Social Experiment - the Muslims

So the Holocaust would not be a human rights violation? The Soviet pogroms weren't human rights violations? Genocide in the Sudan, Rwanda, and Darfur aren't human rights violations? Those of us outside the cultures should just ignore these things so as not to be labeled "ethnocentric?"

Slavery in the United States used to be considered acceptable by the prevailing culture of the South. Was it ethnocentric and wrong for American abolitionists to take a stand against it? Those appealing slavery at the time were "generally in a considerable minority."

Who said anything like what you have intimated in this post? Are you intentionally twisting, or do you truly not understand the concept? I'm pretty sure the Jews were not supportive of the Holocaust, and the slaves were not supportive of slavery. They themselves would have considered such treatment to be a human rights violation. They call themselves victims.

Please go back and read my other posts. You are evidently missing something.
 
Does America Have a Muslim Problem?
You don't have to be prejudiced against Islam to believe, as many Americans do, that the area around Ground Zero is a sacred place. But sadly, in an election season, such sentiments have been stoked into a political issue. As the debate has grown more heated, Park51, as the proposed Muslim cultural center and mosque two blocks from Ground Zero is called, has become a litmus test for everything from private-property rights to religious tolerance. But it is plain that many of Park51's opponents are motivated by deep-seated Islamophobia.

The proposed site is close not just to Ground Zero; it's also a stone's throw from strip clubs, liquor stores and other establishments typical of lower Manhattan. Muslims have been praying in the building for nearly a year, a fact that has got lost in the noise of the protests. But since early August, it has been the scene of frequent demonstrations, with signs saying things such as "All I Need to Know About Islam, I Learned on 9/11." The husband-and-wife team behind Park51, Imam Feisal Rauf and Daisy Khan, seem stunned into paralysis: while opponents cast them as extremists sympathetic to al-Qaeda, they have given very few interviews themselves. Pressure is mounting on the couple to move their center to a less polarizing location. (See TIME's photo-essay "Muslim in America.")

The controversy has also brought new scrutiny to other examples of anti-Islam and anti-Muslim protests, raising much larger questions: Does America have a problem with Islam? Have the terrorist attacks of 9/11 — and other attempts since — permanently excluded Muslims from full assimilation into American life? (Comment on this story.)

Although the American strain of Islamophobia lacks some of the traditional elements of religious persecution — there's no sign that violence against Muslims is on the rise, for instance — there's plenty of anecdotal evidence that hate speech against Muslims and Islam is growing both more widespread and more heated. Meanwhile, a new TIME–Abt SRBI poll found that 46% of Americans believe Islam is more likely than other faiths to encourage violence against nonbelievers. Only 37% know a Muslim American. Overall, 61% oppose the Park51 project, while just 26% are in favor of it. Just 23% say it would be a symbol of religious tolerance, while 44% say it would be an insult to those who died on 9/11. (See "Why the GOP Should Avoid the Mosque Issue.")

Islamophobia in the U.S. doesn't approach levels seen in other countries where Muslims are in a minority. But to be a Muslim in America now is to endure slings and arrows against your faith — not just in the schoolyard and the office but also outside your place of worship and in the public square, where some of the country's most powerful mainstream religious and political leaders unthinkingly (or worse, deliberately) conflate Islam with terrorism and savagery. In France and Britain, politicians from fringe parties say appalling things about Muslims, but there's no one in Europe of the stature of a former House Speaker who would, as Newt Gingrich did, equate Islam with Nazism.
 
A Brief History of Intolerance in America - Discrimination against different religions and ethnic groups dates back to the founding of the colonies

I read the article yesterday at Barnes and Nobel. See told ya I get my news from a variety of sources.

But how about this.......

Tolerence is about understanding and getting along/tolerating all people right.

Now say you have Blacks in one side and the KKK on the other. And, one fairminded person says hey I am for rights for blacks and so on while criticizing the KKK. Is that person tolerant? or.... has that person chosen a side?

Is tolerence accepting all people and beliefs? or just the beliefs one agrees with?
 
I read the article yesterday at Barnes and Nobel. See told ya I get my news from a variety of sources.

But how about this.......

Tolerence is about understanding and getting along/tolerating all people right.

Now say you have Blacks in one side and the KKK on the other. And, one fairminded person says hey I am for rights for blacks and so on while criticizing the KKK. Is that person tolerant? or.... has that person chosen a side?

Is tolerence accepting all people and beliefs? or just the beliefs one agrees with?

pondering....

