California Bill AB 2027

[jillio]

I thought that people always said that they wished they had had access to ASL and deaf peers while they were in school? That mainstreamed kids had social problems because they were the only deaf child in the school. I am preventing just those problems.

You are looking at things from an extremely superficial level. You are providing access to deaf peers. You are separating the languages in exactly the same way that has been done for centuries. It is more of the same old, same old.

 

[faire_jour]

You are looking at things from an extremely superficial level. You are providing access to deaf peers. You are separating the languages in exactly the same way that has been done for centuries. It is more of the same old, same old.

ASL and English need to be kept seperate, if they are mixed that is when the trouble starts (TC/lingustic confusion).

 

[A]

I thought that people always said that they wished they had had access to ASL and deaf peers while they were in school? That mainstreamed kids had social problems because they were the only deaf child in the school. I am preventing just those problems.

You forgetting family too. That's where it hurts the most because friends come and goes.

I understand why hearing people feel they have to implant or fit HA though. It is easy for them to be harshly judged by other hearing people if they don't because they can't understand why a hearing person would deprive (sp?) their child like that. Or feel guilty if they don't do anything about it. So I am not going to bother them. I'm just going to make sure deaf people have rights to raise their child how they want to raise them AND make sure they don't make fault informations about ASL and deaf culture.

 

[jillio]

ASL and English need to be kept seperate, if they are mixed that is when the trouble starts (TC/lingustic confusion).

And why would you use the language to which she has the least access as the language of instruction? That is the whole point. She is still in an oral classroom. You have achieved nothing new.

 

[faire_jour]

And why would you use the language to which she has the least access as the language of instruction? That is the whole point. She is still in an oral classroom. You have achieved nothing new.

I want my child to be bilingual in ASL and English. I believe the best way for her to learn a language she must be immersed in it. First she was immersed in ASL, and that became her first language. Now she is using her skills in her first language to learn her second language, English. She is being immersed in English to learn that language now.

 

[jillio]

I want my child to be bilingual in ASL and English. In order for her to learn a language she must be immersed in it. First she was immersed in ASL, and that became her first language. Now she is using her skills in her first language to learn her second language, English. She is being immersed in English to learn that language now.

So, you find it acceptable to use the language to which she has the least access, spoken English, as the language of instruction not just for English, but for all academic materials, as well.

If ASL is indeed her native language...although I don't think I can agree that it was since she was 15 months old, and had not been exposed to it from birth, (making it her first language, but not necessarily her native) then why would you not use what she is strongest in to insure that she get all of the information necessary to become educated in all the academic subjects? She could more easily become bilingual by making ASL the language of instruction, and English the pull out. Plus she would be given the advantage of greater access to math, science, geography, history, and all of the academic subjects.

 

[faire_jour]

So, you find it acceptable to use the language to which she has the least access, spoken English, as the language of instruction not just for English, but for all academic materials, as well.

If ASL is indeed her native language...although I don't think I can agree that it was since she was 15 months old, and had not been exposed to it from birth, (making it her first language, but not necessarily her native) then why would you not use what she is strongest in to insure that she get all of the information necessary to become educated in all the academic subjects? She could more easily become bilingual by making ASL the language of instruction, and English the pull out. Plus she would be given the advantage of greater access to math, science, geography, history, and all of the academic subjects.

We started signing before she was dx'ed at 15 months, we just increased it once we figured out she had a loss.

Again, I believe that a child learns language by exposure to it, using it everyday, not through a few minutes a week in pullout. She remains age appropriate in her academics (though she is a tiny bit behind in phonetic reading, she had not been exposed before this year to phonics). We are using this time to have her grow her second language through using it.

 

[shel90]

We started signing before she was dx'ed at 15 months, we just increased it once we figured out she had a loss.

Again, I believe that a child learns language by exposure to it, using it everyday, not through a few minutes a week in pullout. She remains age appropriate in her academics (though she is a tiny bit behind in phonetic reading, she had not been exposed before this year to phonics). We are using this time to have her grow her second language through using it.

How did many deaf children who grew up going to classes where ASL is the language of instruction manage to become fluent in English as well?

