Debate over PSE/ASL...

jillio said:
Sign Language Interpreting
32-33 Credit Certificate Program
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That's so sad of you to correct the teacher on what her program does!!! :P
 
Bottesini said:
That's so sad of you to correct the teacher on what her program does!!! :P
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Not the first time it has happened.:P I had a program similar to this closed down at a university because they were not teaching ASL, were teaching incorrect concepts regarding Deaf Culture, graduating students that could not pass the certification exam, and could not be employed as interpreters. It was being run by a hearing woman with virtually no exposure to Deaf Culture and no ASL fluency. She had managed to convince the administration of the college that she was qualified to run the program simply because they were all hearing and knew nothing about ASL, Deaf Culture, or interpreting. The program was closed for a year, and has re-opened under the direction of a Deaf instructor. ASL is now being taught as it should be, Deaf Culture is now being presented as it should be, and intepretation skills are now being taught as they should be. The program is now accredited. They no longer offer a useless 1 year certificate, but only an Associate's Degree in Deaf Studies. And should the student decide to continue on and expand into a 4 year degree, the credits for ASL transfer as foreign language credits on a Bachelor Degree.
 
No I am not ingoring the fact that you must be fluent in ASL to be an interpreter. I know that all too well!! What I am saying is not all Deaf people use ASL. You must have a knowledge of All forms of signed language. But I absolutely agree with you. If you don't know ASL, and know it well, don't even think of calling yourself or trying to get RID certified interpreter. Forgive my blunder for naming the various signed systems. also, I can't figure out how to highlight parts of things written to respond to. Sorry
 
sealhart said:
No I am not ingoring the fact that you must be fluent in ASL to be an interpreter. I know that all too well!! What I am saying is not all Deaf people use ASL. You must have a knowledge of All forms of signed language. But I absolutely agree with you. If you don't know ASL, and know it well, don't even think of calling yourself or trying to get RID certified interpreter. Forgive my blunder for naming the various signed systems. also, I can't figure out how to highlight parts of things written to respond to. Sorry
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Like what I highlighted for you?

Put these marks on the ends of what you want to bold. [b*] [/b*] remove stars
 
Bottesini said:
Like what I highlighted for you?

Put these marks on the ends of what you want to bold. [b*] [/b*] remove stars
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I hit the quote button but the whole thing you wrote came up.. How do you only select 1 or 2 sentences?
 
sealhart said:
I hit the quote button but the whole thing you wrote came up.. How do you only select 1 or 2 sentences?
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Faire Jour is right. You must manually delete after the quote comes up. Be sure not to delete the quote boxes.
 
Sealhart, I know you know who this is. But, I want to make it clear, that I was in NO way trying to be defmatory towrds the UCC Sign language program. I just really had my own views and opinions about it, and I wanted feedback from the Deaf Community. I did gain A LOT of confidence in my signing from Ulster. without Ulster, I would have never had the chance to interpret for Tiger (which, BTW, i did swich between ASL and PSE because it was easier to keep with with all the guys talking over one another). When I went to columbia-greene , the teacher was SUPER intense, and extremely against anything but ASL, so I went into the program with a closed mind. I personally perfer ASL, because I thought it was easier. I have nothing against the professor, she was completely supportive of me through-out my time at Ulster. I am not crying out for help at all, I just wanted some feedback on what Deaf people thought. I don't think there is anything wrong in that. If it seemed hurtful at all, I am completely sorry, it absolutely did not mean to come out that way.
 
Hmph... a man here has small son who is autistic. He (dad) wants to learn a little ASL to help communicate with his son. Son likes signing! I gave him one or two easy signs and then the website LifePrint (ASLU). Man comes back later after TX Teachers conference on Autism.. Tells me no, wrong signs. Teachers all do PSE/SEE.

I like ASL, beautiful, more expressive, now this is my own opinion. Many people feel strongly about which ASL - PSE - SEE. I prefer ASL.

Keith Wann doing the Ice Ice Baby skit comes to mind regarding the differences between ASL/SEE. Funny!

