This is a frightening situation in my area

[Reba]

Not if the patient has been probated into the facility. Since he was there as a result of law enforcement, he had to have been probated. The law regarding the handling of a probated patient are the same for private and public facilities.

They are not required to report a patient who is voluntarily there for treatment to law enforcement immediately.

This is what the DC police said:

"Police union chief Kris Baumann said the District is sending delinquents to other jurisdictions 'out of necessity' because it can't handle them on its own.

Those it does send, he said, 'are not kids who have shoplifted, these are hard-core bad guys.'"

(from my page 2 link)

 

[Reba]

No reports of home invasions or break ins in the area. Given that, chances are pretty good that he hasn't. Much better, in fact, that he has.

They don't always get reported right away. I read the local weekly crime reports. Many residents don't notice that their vehicles and out buildings have been broken into for days. So that proves nothing.

 

[jillio]

He could be in New Mexico by now.

He could be anywhere. That is the whole point. He may not even be in the area that is being held up as being at such a great risk. And if he is not in the area, and no crimes were committed immediately following his escape, then obviously, he was not the risk that everyone seems to be exaggerating.

 

[Jiro]

No one says you should not be concerned. I understand that concern. But concern based on speculation rather than actual risk is nothing more than panic. If you want to take the precautions that would really be beneficial, you need to know what the actual risk is.

I don't think anybody is panicking over this. We're just very concerned and this calls for us to be vigilant about it so that nobody gets hurt.

 

[Steinhauer]

He could be anywhere. That is the whole point. He may not even be in the area that is being held up as being at such a great risk. And if he is not in the area, and no crimes were committed immediately following his escape, then obviously, he was not the risk that everyone seems to be exaggerating.

I was just using "New Mexico" as "anywhere, U.S.A." Chances are, if he is from DC, he is going to make an attempt to go back there. I used to live in DC for about 8 years. I physically watched police pulling over these juvenile delinquents right around the corner from Gally. They would be pulling out full autos, nines, etc. The juvenile gang culture in DC is prominent. Its not a "light' matter. They are hard core.

If there is any chance this guy was involved in all that, he was probably picked up already and is running with his buddies as we speak.

 

[Reba]

"Authorities said". And authorities never ever deny being informed to cover the fact that they were delinquent in acting.

The center never denied the delay in notification. They explained that they weren't required to report it.

No one is obligated to send a pony express rider out to shout throught the neighborhood, "Mental patient gone! Beware." Find me a single incident where a mental patient walked away from a facility, and the neighbors were informed.

What century do you live in?

In our humble Southern community we have reverse 911 services. Whenever there is an emergency, they can (and have) used it to make a recorded automated phone call to every land line number in the area. I have received such calls in the past. The most recent one was to contact everyone to be on the look out for an elderly man who wandered away from home. Many of use who got the call went out to help look for him.

 

[jillio]

This is what the DC police said:

"Police union chief Kris Baumann said the District is sending delinquents to other jurisdictions 'out of necessity' because it can't handle them on its own.

Those it does send, he said, 'are not kids who have shoplifted, these are hard-core bad guys.'"

(from my page 2 link)

What does that have to do with this specific case?

 

[Steinhauer]

Metropolitan Police Department: Gangs

From the DC Police

 

[jillio]

The center never denied the delay in notification. They explained that they weren't required to report it.


What century do you live in?

In our humble Southern community we have reverse 911 services. Whenever there is an emergency, they can (and have) used it to make a recorded automated phone call to every land line number in the area. I have received such calls in the past. The most recent one was to contact everyone to be on the look out for an elderly man who wandered away from home. Many of use who got the call went out to help look for him.

Confidentialy prevents it in the case of a mentally ill patient. You can't just start calling people and saying "Hey, this guy named Joe Blow is in a psychiatric facility, and he just walked away."

 

[Steinhauer]

What does that have to do with this specific case?

I don't know if you can connect the dots, but I was able to. Reba was pointing out that they do not send shoplifters and petty thieves to her location. They send hard core juvies.

The kinds that do not work and play well with others.

 

[jillio]

Metropolitan Police Department: Gangs

From the DC Police

What do gangs have to do with this case? He is not accused of being a gang member. All anyone knows is that he was charged with assault with intent to murder and has been in a psychiatric care facility for adolescents. No one is clear on whether he was ever convicted of any charge. No one knows anything other than what I stated in the 3rd sentence.

 

[Steinhauer]

I tried ... I honestly did.


First of all, if this "child" had done nothing wrong, he would not have been court ordered to a Mental Health Facility. Secondly, as Reba was kind enough to SPELL out, DC officials have admitted that only the tough cases are transferred away from DC.

Now, a tough case is translated into = hard core tough as nails juvies. Usually, but not always (because of course, there are those very rare exceptions), hard core tough as nails juvies from DC usually translates into gang member.

