Should a pedophile be granted parental visits?

rolling7 said:
No, you can't but to give to Glenn and your request to stay on topic I'll end with an answer to Glenn's post.

Should a pedophile be granted parental visits.

The answer always has been, is and always will be NEVER.
After all, the courts have taking away parental visits right permanently for offenses other than sex crimes.

The End

And, no, I will not be going out to celebrate a "victory".......my thoughts will be on the hundreds of thousands of children who have and will have their lives totally ruin. We, and I do include myself, are all to blame, after all it is OUR system making the decision for the child's life.
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Fortunately, those who are experts in the field disagree with your ignorant and intolerant pronouncement. They take these issues very seriously, and make decisions on a case by case basis. Thank God the system does not operate with the same mind set you appear to have.

You know, if your cognitive distortions and dichotomous thinking are the result of some sort of personal experience with sexual abuse, I would recommend that you start therapy asap to deal with your issues.
 
rockin'robin said:
I don't give a rat's ass what "you think is better"....a child is a child is a child....any child....perhaps it hasn't happened to you...or your child...or even a child within your family....whenever it does, you might be singing a different song...
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Those who have had it happen in their family are the least qualified to make that judgement in other cases. They base all of their decisions from an extreme emotional bias. That is, unless they have received the therapy they need to come to terms with not just the sexual abuse, but the way it affects their thought processes and their emotional responses today. If they have done that, then they have developed some insight, and are no longer subject to that dichotomous thinking that appears to affect those who have not dealt with their trauma effectively.
 
rolling7 said:
Even supervised, the visit is forced on the child. Have you given thought what goes through the child's mind when an unknown supervisor won't leave the room the entire visit? I'm no mind-reader, but I doubt out is anything other than upsetting.
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A visit is never forced on a child. Again, you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. Your opinion is based on ignorance, not knowledge. And therefore, is completely invalid.
 
jillio said:
Those who have had it happen in their family are the least qualified to make that judgement in other cases. They base all of their decisions from an extreme emotional bias. That is, unless they have received the therapy they need to come to terms with not just the sexual abuse, but the way it affects their thought processes and their emotional responses today. If they have done that, then they have developed some insight, and are no longer subject to that dichotomous thinking that appears to affect those who have not dealt with their trauma effectively.
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In other words, lack of objectivity heavily influences judgment.
 
rolling7 said:
That is just my point! The child wants to see the parent but does not understand why these outside strangers are there. It is upsetting to the child because they have no idea of what is happening. Can you imagine the childing hearing the supervisor saying "That is not allowed!" in front of the child?
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Again, nothing but ignorance.

It would appear that you really don't have any interest in what is best for the child. You are simply using the child as justification for sitting back and passing judgement on things you know virtually nothing about. If you were truly concerned about doing what is best for the children, you would take the time to educate yourself on the issues so that you are able to determine what is best for each child in each individual circumstance.

But, it is much easier to remain ignorant and pass judgement with nothing but your emotional responses to back you up.
 
netrox said:
Rockin robin, that's the way it is. "Your dad did a wrong thing, he touched a child the wrong way and he got in trouble."

What's so hard about it?

Many children love their parents, even if their parents did something wrong to other people. For two years, I've taken care of a young boy whose mother stabbed him in his eye with a fork and smoked crack while she was pregnant with him.

Even though his mother lost custody of that boy, he still sees her once a month and still loves her. I hate that bitch with passion (I really do, it's NOT just because of what she has done to him but I also consider her pure white trash and I hate her bigoted views) but I would never say that to him.

You don't seem to grasp the concept of complex dynamic relationships among kids and adults in many ways (mental, physical, emotional and everything). That's why I don't like to brush all with one brush.
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Exactly, netrox. They are trying to over simplify very complex dynamics and decisions. And I admire you for your open mindedness despite a history that could have made you very close minded. With the way you think, I have no doubt that you are a perfect influence in the life of the child you are now caring for.
 
jillio said:
Posted plenty of citations for articles in professional journals. Use that which was provided to read the same research I read. Nothing secret about it. Appears to be more a lack of effort on your part than anything else. Another reason why I am reluctant to post sources. You complain about wanting them, and when they are provided, do not access them, but instead find something else to complain about. It is quite obvious that your motivation is not to educate yourself, but rather simply to instigate.:cool2:
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Actually the sources you gave ARE being accessed today. :)
 
TXgolfer said:
Actually the sources you gave ARE being accessed today. :)
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Good. Make use of them, and then we will be able to engage in an intelligent discussion regarding the findings, the methodology, the efficacy of the treatment modalities, etc.

But, I have to ask, if they are being accessed, and you have the intention of studying them, why complain that what you wanted wasn't there? Instigating.

