Indiana religious objections bill signed for stores owners

[Foxrac]

I just read Governor Pence's statement - he said this law does NOT allow businesses to discriminate. It does however, protect the 1st Amendment rights of business owners.

.. which is entirely Constitutional ...

but legislators (creator of this bill) said otherwise.

I don't take governor's statements because they do lie all time.

 

[Steinhauer]

but legislators (creator of this bill) said otherwise.

I don't take governor's statements because they do lie all time.

How do you know that the LGBT protagonists are lying or not?

I can recall that when the same sex marriage supporters were giving their stump speeches, they promised they would not infringe on others' religious beliefs. That was a lie ....

 

[Jiro]

I just read Governor Pence's statement - he said this law does NOT allow businesses to discriminate. It does however, protect the 1st Amendment rights of business owners.

.. which is entirely Constitutional ...

actually no. I imagine this so-called law will be struck down as unconstitutional.... just like Governor Brewer's distorted view on immigration law.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/29/politics/mike-pence-indiana-anti-lgbt-religious-freedom-law/index.html

Washington (CNN)Indiana Gov. Mike Pence says concerns that his state's new "religious freedom" law will allow businesses to turn away LGBT customers is the result of a "tremendous amount of misinformation and misunderstanding."

But he refused Sunday to answer at least six yes-or-no questions about whether the measure legalizes discrimination against gays and lesbians.

Pence said he's open to legislative efforts to clarify the "religious freedom" law -- though the state's Republican-dominated legislature already rejected Democrats' push to amend it to protect gays and lesbians from discrimination, and Pence said he doesn't support a new state law with those protections.

and yet..... Pence refused to answer a yes-or-no question several times and refused to clarify his stance.

and one important thing to know.... Indiana does not have a state law barring discrimination based on sexual orientation.

 

[Jiro]

You mean like a Florist that refuses to sell flowers for a same sex wedding based on her religious beliefs?

illegal.

Or a baker who refuses to bake a wedding cake for a same sex wedding based on his religious beliefs?

illegal.

Or a private property owner who refuses to lease their property for a same sex wedding based on their religious beliefs?

illegal.

Or a photographer that refuses to take photos for a same sex wedding?

illegal.

Would you actually use government force to make these people comply with your demands?

absolutely! our government's job is to ensure and enforce equality laws and basic human rights. but would you actually use government force to make these people comply with your belief? whatever happened with separation of church and state?

really?

I see a Civil War over the horizon. There is no way that any government will ever be able to legislate morality.

exactly. no way! separation of church and state, remember? apparently the church is attempting to use the government to further its agenda and using government to make us comply with its belief.

tsk.

 

[Foxrac]

How do you know that the LGBT protagonists are lying or not?

I can recall that when the same sex marriage supporters were giving their stump speeches, they promised they would not infringe on others' religious beliefs. That was a lie ....

No, LGBT supporters aren't lying, also the legislators, even anti-gay admitted that religious bill is license to discriminate based on religious ground so that how they support.

Indiana governor's statement isn't make any sense so should I saying more?

I hate to argue with you about LGBT topic and I indeed believe that religious bill is license to discriminate but unfortunately, that's Indiana, anyway.

 

[soutthpaw]

I just read Governor Pence's statement - he said this law does NOT allow businesses to discriminate. It does however, protect the 1st Amendment rights of business owners.

.. which is entirely Constitutional ...

He is a lying sack of poop. See graphic

 

[Jiro]

 

[Steinhauer]

That does not change the fact that the LGBT supporters of same sex marriage lied outright when they promised not to infringe on the religious beliefs of others. Maybe this religious objection law is needed after all. I never knew the 1st Amendment actually had to have State Laws written specifically to protect it. I am seeing a lot of hurtful actions taken place against peaceful business owners who are simply practicing their 1st Amendment rights.

 

[Foxrac]

That does not change the fact that the LGBT supporters of same sex marriage lied outright when they promised not to infringe on the religious beliefs of others. Maybe this religious objection law is needed after all. I never knew the 1st Amendment actually had to have State Laws written specifically to protect it. I am seeing a lot of hurtful actions taken place against peaceful business owners who are simply practicing their 1st Amendment rights.

In fact, First Amendment only protect you from government, not private parties.

Unfortunately, many LGBT people were bullied and threatened by Christians so they take revenge on them now.

 

[Jiro]

That does not change the fact that the LGBT supporters of same sex marriage lied outright when they promised not to infringe on the religious beliefs of others. Maybe this religious objection law is needed after all. I never knew the 1st Amendment actually had to have State Laws written specifically to protect it. I am seeing a lot of hurtful actions taken place against peaceful business owners who are simply practicing their 1st Amendment rights.

please do not confuse freedom of speech with freedom of religion.

 

[Jiro]

In fact, First Amendment only protect you from government, not private parties.