 

[jillio]

I tried ... I honestly did.


First of all, if this "child" had done nothing wrong, he would not have been court ordered to a Mental Health Facility. Secondly, as Reba was kind enough to SPELL out, DC officials have admitted that only the tough cases are transferred away from DC.

Now, a tough case is translated into = hard core tough as nails juvies. Usually, but not always (because of course, there are those very rare exceptions), hard core tough as nails juvies from DC usually translates into gang member.

First of all, he is not a child. He is an adolescent. And people who have done nothing wrong are court ordered into mental health facilities all the time. In fact, the vast majority that are probated have done nothing wrong.

Nope. It said nothing of the kind. It said the cases that they could not handle themselves. That could simply mean that the DC area does not have a mental health facility that treats the specific issue for that age population. And the article was talking about being transferred to other out of area detention centers. Not mental health facilities specifically. This was a case of an adolescent being sent to an out of state mental health facility.

Again,this adolescent has not been accused of being a gang member, and there is no evidence what so ever that he has any gang affiliation at all. That one is just pulled out of thin air.

 

[jillio]

I don't know if you can connect the dots, but I was able to. Reba was pointing out that they do not send shoplifters and petty thieves to her location. They send hard core juvies.

The kinds that do not work and play well with others.

No, they send adolescents in need of mental health care. We are talking about a treatment clinic in this case, not a detention center.

 

[jillio]

What does it matter if the patient was from DC or around the corner. This is a mental health facility that treats juvenile offenders. It is going to have patients period. It doesn't matter where they come from. Just because he was from DC doesn't mean that he poses a greater risk than the patient from down the street.

 

[Steinhauer]

First of all, he is not a child. He is an adolescent. And people who have done nothing wrong are court ordered into mental health facilities all the time. In fact, the vast majority that are probated have done nothing wrong. Except he tried to kill someone ..... allegedly :roll:

Nope. It said nothing of the kind. It said the cases that they could not handle themselves. That could simply mean that the DC area does not have a mental health facility that treats the specific issue for that age population. And the article was talking about being transferred to other out of area detention centers. Not mental health facilities specifically. This was a case of an adolescent being sent to an out of state mental health facility.
That simply walked away with other juveniles who ALL had violent backgrounds

Again,this adolescent has not been accused of being a gang member, and there is no evidence what so ever that he has any gang affiliation at all.
except for the fact that he is from DC and tried to kill someone at an impressionable age .... the age ripe for Gangs to initiate
That one is just pulled out of thin air. Actually, it was quite humid air ... but thanks

Anyways .... its like trying to reason with a ... gee, I am at a loss for words.

 

[Steinhauer]

What does it matter if the patient was from DC or around the corner. This is a mental health facility that treats juvenile offenders. It is going to have patients period. It doesn't matter where they come from. Just because he was from DC doesn't mean that he poses a greater risk than the patient from down the street.

You quite possibly would have to have some knowledge of DC. It would matter what area of the city he is from, specifically.

And yes, it does matter.

 

[jillio]

Anyways .... its like trying to reason with a ... gee, I am at a loss for words.

What age was he when he was charged with intent to commit murder?

Allegedly is he key. He has not been proven to be guilty of anything. You cannot figure risk on an allegation.

So he is from DC. How do you get from that to the leap of logic that he is a gang member?

Oh? What age do gangs initiate? And again, at what age was he charged? What was his age when the alleged assault occurred?

Again, you are making huge leaps in logic with virtually nothing to support them.

 

[jillio]

You quite possibly would have to have some knowledge of DC. It would matter what area of the city he is from, specifically.

And yes, it does matter.

No it doesn't matter. Not in this case. His place of residence has not been shown to have anything to do with his illness, his alleged assault, or anything else.

What area is he from,then? If you are so certain that he is a gang member, then you must know exactly where in DC he lived since the area is an important factor.

I don't think, "oh, he's from DC. He must be a gang member and he must be guilty of trying to kill someone because he is from DC" will hold water in our legal system.

The fact is that every patient in that facility is being treated for something that could conceivable make them at risk for violent behavior at some given point in time. The fact that he is from DC does not mean that he is a greater risk than any other patient in the faciltiy.

 

[Steinhauer]

What age was he when he was charged with intent to commit murder?

Allegedly is he key. He has not been proven to be guilty of anything. You cannot figure risk on an allegation.

So he is from DC. How do you get from that to the leap of logic that he is a gang member?

Oh? What age do gangs initiate? And again, at what age was he charged? What was his age when the alleged assault occurred?

Again, you are making huge leaps in logic with virtually nothing to support them.

I have heard from former gang members that have stated being initiated when they were 13 years old.

Some have said 14, others ... 15 .. still others .... 19

You still haven't commented on how he escaped with 3 other juveniles that ALL had violent backgrounds.

Sounds like it was planned and not just "walking away" as you have repeatedly stated.