Grammar among Deaf People

[shezzbeav]

Parents (deaf or hearing, doesnt matter which) are the main influence on their deaf children on how they were taught to write the proper way.

Most deaf children have sign language, ASL for as an example, as their first language to communicate with, and learn written English later on when they start school.

I've heard of alot parents who do not encourage their deaf child to write and read before starting school; this causes the deaf child to have difficulty to learn in a classroom.

When I was 3 years old, my mum was worried about my deafness and how I would be able to cope in a classroom with limited English skills. She came up with a solution and bought books, handwriting books, and reading skills cards, etc etc... taught me how to read and write at home. By the time I was 4, I was able to write and read on my own. I was reading novels by the age of 7.

 

[Reba]

Sadly, the proper use of standard American English by hearing and deaf people is fading away. Reading comprehension seems to be a lost art. Even with the miracle of Spell-Check people can't produce a full paragraph without spelling errors. Proofreading for spelling and grammar errors is just not done. Thanks to im-ing, all kinds of weird spellings, abbreviations and acronyms are replacing standard spelling. The vocabulary of the average American is shrinking to the lowest common denominator. Finally, proper punctuation and capitalization is pretty much gone with the wind. Sigh....

 

[gnarlydorkette]

Because English has the stupidest rules out of all languages.

I was struggling with the "ed/ing"... because for me-- -ing is the continous process so if you say, "I am very interesting in you", it may mean that you are STILL very interested in that person. Same thing may be applied for "-ed".. it means in past. So "I am interested in you" may mean "I used to be interested in you but not anymore"....

Teachers teaching the deaf never explained the "special cases/rules" with the alternate usages/meaning of -ed and -ing for certain terms. For everyday my classroom was drilled to understand that "-ED" is for PAST... while "WILL (insert a verb)-ING" is for FUTURE et cetera... so some of the deaf students may misinterpret it (due to the lack of full extent of understanding English) and use it wrong.

To today, I am still rolling my eyes at everything English has to offer-- "no you cannot say that way because it doesn't mean that way so you have to say in an other way to make yourself clear with your way." HUH?! Fuck this and fuck English.

But you have to say the same thing for Hearing people's grammar usage. It is all about the quality and APPLICATION of one's education-- not because of their ability to hear or not. It is all about the EDUCATION and whether you DO understand what you just learned.

And Banjo-- you can say that English is a man-made language as well. I mean-- it doesn't sprout from the ground, isn't it? It just happened when some cavepeople mumbled... and some replied. then thus a language was born! [I am not SAYING that English is not the first language so back down, people]

Hope my explanation helps you to understand, Meg.
Remember, it goes the same for hearing people who doesn't speak English as their first (native) language. They do have the same problems because they don't realize that the English grammar rules are fluid as you are writing them!

 

[Nancy]

I remember a deaf classmate in high school signed in my Senior year book like this:

"Wish best from future superstar"

instead of:

"Best wishes from a future superstar" (he played baseball and loves the game).

Another deaf boy had his paper laying on a table, and a HOH girl and I were reading it....we couldn't read it at all (grammar all mixed up) and she was laughing at his paper because it was so bad.

So I know what you mean about grammar among deaf people.

 

[Banjo]

And Banjo-- you can say that English is a man-made language as well. I mean-- it doesn't sprout from the ground, isn't it? It just happened when some cavepeople mumbled... and some replied. then thus a language was born! [I am not SAYING that English is not the first language so back down, people]

I can say that English is a man-made language because it is. It is believed that prehistoric people communicated by drawing and painting. If a caveman mumble something to the other and it is understood, it's still man-made because it came from the mind of the caveman. Native Americans communicated using both their vocal chords and hand gestures. But it also varies by the tribe. What about the Egyptians? They used both icons and symbols to communicate rather than words like we do.

It makes more sense to use the word, natural as a metaphor rather than in a literal sense.

 

[Vance]

Because English has the stupidest rules out of all languages.

That's what billions of people and I agreed with that statement! English is the most retarded language on this earth (I quoted that from one good [hearing] friend of mine in England).

 

[Codger]

Recently was talking with a friend about how we noticed that a lot of Deaf people have this similiar grammar confusion.

I dont know how to call this but am giving you an example.

