White privilege

Bottesini said:
Race Relations
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An excellent starting point, Bott. For some in depth reading on the subject, I would also suggest Climbing Jacob's Ladder, by Dr. Andrew Billingsley, and I'm Chocolate, You're Vanilla, by Marguerite Wright. The second is a great description of the ways in which these attitudes that contribute to the exisitence of white privilege are unconsciously passed from generation to generation. The first is a compilation of sociological studies that have been conducted on the topic.
 
Forgot to say, :ty: to dogmom for starting this thread. It has the potential to bring about much awareness.
 
Bott and Jillio, :ty: I will look for those; here are some I have:

Ten Llttle Indians by Sherman Alexie;

Race Matters by Cornell West;

White Like Me by Tim Wise;

Uprooting Racism by Paul Kivel;

Slaves in the Family by Richard Ball;

Eating Fire, Tasting Blood - An Anthology of the American Indian Holocaust - Editor Marijo Moore;

Mankiller, A Chief of her People by Wilma Mankiller and Michael Mallis;

Peoples History of the United States, by Zinn
 
Excellent resources, dogmom! I might also suggest The Ties that Bind, by Dr. Joyce Ladner. More of a cultural study, but very enlightening.
 
jillio said:
An excellent starting point, Bott. For some in depth reading on the subject, I would also suggest Climbing Jacob's Ladder, by Dr. Andrew Billingsley, and I'm Chocolate, You're Vanilla, by Marguerite Wright. The second is a great description of the ways in which these attitudes that contribute to the exisitence of white privilege are unconsciously passed from generation to generation. The first is a compilation of sociological studies that have been conducted on the topic.
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This reminds me of something I've noticed. Generally speaking, white families pass down a cultural view of being confident in oneself, being sure that the world is more often than not willing to accommodate your desires, and just feeling sure about oneself. The general cultural belief that you can be successful and people think good of you unless otherwise proven.

In many families of color I noticed a reversed identity. A much more cynical view of the world, people are there to take advantage of you, to try to scam you. It might sound a bit exaggerated but I have come across these differences in mentality to various extremes.

In school the white students were almost always bragging about how they got A's and the black students were almost always bragging about how they failed this and were stupid in general and didn't care about school. These are all other examples of white privilege. Even just being raised in an environment that promotes self-confidence and a generally more positive view of the world gives one a privilege because people are more willing to take advantage of opportunities and to promote themselves in a positive light when they have a more positive world view.
 
"Black Like Me" by John Howard Griffin - very good book by a white man who shaved his head and darken his skin by medicine and pretend to be a black man. This took place in '60s when there was race segeration.

Edit: I have read it when I was in college in late '70s.
 
CJB said:
This reminds me of something I've noticed. Generally speaking, white families pass down a cultural view of being confident in oneself, being sure that the world is more often than not willing to accommodate your desires, and just feeling sure about oneself. The general cultural belief that you can be successful and people think good of you unless otherwise proven.

In many families of color I noticed a reversed identity. A much more cynical view of the world, people are there to take advantage of you, to try to scam you. It might sound a bit exaggerated but I have come across these differences in mentality to various extremes.

In school the white students were almost always bragging about how they got A's and the black students were almost always bragging about how they failed this and were stupid in general and didn't care about school. These are all other examples of white privilege. Even just being raised in an environment that promotes self-confidence and a generally more positive view of the world gives one a privilege because people are more willing to take advantage of opportunities and to promote themselves in a positive light when they have a more positive world view.
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Oh, absolutely. And the cultural differences in child rearing and attitudes is based on a very real, and very unpleasant history that has made such differences necessary.
 
CJB, that may be the case about the grades thing but it may also be that they do not want to be perceived as "acting white."

“Acting White” : Education Next

That link has an exellent read on the very vexing subject of "acting white" on how this was done using surveys and such.
 
Buffalo said:
"Black Like Me" by John Howard Griffin - very good book by a white man who shaved his head and darken his skin by medicine and pretend to be a black man. This took place in '60s when there was race segeration.

Edit: I have read it when I was in college in late '70s.
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I forgot about that one, Buff! Yes, indeed, a very good book to read.
 
kokonut said:
CJB, that may be the case about the grades thing but it's also that they do not want to be perceived as "acting white."

“Acting White” : Education Next

That link has an exellent read on the very vexing subject of "acting white."
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I'm afraid that is a very caucasion explanation for the cultural behaviors that are passed down generationally. It truly has nothing to do with being perceived as "acting white" and more to do with survival in a world generally hostile to those of color.

From the link supplied:

Writing in 1998 in the American Sociological Review, James Ainsworth-Darnell of Georgia State University and Douglas Downey of Ohio State University reported that anti-intellectualism is no more severe a problem among black or Hispanic adolescents than it is among whites. Meanwhile, in a 1997 study, economists Phillip Cook of Duke and Jens Ludwig of Georgetown found that high-achieving black students are, if anything, even more popular relative to low-achieving peers than are high-achieving whites.
 
