end; click on each if you will.

A Deaf Mom Shares Her World » Socialization for Deaf and Hard of Hearing Kids

I follow this lady on occasion in other areas of the Internet. Maybe Jasin would also like to read this....I'm not sure if there's any connection, so hopefully, at the very least, it's good reading.
 
Tousi said:
Bottesini, can you read the contents of this URL for me and let me know if it strikes a chord with you? This includes the Three Phony Types near the end; click on each if you will.

A Deaf Mom Shares Her World » Socialization for Deaf and Hard of Hearing Kids

I follow this lady on occasion in other areas of the Internet. Maybe Jasin would also like to read this....I'm not sure if there's any connection, so hopefully, at the very least, it's good reading.
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That was me all through school, all through work, heck even still sometimes today. I say yes and nod and god only knows what I have agreed to. I love reading Mark's stuff, he is a great writer.
 
Tousi said:
Bottesini, can you read the contents of this URL for me and let me know if it strikes a chord with you? This includes the Three Phony Types near the end; click on each if you will.

A Deaf Mom Shares Her World » Socialization for Deaf and Hard of Hearing Kids

I follow this lady on occasion in other areas of the Internet. Maybe Jasin would also like to read this....I'm not sure if there's any connection, so hopefully, at the very least, it's good reading.
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God link, Tousi. It addresses the psycho-social issues that we have discussed so often, especially in regard to the mainstream educational environment.
 
NickCameron1031 said:
That was me all through school, all through work, heck even still sometimes today. I say yes and nod and god only knows what I have agreed to. I love reading Mark's stuff, he is a great writer.
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Oh,yeah! The "yes means no syndrome."
 
It must from the Nazi doctor who suggest the parents to force their child to doing oral.

However, I do know few deaf who grow as oral until they find interest about ASL in late age. I think it's great to make change.
 
NickCameron1031 said:
That was me all through school, all through work, heck even still sometimes today. I say yes and nod and god only knows what I have agreed to. I love reading Mark's stuff, he is a great writer.
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Been there, done that. Even as an adult! While I have great lipreading skills and hear some with my HAs, every once in a blue moon I encounter someone I simply cannot lipread for whatever reason, and after asking that person to already repeat 2-3 times, I just end up nodding my head and smile. God only knows what I just nodded and smiled at. He/she could've said that I smelled funny for all I know. :)
 
AlleyCat said:
Been there, done that. Even as an adult! While I have great lipreading skills and hear some with my HAs, every once in a blue moon I encounter someone I simply cannot lipread for whatever reason, and after asking that person to already repeat 2-3 times, I just end up nodding my head and smile. God only knows what I just nodded and smiled at. He/she could've said that I smelled funny for all I know. :)
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:laugh2: It had happened to me too, one of my hearing friend laughed when I just nodded and smiled, the person who was talking to me was talking in a fast speed and had asked me if I wanna have a drink with him, I nodded and smiled and he said when? I kept nodding and smiling and my friend ended up laughing, she knew I didn't understand him. :laugh2:
 
Tousi said:
Bottesini, can you read the contents of this URL for me and let me know if it strikes a chord with you? This includes the Three Phony Types near the end; click on each if you will.

A Deaf Mom Shares Her World » Socialization for Deaf and Hard of Hearing Kids

I follow this lady on occasion in other areas of the Internet. Maybe Jasin would also like to read this....I'm not sure if there's any connection, so hopefully, at the very least, it's good reading.
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After two readings, I would say that it probably pretty accurately describes me.
 
jillio said:
Oh,yeah! The "yes means no syndrome."
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Or yes means whatever LOL I know I have gotten into some messes a few times. I know I agreed once to help a friend of a friend move because I just kept saying yeah to whatever he asked me and I have gotten pretty intoxicated by saying yes every time the bartender asks me a question lol
 
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