He: Hey, I am interesting in you.
Me: You are interesting?
He: Yes, I am interesting.


(Translation: it means he is interested in me, not that he is bragging that he is interesting.)


He: Hey, Im boring.
Me: You are boring? *scratching my head, wondering if he means he is calling himself a boring person and putting himself down or if he meant that he is bored*
He: Yep, Im boring and there is nothing to do around here.


(Translation: it means he is bored and have nothing to do, but not calling himself boring)

Get the gist?

I just gave you two examples of this....does anyone know why a lot of Deaf people have problem with this? I used to get annoyed with this but realized that I cant judge these people harshly but at the same time, I wonder why this happens often as it can really create misunderstandings, etc.

Your 2 cents on this?

O.K., in for a penny here. All of you have valid points. I am late deafened, so my "Native" language in English. All of us have to function in a world dominated by hearing people. In order to function highly (successfully achieve?) we have to understand and use proper written English (Speaking of most of U.S. And Britian, most of Canada). A medical report written in broken English with wrong tenses, missing conjunctions and prepasitions could severely limit a career and possibly jepordize a patient. Not trying to single out one profession by any means, just one example.

In ASL from what I understand, you begin with the tense. Yesterday. Then you keep talking and until you change the tense, it stays the same. In written English the tense is expressed throughout the text:

1. Yesterday. I go to the mall and see friends. We eat good food and visit.

2. I went to the mall yesterday and saw some friends. We ate some good food and visited.

Neither is wrong. Both follow rules of their own language. The same thing happens in Spanish/English translation sort of. Except there words also have feminine and masculine connotations! ( la leche, el toro) and a lot of words are omitted like in ASL because the reader understands they are implied.

So that is my penny's worth.

 

[Tikra]

None of languages is perfect and there are some complex languages out there. In fact, Mexico (spanish) language is way complex believe me because in some way it read in backward.

What I believe is only way to improve kid's education is the teaching method, I am not saying that all teachers are doing it lazy or bad way but need to know what more important for kid's education such as english, writing and READING as well. The teachers is not only people are at the fault, that include parents as well. The parents should be the one that teaching children while growing up. I know lately parents are too busy working and get home so tired didnt have chance to spend time with kids with activities or teaching kids by read books etc...

 

[Y]

I am interesting..
Which mean...... People find me interest....

I am interesting in you....
Which mean... sex, I wanna get in you.

I am interested in you...
maybe the correct term.

I am boring...
Which mean you are a boring person.

I'm bored.
Which mean.... I got nothing to do.

I think that what Meg is trying to say.

That's a very Good Point here ! Very good examples here.

P.S. Meg, if you think that is NOT the point,
then what's the point, ugh ?

 

[Vance]

That's a very Good Point here ! Very good examples here.

P.S. Meg, if you think that is NOT the point,
then what's the point, ugh ?

She didn't ask for examples... she was asking us -- the most popular question in the world -- WHY?

When I reread Meg's first post and I realized that some of us misunderstood what she was trying to ask.

 

[Banjo]

That's what billions of people and I agreed with that statement! English is the most retarded language on this earth (I quoted that from one good [hearing] friend of mine in England).

Yet you are using it.

 

[Vance]

I can attest to this Magatsu. I'm a hearie, my stuff is readable. Right?

Don't ask me... When I read many of your posts... I am jealous of your grammatical skill. So don't ask me...


shezzbeav, you mentioned 'reading' twice or more than two times, so I am curious about you... You stressed the need to reading, what's your interpretation of 'reading'? Why I asked because one person I know kept saying that reading is important but later on, I found out that person only read the newspapers, nothing else.. not even novels, journals or informative books. Just newspaper. However, I do agree with you that reading is very, very important for everyone to learn about anything. I read many books, I seem to have lost count...

Banjo, yes, I unfortunately am using this English to communicate with you people. If I have a choice, I would go for German language or probably Swedish. From what I understand, German is the most easiest language to learn and it is considered a 'universal' language (according to one of books I read when I was in High School). But again, beggars does not have a choice.

 

[Vance]

Banjo, don't get me wrong... I love English but I hate English at same time. Know what I mean? I am grateful that I am able to read English... because of these informative books.