I had terp want to teach me SEE, but after a few days I really like ASL more.
 
Nan_Mathews said:
Hmph... a man here has small son who is autistic. He (dad) wants to learn a little ASL to help communicate with his son. Son likes signing! I gave him one or two easy signs and then the website LifePrint (ASLU). Man comes back later after TX Teachers conference on Autism.. Tells me no, wrong signs. Teachers all do PSE/SEE.

I like ASL, beautiful, more expressive, now this is my own opinion. Many people feel strongly about which ASL - PSE - SEE. I prefer ASL.

Keith Wann doing the Ice Ice Baby skit comes to mind regarding the differences between ASL/SEE. Funny!

I had terp want to teach me SEE, but after a few days I really like ASL more.
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I agree with u about ASL vs. SEE
 
I am no expert but from what I understand using ASL is more efficient in communicating than other signing systems. Since there are various methods in teaching deaf kids where some are using bi-bi and some using SEE, total communication, etc, the end result is going to be a population of signers that use various signing systems. That is further supported by some of the signers that have posted here. That said, I would imagine that as a terp you would want to have a well rounded skill set to help accommodate the diverse group of signers out there.
 
Paris614 said:
Sealhart, I know you know who this is. But, I want to make it clear, that I was in NO way trying to be defmatory towrds the UCC Sign language program. I just really had my own views and opinions about it, and I wanted feedback from the Deaf Community. I did gain A LOT of confidence in my signing from Ulster. without Ulster, I would have never had the chance to interpret for Tiger (which, BTW, i did swich between ASL and PSE because it was easier to keep with with all the guys talking over one another). When I went to columbia-greene , the teacher was SUPER intense, and extremely against anything but ASL, so I went into the program with a closed mind. I personally perfer ASL, because I thought it was easier. I have nothing against the professor, she was completely supportive of me through-out my time at Ulster. I am not crying out for help at all, I just wanted some feedback on what Deaf people thought. I don't think there is anything wrong in that. If it seemed hurtful at all, I am completely sorry, it absolutely did not mean to come out that way.
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Yes Paris, I do know who you are. You have publicly brought disfavor to the program and students attending the program through your thoughtless remarks. This program is the only one in the area that offers a comprehensive study into Deaf Culture and introduces sign in a useable manner to students, who otherwise might not have the opportunity to learn. This is not and Interpreting Training Program, but an Introduction to Sign and Deaf Culture. There is enough in this program to spur the interests in students to further their education towards an ITP or simply be able to communicate on some level with members of the Deaf Community, whether it be in stores, on the job or in social situations. Also naming a program such as you did, or naming people is in very poor taste. How do you know a person wants to be identified in a group... Personal references, whether they be about the school or a person, should be left to personal e-mails.... not public forums such as this. Think about the long term ramifications of your actions before you criticize by name.
 
sealhart said:
Yes Paris, I do know who you are. You have publicly brought disfavor to the program and students attending the program through your thoughtless remarks. This program is the only one in the area that offers a comprehensive study into Deaf Culture and introduces sign in a useable manner to students, who otherwise might not have the opportunity to learn. This is not and Interpreting Training Program, but an Introduction to Sign and Deaf Culture. There is enough in this program to spur the interests in students to further their education towards an ITP or simply be able to communicate on some level with members of the Deaf Community, whether it be in stores, on the job or in social situations. Also naming a program such as you did, or naming people is in very poor taste. How do you know a person wants to be identified in a group... Personal references, whether they be about the school or a person, should be left to personal e-mails.... not public forums such as this. Think about the long term ramifications of your actions before you criticize by name.
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Shame on you for blaming a student for the inadequacies of your program! This is not a comprehensive program, as you claim. If it were a comprehensive program, it would be teaching ASL, and would certainly not result in a certificate, but a degree. Nor is it an introduction to sign and Deaf Culture. Perhaps you need to go back and read your own program description that is being provided to students and prospective students. It is extremely misleading. As this affects the Deaf Community in a very real way, it most certainly should be brought to their attention, and the attention of the hearing community who has concerns regarding the deaf community, that this program is turning our certificate students and placing them in field position for which they are completely unqualified. I certainly would not want a graduate of this program interpreting in a classroom for any student I know. And just because it is the only program in your area does not mean that it is a good program.