 

[faire_jour]

How did many deaf children who grew up going to classes where ASL is the language of instruction manage to become fluent in English as well?

Did I say they couldn't?

 

[shel90]

Did I say they couldn't?

Can u pls answer the question?

 

[flip]

Ah I see now. Thanks for clarifying. Yes I had asked you 3 or 4 times (the same question) but could not get you to respond, so I grew weary of asking and thought you did not want to discuss it.

But I can now understand that your version of success only applies for those who can still hear though, it wouldn't be able to work as well for those who can't, right?

Curious if you got an answer on the question why Kokonut stayed at Gallaudet? It was a good question. The only reason I can come up with is that Kokonut somehow became hooked to ASL as he stayed there for 3 long years.

 

[faire_jour]

Can u pls answer the question?

I don't know how each person was educated. How can I answer that question?

 

[shel90]

I don't know how each person was educated. How can I answer that question?

Ok then..

Then, deaf children are capable of acquiring English without needing to be in an oral environment so why would anyone accept putting any child at risks for not having fully access to the cirruculm and communication that is going on in the classroom and possibling missing out important teaching moments or learning about something?

So, do you find that acceptable?

 

[naisho]

Curious if you got an answer on the question why Kokonut stayed at Gallaudet? It was a good question. The only reason I can come up with is that Kokonut somehow became hooked to ASL as he stayed there for 3 long years.

Nope, from what it appears to me, he's not willing to share his experience at that school. I thought it would be interesting to ask about his stay too.

Not sure why it would be too confidential, he wants his privacy rights respected so I guess that is the sum of it.

 

[faire_jour]

Ok then..

Then, deaf children are capable of acquiring English without needing to be in an oral environment so why would anyone accept putting any child at risks for not having fully access to the cirruculm and communication that is going on in the classroom and possibling missing out important teaching moments or learning about something?

So, do you find that acceptable?

I do not believe I am doing that. I believe that I am providing her the opportunity to learn fluent English in a classroom that has a teacher who has the expertise to teach spoken language to children with a hearing loss. She is not "at risk" for anything. She has access to the curiculum and content.

 

[shel90]

I do not believe I am doing that. I believe that I am providing her the opportunity to learn fluent English in a classroom that has a teacher who has the expertise to teach spoken language to children with a hearing loss. She is not "at risk" for anything. She has access to the curiculum and content.

Maybe your child may not be but there are many other deaf children being put at those risks but my question was in reference to deaf children in general, not just your daughter only.

That's why I dont support oral-deaf education.

 

[GrendelQ]

Wow, Jillio, you really are on a tear: Asking us to whip out and place our legislative credentials against your big swinging DC trip last week, mocking the size of our efforts to build our local school programs (and the schools themselves), sniffing at our efforts to promote ASL to other parents of kids with CIs or considering CIs, and now snidely ridiculing what we've seen as a long battle FJ has undergone to include ASL in her child's curriculum against an enormous opposition that apparently your years of Herculean effort didn't fix for those of us just entering the fray.

And yet, 20 years of visits to Capitol Hill and you couldn't get ASL on a list of options offered to new parents? I guess it's not the size of your 'what I did to better the world' list , but what you do with it.

 

[faire_jour]

Maybe your child may not be but there are many other deaf children being put at those risks but my question was in reference to deaf children in general, not just your daughter only.

That's why I dont support oral-deaf education.

Then start supporting parents who want ASL and spoken language. Many bi-bi schools do not support the use of audition to access spoken English. They support only ASL-written English bilingualism with "speech skills". There is a difference.

 

[A]

Then start supporting parents who want ASL and spoken language. Many bi-bi schools do not support the use of audition to access spoken English. They support only ASL-written English bilingualism with "speech skills". There is a difference.

try oral interpreter?

As far as ASL writing, They should just call their school "ASL cultural school for the deaf" and not bi-bi

 

[faire_jour]

try oral interpreter?

Some Deaf school do this. They have one teacher of the Deaf and an interpreter in each class. The teacher teachers in ASL and an interpreter voices for the students who use spoken language. Other ideas include using 2 teachers of the deaf, each of them use the language in which they are most comforatble and the students attend to whomever they prefer. Or giving the lesson in one language and then the other.