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I read the article yesterday at Barnes and Nobel. See told ya I get my news from a variety of sources.

But how about this.......

Tolerence is about understanding and getting along/tolerating all people right.

Now say you have Blacks in one side and the KKK on the other. And, one fairminded person says hey I am for rights for blacks and so on while criticizing the KKK. Is that person tolerant? or.... has that person chosen a side?

Is tolerence accepting all people and beliefs? or just the beliefs one agrees with?

That person is choosing a side. A truly tolerant person would not criticize either side. Those type of people are very rare to find.

I sure as hell don't belong in that group. I have no tolerance for racist so in your example I would be choosing a side and being a "racist" toward the KKK.
 
Is tolerance of an intolerant group a good thing or a bad thing? :hmm:
 
Is tolerance of an intolerant group a good thing or a bad thing? :hmm:

I think you would have to divide the intolerant group into 2 groups. Intolerants who exercise their views by the pen or ballot..... and intolerants who use violence and intimidation. Tolerance of the second group would be a bad thing to almost everyone I am sure.
 
I think you would have to divide the intolerant group into 2 groups. Intolerants who exercise their views by the pen or ballot..... and intolerants who use violence and intimidation. Tolerance of the second group would be a bad thing to almost everyone I am sure.

good point
 
I think you would have to divide the intolerant group into 2 groups. Intolerants who exercise their views by the pen or ballot..... and intolerants who use violence and intimidation. Tolerance of the second group would be a bad thing to almost everyone I am sure.

Intolerance is not necessarily a bad thing. I am intolerant of liars. I am intolerant of rapists and murderers. I went to a club that debated this subject, among others. It was an eye-opener.
 
Intolerance is not necessarily a bad thing. I am intolerant of liars. I am intolerant of rapists and murderers. I went to a club that debated this subject, among others. It was an eye-opener.

We agree. I am intolerant of many types of people too Like people who don't repay their loans.....especially if I did the loanin'. I am sure everybody is whether they admit it or not.
 
so my problem is.... what's with people especially Caucasian telling to non-white people - "Go back to where you're from" even though non-white people were born and raised in America?

what's even sadder is that these people who proudly announced themselves as "Proud American" don't even know their own Constitution and laws. what people did at the end gave me a hope that America can come out of this bigotry and racism sooner or later...

so the question still remains for decades - "WHAT MAKES YOU AMERICAN?"

some years ago my famliy took our mother out for mother day . My daughter is Black, my brother law in is from Trinidad and my niece is Black . My daughter wanted to order a salad and bake potato for her meal and the waitress said she could not get that as it was not on the menu as a meal.
A white boy sitting at a table next to just order this from the same waitress. My family did not made a scene and let this go . When we were done eating the waitress came to our table will the bill,I did not hear what she said until later. The waitress said that horrible little poem about catching a 'N' by the toe! My famliy did nothing and I did not hear this if I had I would done something ! My famliy said later it was good thing I did not hear what the waitress said as they knew I would be angry as all HELL and had told my brother in law not to pay for meal or give the waitress ,and I was really shocked that he did leave her a tip. If I had been in that store I would had spoken up for the Muslim woman and would not brought anything. I know how it feel to be treated horrible because of your race and religious.
What my famliy when through was not a social experiment , it was very painful and upsetting a day for my mother as it was her day and she saw her famliy treated like dirt by a raicist bigot bitch. bigotry and racism is a horrible thing , no good come from it.
 
some years ago my famliy took our mother out for mother day . My daughter is Black, my brother law in is from Trinidad and my niece is Black . My daughter wanted to order a salad and bake potato for her meal and the waitress said she could not get that as it was not on the menu as a meal.
A white boy sitting at a table next to just order this from the same waitress. My family did not made a scene and let this go . When we were done eating the waitress came to our table will the bill,I did not hear what she said until later. The waitress said that horrible little poem about catching a 'N' by the toe! My famliy did nothing and I did not hear this if I had I would done something ! My famliy said later it was good thing I did not hear what the waitress said as they knew I would be angry as all HELL and had told my brother in law not to pay for meal or give the waitress ,and I was really shocked that he did leave her a tip. If I had been in that store I would had spoken up for the Muslim woman and would not brought anything. I know how it feel to be treated horrible because of your race and religious.
What my famliy when through was not a social experiment , it was very painful and upsetting a day for my mother as it was her day and she saw her famliy treated like dirt by a raicist bigot bitch. bigotry and racism is a horrible thing , no good come from it.