Unfortunately, many LGBT people were bullied and threatened by Christians so they take revenge on them now.

and First Amendment prohibits the government from establishing a "national religion" and forcing the certain religious belief on citizens.

also..... the First Amendment and anything under Bill of Rights are not actually absolute. that's why no one is protected under First Amendment for hate speech, inciting violence, death threat against the President, etc.

however - this Indiana law is unconstitutional as the state government allows itself to be controlled by the church to allow the businesses to force its belief on people. don't worry. it will be struck down.

 

[Steinhauer]

But this Indiana Law is not establishing a national religion - so your point is?

It seems to me that it is preventing religious people from being persecuted via the use of government force.

You know .. little old ladies that sell flowers who refuse to participate in a same sex wedding because Jesus said it was a sin ... call the SWAT team!!! Squash that evil woman like a bug!!

 

[whatdidyousay!]

Title is misleading. The Bill that was signed into law was called the "Religious Objections Bill". It was not a law allowing business owners to kick gay people out of their stores.

From the article:

I had fixed my title

 

[Jiro]

But this Indiana Law is not establishing a national religion - so your point is?

the point is... you are misusing and misapplying the First Amendment. Freedom of Speech is not the same as Freedom of Religion.

It seems to me that it is preventing religious people from being persecuted via the use of government force.

ever heard of discrimination law? simple - follow the law.

or perhaps... those religious business owner should hang up a cross or Jesus Christ poster on their door/wall to show their Christian belief?

You know .. little old ladies that sell flowers who refuse to participate in a same sex wedding because Jesus said it was a sin ... call the SWAT team!!! Squash that evil woman like a bug!!

oh you mean like this?

 

[caz12]

call the SWAT team!!! Squash that evil woman like a bug!![/QUOTE]

This something I can never grasp you live in America you all American all take oath of allegiance same in all the States you go to war whole country but I could go to OREGON get euthanasia and California the death penalty.Plus some little old ladies are squash like bug for Jesus no problems others get medal,your laws are a conundrum.
I surppose that why you had civil war and issues still need addressing.
Please don't say like EU it not.
PEOPLE have tried explain it but just not sink into brain.I did some American history at school but fell asleep at Bunker hill maybe should tried stay awake but sad to say it was not inspiring to 17yr old girl

 

[Reba]

This something I can never grasp you live in America you all American all take oath of allegiance same in all the States you go to war whole country

Native born Americans don't take an oath of allegiance unless they take a public office or join the military. Then, that oath is to support and defend the Constitution of the United States. That covers everyone in every state.

Maybe you mean the Pledge to the Flag? Even that is voluntary, so not every American does that.

n't I could go to OREGON get euthanasia and California the death penalty.Plus some little old ladies are squash like bug for Jesus no problems others get medal,your laws are a conundrum….

America is not a one-size-fits-all country. Across the country there are so many differences in geography, environment, size of state, demographics, economies, percentage of urban v. rural, climate, language, etc. Obviously people live differently in the wilds of Alaska and the Manhattan skyscraper canyons. Also, most of the states joined the union over a long period of years in different ways, so their histories are also different. Some states had to be fought for, some were purchased. The number of states didn't happen all at once; they changed over a period of 170 years. Depending on who settled the states originally, their histories were quite different from each other. New England states were settled mostly by British people using English Common Law and English language. The Louisiana territory was settled by French people using Napoleonic Law and French language varieties. Southern California was settled by culturally Spanish natives.

In order to get all these disjointed states to agree to join the union, compromises had to be made. That meant the Constitution allowed each state to maintain control over their day-to-day local lives. It also freed up the Federal government to focus on Federal issues, such as international relations and national defense.

 

[caz12]

I did not know native americans not take the oath...What happens if native American born and bred e.g china and wants to come live in America what happens.
you explained helpfully REb.

 

[Reba]

I did not know native americans not take the oath...What happens if native American born and bred e.g china and wants to come live in America what happens.
you explained helpfully REb.

Native born American means anyone born in America, or who is born to two American citizens while overseas. Naturalized citizen means someone not born in America who becomes a citizen thru the long legal process.

If an American is born overseas, his/her parents have to apply for an American passport for that child. With an American passport, that child would be able to travel the same as any other American, and live in America. This is common with children of American missionaries who are born on the foreign field.

 

[caz12]

somethings need tidy up like death penalty gun laws.Yet things like police stations it the law all over America that fbi own them not police.some areas have state troopers not police(I watch to many cop tv programmes)then police don't have same uniforms blue or karki.
from some of the postings I can see it annoys many americans ...these just curiosity questions don't want highjack this tread but the topic seems relevant to my curiosity

 

[Reba]

somethings need tidy up like death penalty gun laws.Yet things like police stations it the law all over America that fbi own them not police.some areas have state troopers not police(I watch to many cop tv programmes)then police don't have same uniforms blue or karki.
from some of the postings I can see it annoys many americans ...these just curiosity questions don't want highjack this tread but the topic seems relevant to my curiosity

No, the FBI does not own police stations. They never have. Police stations belong to their local communities.