Few years ago, I was thinking of the problems the deaf people and the black people face in discriminations and how different those two can be. I mean a person can see a black person a block away and would change his behavior long before the person actually met the black person. How is the black person going to prove that the person is discriminating him?? A person would remain friendly with me until I open my mouth. I can prove that I am being discriminated because I can see the change right there when I start to speak. It looks like that I have a leg up on a black person in proving discrimination.
 
Buffalo said:
Few years ago, I was thinking of the problems the deaf people and the black people face in discriminations and how different those two can be. I mean a person can see a black person a block away and would change his behavior long before the person actually met the black person. How is the black person going to prove that the person is discriminating him?? A person would remain friendly with me until I open my mouth. I can prove that I am being discriminated because I can see the change right there when I start to speak. It looks like that I have a leg up on a black person in proving discrimination.
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I would tend to agree with you on that, Buffalo. The more hidden the reason for the discrimination, the easier it is to detect behavior changes that identify discrimination.
 
New Evidence of Acting White

Even after taking into account many factors that affect student popularity, evidence remains strong that acting white is a genuine issue and worthy of Senator Obama’s attention.

Figure 1, which plots the underlying relationship between popularity and achievement, shows large differences among whites, blacks, and Hispanics. At low GPAs, there is little difference among ethnic groups in the relationship between grades and popularity, and high-achieving blacks are actually more popular within their ethnic group than high-achieving whites are within theirs. But when a student achieves a 2.5 GPA (an even mix of Bs and Cs), clear differences start to emerge.

As grades improve beyond this level, Hispanic students lose popularity at an alarming rate. Although African Americans with GPAs as high as 3.5 continue to have more friends than those with lower grades, the rate of increase is no longer as great as among white students.

The experience of black and white students diverges as GPAs climb above 3.5. As the GPAs of black students increase beyond this level, they tend to have fewer and fewer friends. A black student with a 4.0 has, on average, 1.5 fewer friends of the same ethnicity than a white student with the same GPA. Put differently, a black student with straight As is no more popular than a black student with a 2.9 GPA, but high-achieving whites are at the top of the popularity pyramid.

My findings with respect to Hispanics are even more discouraging. A Hispanic student with a 4.0 GPA is the least popular of all Hispanic students, and Hispanic-white differences among high achievers are the most extreme.

The social costs of a high GPA are most pronounced for adolescent males. Popularity begins to decrease at lower GPAs for young black men than young black women (3.25 GPA compared with a 3.5), and the rate at which males lose friends after this point is far greater. As a result, black male high achievers have notably fewer friends than do female ones. I observe a similar pattern among Hispanics, with males beginning to lose friends at lower GPAs and at a faster clip, though the male-female differences are not statistically significant.
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The research notes this:

Unfortunately, when I look separately at minority students who participate in each of these activities, I find only one within which ethnic differences are eliminated: the National Honor Society. Among students involved in every other activity, new friends made outside the classroom do not make up for the social penalties imposed for acting white.
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Roland G. Fryer is assistant professor of economics, Harvard University and a faculty research fellow, the National Bureau of Economic Research.

“Acting White” : Education Next
 
jillio said:
I'm afraid that is a very caucasion explanation for the cultural behaviors that are passed down generationally. It truly has nothing to do with being perceived as "acting white" and more to do with survival in a world generally hostile to those of color.
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Obama would disagree with you on that. And since he's in office this has given the impetus and reason for black students to accept high grades as a badge of honor rather than a social stigma. If anything, this is about the one positive aspect this presidency has on black students in high school (and even earlier) to strive for better and higher grades and are no longer afraid of the stigma of "acting white" thrown at them.

Even President Obama highlighted this difficulty in his address to the Democratic National Convention in 2004, and recognized it as a practice of national concern. It is this negative peer pressure that may also be a leading cause in the pervasive achievement gap, that, despite some success in the lower grades, continues to plague Black students, particularly males, on the junior and high school levels.

Obama: If minority students today deliberately underachieve in order to avoid social sanctions, that by itself could explain why the academic performance of 17-year-old African Americans, as measured by the National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP), has deteriorated since the late 1980s, even while that of nine-year-olds has been improving. It may also help us understand the shortage of minority students in most elite colleges and universities. (Fryer, 2006, par 7)
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Education Coffeehouse -- Have You Been Accused of Acting White
 
kokonut said:
Obama would disagree with you on that. And since he's in office this has given the impetus and reason for black students to accept high grades as a badge of honor rather than a social stigma. If anything, this is about the one positive aspect this presidency has on black students in high school (and even earlier) to strive for better and higher grades and are no longer afraid of the stigma of "acting white" thrown at them.


Education Coffeehouse -- Have You Been Accused of Acting White
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It would not be me, but the sociologists who have researched the topic. And the statement you have provided is out of context, and in no way implies disagreement with what the sociologists have found.

I might want to point out, as well, that the accusation of "acting white" is, in and of itself, a racist accusation, in particular when coming from a caucasion.
 
Please object that to Obama, not me, on when black students who deliberately underachieve in order to maintain their social status among their peers.
 
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