Meal..... Maybe they ordered it ala carte and paid premium or he split a meal with someone :dunno:

Poem.... I have always heard catch a tiger by the toe....
 
...Poem.... I have always heard catch a tiger by the toe....
When I was a kid (during the 50's-60's), the rhyme was commonly said with the N-word. I didn't even know what the word meant because that was the only time I heard it used; I never heard the N-word used to refer to a person. When I found out what it meant, I didn't use it again.

I also heard monkey used in the rhyme instead of the N-word.

I think I was living in New Jersey at the time that I learned the N-word was a bad word.
 
When I was a kid (during the 50's-60's), the rhyme was commonly said with the N-word. I didn't even know what the word meant because that was the only time I heard it used; I never heard the N-word used to refer to a person. When I found out what it meant, I didn't use it again.

I also heard monkey used in the rhyme instead of the N-word.

I think I was living in New Jersey at the time that I learned the N-word was a bad word.

Yeah. Very few people (relatively speaking) can say the N-word with any honesty. The best bet is to ignore it. The worst thing we can do is to make it illegal and punishable because that would help destroy our freedom of speech and opinion. Or even worse, our own opinions would be up for banning under such laws.
 
Meal..... Maybe they ordered it ala carte and paid premium or he split a meal with someone :dunno:

Poem.... I have always heard catch a tiger by the toe....

No it was not the menu My real point was about my daughter , brother in law and niece being called the 'N' word by the waitress.
 
Intolerance is not necessarily a bad thing. I am intolerant of liars. I am intolerant of rapists and murderers. I went to a club that debated this subject, among others. It was an eye-opener.

Well said.
 
Man Already Knows Everything He Needs To Know About Muslims
Man-Already-large.jpg


SALINA, KS—Local man Scott Gentries told reporters Wednesday that his deliberately limited grasp of Islamic history and culture was still more than sufficient to shape his views of the entire Muslim world.

Gentries, 48, said he had absolutely no interest in exposing himself to further knowledge of Islamic civilization or putting his sweeping opinions into a broader context of any kind, and confirmed he was "perfectly happy" to make a handful of emotionally charged words the basis of his mistrust toward all members of the world's second-largest religion.

"I learned all that really matters about the Muslim faith on 9/11," Gentries said in reference to the terrorist attacks on the United States undertaken by 19 of Islam's approximately 1.6 billion practitioners. "What more do I need to know to stigmatize Muslims everywhere as inherently violent radicals?"

"And now they want to build a mosque at Ground Zero," continued Gentries, eliminating any distinction between the 9/11 hijackers and Muslims in general. "No, I won't examine the accuracy of that statement, but yes, I will allow myself to be outraged by it and use it as evidence of these people's universal callousness toward Americans who lost loved ones when the Twin Towers fell."

"Even though I am not one of those people," he added.

When told that the proposed "Ground Zero mosque" is actually a community center two blocks north of the site that would include, in addition to a public prayer space, a 500-seat auditorium, a restaurant, and athletic facilities, Gentries shook his head and said, "I know all I'm going to let myself know."

Gentries explained that it "didn't take long" to find out as much about the tenets of Islam as he needed to. He said he knew Muslims stoned their women for committing adultery, trained for terrorist attacks at fundamentalist madrassas, and believed in jihad, which Gentries described as the thing they used to justify killing infidels.

"All Muslims are at war with America, and I will resist any attempt to challenge that assertion with potentially illuminating facts," said Gentries, who threatened to leave the room if presented with the number of Muslims who live peacefully in the United States, serve in the country's armed forces, or were victims themselves of the 9/11 attacks. "Period."

"If you don't believe me, wait until they put your wife in a burka," Gentries continued in reference to the face-and-body-covering worn by a small minority of Muslim women and banned in the universities of Turkey, Tunisia, and Syria. "Or worse, a rape camp. That's right: For reasons I am content being totally unable to articulate, I am choosing to associate Muslims with rape camps."

Over the past decade, Gentries said he has taken pains to avoid personal interactions or media that might have the potential to compromise his point of view. He told reporters that the closest he had come to confronting a contrary standpoint was tuning in to the first few seconds of an interview with a moderate Muslim cleric before hastily turning off the television.

"I almost gave in and listened to that guy defend Islam with words I didn't want to hear," Gentries said. "But then I remembered how much easier it is to live in a world of black-and-white in which I can assign the label of 'other' to someone and use him as a vessel for all my fears and insecurities."

Added Gentries, "That really put things back into perspective."
 
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