Re: not wanting to be identified as associated with this program at Ulster certainly doesn't say much for your students. They must be embarrassed to have attended if being identified as an Ulster student is such a horrible thing.

If you are truly concerned about preparing students to enter the field of terping, or of preparing them to converse with the deaf socially, you should be paying attention to what the deaf are telling you here. That doesn't seem to be a concern of yours at all. All you are concerned with is the fact that your little certificate program has been criticised. Tells me your priorities are in the wrong place.

Re: your claims that Ulster prepares people to converse with the deaf socially, not to interpret...your program description states the opposite. And I don't know many people that pay the tuition necessary to attend this program, not to mention fees and books, to learn to converse socially with a deaf person they might meet in a grocery store. But if that is the purpose of the program, then it needs to be stated as such in the program description on Ultser's website, and it needs to made clear by any academic counselor that is advising a student on enrollment. Your time needs to be spent improving the program to the point that it is accredited, not trying to defend the indefensible.
 
:gpost: jillio

I was pretty surprised that a "former co-student" would even bother to take the time to register to the forum and start defending the program.

Must be the spe...oops... ::holds hands::
 
OpheliaSpeaks said:
:gpost: jillio

I was pretty surprised that a "former co-student" would even bother to take the time to register to the forum and start defending the program.

Must be the spe...oops... ::holds hands::
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Oh, Ophelia, I am so bad at understanding if you don't spell it out.

Is it another word for teacher, or program founder? :dunno:
 
Wow. I certainly did not intend for all this drama to occur on here. I simply was asking for feedback. However, I did not intend for certain people to become angry. To be very honest, I have more important things to worry about, as should you. Not some post on an internet forum. I registered on here because I wanted to furhter immerse myself into the Deaf World. That's why I started taking sign classes to being with. Sealhart, if you feel the need to announce to everyone what I wrote on here at UCC,and make them angry at me, and validate yourself through me, then that's your problem. I know for a fact that I did not cause dislike among the program. I never said it was a HORRIBLE program to being with, did I? These were not "thoughtless remarks", as you put it. I was stating my OPINION, there's a DIFFERENCE. And who did I name? Because I said someone's last name? I highly doubt that ANYONE on here knows who that person is. Further more, this is not the only program in the area that offers Sign language courses....Columbia-greene, SUNY new paltz, AND Dutchess Community STILL have courses in ASL. I hope and pray to God, that when I go to Deaf group tonight, not everyone hates me, and if they do , I will personally blame you. That wouldn't be fair, and it really has nothing to do with them.

ALSO, I withdrew from UCC not because of the program. I enjoyed it thoroughly....but I had financial issues with the school that left me no choice, but to withdraw. I know I was the topic of discussion the other night, but now that you really know my personal business.

Again, my original post was an opinion that I wanted feedback on. I most certainly did not expect a reaction like this.
 
Paris614 said:
Wow. I certainly did not intend for all this drama to occur on here. . I registered on here because I wanted to furhter immerse myself into the Deaf World. . I hope and pray to God, that when I go to Deaf group tonight, not everyone hates me, and if they do , I will personally blame you. That wouldn't be fair, and it really has nothing to do with them.


Again, my original post was an opinion that I wanted feedback on. I most certainly did not expect a reaction like this.
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They forgot to tell you in the Deaf Culture part how tiny the Deaf world really is?:lol:
 
rockdrummer said:
I am no expert but from what I understand using ASL is more efficient in communicating than other signing systems. Since there are various methods in teaching deaf kids where some are using bi-bi and some using SEE, total communication, etc, the end result is going to be a population of signers that use various signing systems. That is further supported by some of the signers that have posted here. That said, I would imagine that as a terp you would want to have a well rounded skill set to help accommodate the diverse group of signers out there.
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rockdrummer - I think you have brought up a very important fact here. ASL is not the communication/language choice for ALL deaf/hoh people.
 
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