At any rate...you have a pile of reading and evaluating to do.
 
jillio said:
A visit is never forced on a child. Again, you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. Your opinion is based on ignorance, not knowledge. And therefore, is completely invalid.
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Your post is nothing more than a power play to make all think you are the only one who knows anything. You used the word "never" , not me or anyone else. So now it becomes up to you to post a compete record of all sections of dialogue between the child and the professional. You are also required to provide the court dialogue with all the parties present in court. Of particular interest is what you read as far as the respond the child gave to each question ask of the child.
Don't you dare deflect with a come-back of "what you are asking for is impossible to provide". Again, you used the word "never". You have to prove your word.
My best bet is you have NEVER sat in on one of these judicial proceedings. If you have, supply us word-for-word the full dialogue of the proceeding.
 
Glenn said:
I don't have actual knowledge about how a supervised visit works either.

How this is done is decided by psychologists, judges, etc...people who have actual knowledge, training, and experience that far outweighs what I know about such situations. So I leave this kind of thing to people who know more than I do and I stick to things I know about.
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YOU used the "etc" and are now required to prove that included
the child.
Otherwise, you are making my point for me. That is the child's
Has the least say-so but the most to lose.
 
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rolling7 said:
YOU used the "etc" and are now required to prove that included
the child.
Otherwise, you are making my point for me. That is the child's
Has the least say-so but the most to lose.
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Since when do children make adult decisions and understand all the implications involved better than adults who have years of training, experience, and knowledge to guide their decisions?

Since never.

Children are certainly involved in such a decision-making process, but they don't have the final say-so. I fail to see how any child anywhere could have the ability to make an appropriate final decision in that situation. He or she should have input, but there are many factors way beyond the compreension of a young mind.
 
Thanks for once again proving my point. The child has the least say-so but the most to lose.
 
I think it would be really bad to let the child choose. Of course you can't force the child to see his father if he doesn't want to (but I hope nobody would do so), but it's NOT a child responsibility to choose such a thing...
Also, if something bad actually happens, then the child would blame himself... No way. Adults have to play adults' role, which involves listening to children carefully of course, and try to see things from their pint of view. We have the capacity to do so, while a child can't really understand such a father's feelings and actions.

As for explanation, I notice that children grasp the concept of "repeating behavior" quite easily. My daughter is sometimes scared by seeing parents hitting or scolding violently their children, and she often tells me "I'm sorry for them because probably they've been hitten too while they were young, we must tell them that it's so wrong because it hurts"... And she's only 5. I'll probably tell them daddy acted that way because someone did something similar to him while he was a child - which would most probably be the truth. She would definitely understand that.

Anyway children always love their parents, no matter what they do. It's a great responsibility for all of us who has children.
 
rolling7 said:
Thanks for once again proving my point. The child has the least say-so but the most to lose.
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Nothing new there...children do not run the world.

In a situation like this, should everything hinge on what the child wants?

Do you honestly believe children are equipped to make such a decision and be objective?

A child cannot make the best decision for him or herself in many lesser situations. How can it happen here?
 
Glenn said:
Nothing new there...children do not run the world.

In a situation like this, should everything hinge on what the child wants?

Do you honestly believe children are equipped to make such a decision and be objective?

A child cannot make the best decision for him or herself in many lesser situations. How can it happen here?
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I always give straight-from-the-heart, with assist from life-experience answers, so here are yours.

#1.....No, not everything BUT the child is paramount
(note the order of answers)
#3.....It has to happen here BECAUSE those lesser situations you refer to are not crime-related.

#2..........No, they are not equip and therefore not objective. However, those who are do not make the child paramount, to them the system and their bottom line is paramount.

There is a bumper sticker on a few cars that proclaims "Shit Happens"
As I said, once the damage is done to the child, it can not be undone.
 
I'd like to clarify my post. I said we should ask the child, because if he says no, then it's just that easy. "Sorry but your own child doesn't want to see you." It's just that simple.

If he says yes, THEN the case should be reviewed for the POSSIBILITY of MAYBE letting him see his parent (supervised). I don't like to make sweeping generalizations. But I still say generally.. hell, no.
 
Daredevel7 said:
I'd like to clarify my post. I said we should ask the child, because if he says no, then it's just that easy. "Sorry but your own child doesn't want to see you." It's just that simple.

If he says yes, THEN the case should be reviewed for the POSSIBILITY of MAYBE letting him see his parent (supervised). I don't like to make sweeping generalizations. But I still say generally.. hell, no.
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Tell it to the judge. Maybe you can suddenly change the whole system. Whoaaa baby!
 
Daredevel7 said:
I'd like to clarify my post. I said we should ask the child, because if he says no, then it's just that easy. "Sorry but your own child doesn't want to see you." It's just that simple.

If he says yes, THEN the case should be reviewed for the POSSIBILITY of MAYBE letting him see his parent (supervised). I don't like to make sweeping generalizations. But I still say generally.. hell, no.
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Thank you so very much for your compassion for the children.
 
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