 

[Maria]

It doesn't bother me a bit, really. The point is that it is their "comfort zone" what grammer they are usin'... ASL or English. Just bein' themselves. I am usin' both ways. ASL and English. It's not necessary to criticize or judge. Just accept them for who they really are.... that's all there's to it.

 

[Reba]

... I do agree with you that reading is very, very important for everyone to learn about anything. I read many books...

Yes, reading good literature is key for improving English skills.

... From what I understand, German is the most easiest language to learn and it is considered a 'universal' language (according to one of books I read when I was in High School). ..

I don't know if German is the "easiest" language to learn, but it used to be used almost universally as the language of science. During the 19th and 20th centuries, most scientific and medical literature was published in German. However, during the 18th, 19th, and early 20th century, French was considered the language of diplomacy and international politics. English and American students in the 18th and 19th centuries were expected to learn Greek so they could read the classics. Medical students had to learn Latin. English has become the language of commerce and trade. So I guess you could say certain languages have their "niche" in world society.

 

[Banjo]

Banjo, don't get me wrong... I love English but I hate English at same time. Know what I mean? I am grateful that I am able to read English... because of these informative books.

Oh, I know exactly what you meant by that. I imagine many people do feel the same about English sometimes. It is a very rich language, but also somehow silly at the same time.

If you can't beat them, you got to join them. Otherwise, we'll be lost!

 

[Banjo]

Banjo, yes, I unfortunately am using this English to communicate with you people. If I have a choice, I would go for German language or probably Swedish. From what I understand, German is the most easiest language to learn and it is considered a 'universal' language (according to one of books I read when I was in High School). But again, beggars does not have a choice.

Universal? Maybe in the past, but now?

Err, I can't agree with that since I really don't see much of the German language in Canada nor the USA. I also don't know a lot of people who can speak the language.

French, yes... but not German. But I live in Canada where a lot of people also speak French.

 

[Vance]

Yes, reading good literature is key for improving English skills.

Yep, it does. It does.

I don't know if German is the "easiest" language to learn, but it used to be used almost universally as the language of science. During the 19th and 20th centuries, most scientific and medical literature was published in German. However, during the 18th, 19th, and early 20th century, French was considered the language of diplomacy and international politics. English and American students in the 18th and 19th centuries were expected to learn Greek so they could read the classics. Medical students had to learn Latin. English has become the language of commerce and trade. So I guess you could say certain languages have their "niche" in world society.

Wow, interesting. I learned something new about languages...Once again, thanks for information.

Oh, I know exactly what you meant by that. I imagine many people do feel the same about English sometimes. It is a very rich language, but also somehow silly at the same time.

If you can't beat them, you got to join them. Otherwise, we'll be lost!

rofl. That's entirely true.

Universal? Maybe in the past, but now?

Err, I can't agree with that since I really don't see much of the German language in Canada nor the USA. I also don't know a lot of people who can speak the language.

French, yes... but not German. But I live in Canada where a lot of people also speak French.

Well, I just mentioned what I learned. That's all. Yeah, french language is quite popular in different countries. I am thinking of taking a french class someday.

 

[Swede]

It's quite true that many deaf struggle with English - not only deaf people, but foreigners as well. English is the hardest language to learn, especially as a second language.

I learned some French when I went to Paris on my vacation two years ago and realized that there are MANY French words in English langauge. There are some Spanish words too. It seems that English has evolved into a world language.

English is a strange language, using same words to mean different things, depending on the context. Not so with most world languages. Also, I noticed that English is the only one that use adjectives before noun - most languages are other way around, just like ASL.

I was born hearing, but became deaf when I was 2 years old, due to meningitis. I went to oral deaf school and attended regular High School - no interpreters!! I didn't learn ASL until I went to RIT/NITD in 1980. I've learned to appreciate ASL as a language, because it has opened up more of our world in my eyes and learned a great deal than I did with just English while I was growing up - no more struggling with lipreading, misunderstanding and embarrasment!

 

[deafdyke]

I am a language geek to the extreme (I enjoy reading William Safire and love reading books on English) and even I find English grammar and syntax HARD!
Thing is, poor English skills are NOT exclusive to Deaf kids/people. I know research has indicated that Deaf kids make the same grammartical/syntaxial errors as do other people who learn English as a second language.