ASL student attending Deaf event

I am very - VERY - far from fluent in ASL, but I tend to be naturally very visually-oriented person, which helps me in my learning.....I just try my best. At the Deaf socials I have been to, I follow protocol for event, knowing is DEAF event first. Even if I stumble along, when I am with Deaf people, I sign. I also find that as I become more involved, I remember more signs from before. I find that I am thinking more in ASL grammar structure as I go along and my friend helps when she reminds me - less English:)
 
dogmom said:
I am very - VERY - far from fluent in ASL, but I tend to be naturally very visually-oriented person, which helps me in my learning.....I just try my best. At the Deaf socials I have been to, I follow protocol for event, knowing is DEAF event first. Even if I stumble along, when I am with Deaf people, I sign. I also find that as I become more involved, I remember more signs from before. I find that I am thinking more in ASL grammar structure as I go along and my friend helps when she reminds me - less English:)
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I feel you Dogmom. I just went to my first Deaf social and did the same. If I knew a sign, I would sign it. If not, I would ask what the sign was for that word. The guy I was signing too worked with me and asked me to lip or speak as I signed. At first I was worried about “speaking with volume on” to someone that was deaf, but it became apparent really fast that he was reading my lips AS I signed so that he would know what I was attempting to get across as I screwed up. He could then correct me knowing what I was attempting to sign. I had read about the do’s and do not’s WAY before going, so I tried going with volume off, but one of the guy’s there said I was stiff as a board and was hard to read (I would not doubt it, as I was very nervous).

My best friend came with me and knows even less of sign, but is supporting me with my learning since I started having hearing issues. He knows about 60-70 signs, but we are both new to ASL. As I would talk to my friend, I would sign what words I knew. I am guessing it would have been hard to read us since it was every other word or less, but I did what I knew and everyone seemed ok with it.
 
Lighthouse77 said:
It take a hearing person to correct another hearing person. Rarely they ever listen to deaf people if we tell them that it isn't always true.
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You know what? I noticed that in real life too. It seems like if a deaf person tells a hearing person that he/she is wrong about something (can be in general not just about Deaf culture), the hearing person tells the deaf person that they dont know anything but then later on, another hearing person tells the hearing person the same thing and that hearing person accepts that he/she is wrong. I see that soooo many times out there and it does feel degrading sometimes.
 
yes, that's why I said it. It was from my own observation. It's so frustrating because I'm like "That's what I said too!"
 
jillio said:
Exactly. Just another example of the fact that they discount the deaf person's experience and what they say is true about their culture.
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the problem is that it depends on who you talk to and how entrenched (if at all) they are in d/Deaf culture. You have to admit there are varying views even within the deaf community. Not everybody shares the same experiences and views. It's why I ask why. Not to argue so much but to make sure I understand and also to make sure I am not taking the views of only select individuals. Getting opinions and experiences from a wider audience for me will paint a more accurate picture. At least that is what I believe.
 
rockdrummer said:
the problem is that it depends on who you talk to and how entrenched (if at all) they are in d/Deaf culture. You have to admit there are varying views even within the deaf community. Not everybody shares the same experiences and views. It's why I ask why. Not to argue so much but to make sure I understand and also to make sure I am not taking the views of only select individuals. Getting opinions and experiences from a wider audience for me will paint a more accurate picture. At least that is what I believe.
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Getting experiences from a wider audience is better but there are some people who still continue to discount all those exeperiences. I find these people not worth to be bothered with. I can see that you are not like them and that you truly want to learn. :)
 
glad u had good time at Social, FX:wave: and that your friend could come, too-
 
shel90 said:
Getting experiences from a wider audience is better but there are some people who still continue to discount all those exeperiences. I find these people not worth to be bothered with. I can see that you are not like them and that you truly want to learn. :)
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Thanks! It is true.
 
rockdrummer said:
the problem is that it depends on who you talk to and how entrenched (if at all) they are in d/Deaf culture. You have to admit there are varying views even within the deaf community. Not everybody shares the same experiences and views. It's why I ask why. Not to argue so much but to make sure I understand and also to make sure I am not taking the views of only select individuals. Getting opinions and experiences from a wider audience for me will paint a more accurate picture. At least that is what I believe.
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I agree with what you are saying to a great extent. But I can't deny that the credibility of the deaf person is often discounted simply because they are deaf. I have watched, for over 20 years now how a deaf person can relate their experience, and they are treated as if they have no clue, but let a hearing person repeat it, and it is believed all of a sudden. In fact, I have seen it happen so many times, that I now use it to an advantage. I will ask the deaf for their input, and when I am sure that I have it correct, I willsimply voice it for them, knowing that I will be considered more credible simply because I am hearing. It pisses me off, but the only thing I can do about it is turn the tables and use it to advocate for the deaf in the way they want to be advocated for. If I am unsure of something, I will go directly to the deaf to make sure that I am representing them properly. Then I use the situation to give a voice to what they have told me. It is all part of my "nothing for us without us" philosophy. And all the while, the people who won't listen to the deaf are actually being made to listen to them. I'm sure you have seen me do that right here on this forum more than once, lol.
 
jillio said:
I agree with what you are saying to a great extent. But I can't deny that the credibility of the deaf person is often discounted simply because they are deaf. I have watched, for over 20 years now how a deaf person can relate their experience, and they are treated as if they have no clue, but let a hearing person repeat it, and it is believed all of a sudden. In fact, I have seen it happen so many times, that I now use it to an advantage. I will ask the deaf for their input, and when I am sure that I have it correct, I willsimply voice it for them, knowing that I will be considered more credible simply because I am hearing. It pisses me off, but the only thing I can do about it is turn the tables and use it to advocate for the deaf in the way they want to be advocated for. If I am unsure of something, I will go directly to the deaf to make sure that I am representing them properly. Then I use the situation to give a voice to what they have told me. It is all part of my "nothing for us without us" philosophy. And all the while, the people who won't listen to the deaf are actually being made to listen to them. I'm sure you have seen me do that right here on this forum more than once, lol.
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Hearing people who discount deaf people's experiences and then turn around to believe other hearing people about the same thing do not get my respect at all. I usually end up cutting them out of my life. I dont need people like that in my life.
 
Lighthouse77 said:
It take a hearing person to correct another hearing person. Rarely they ever listen to deaf people if we tell them that it isn't always true.
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I don't think it's necessarily a hearing/Deaf thing. Some people just don't like being told they're wrong no matter who it's coming from.
 
that's true too :) but I was referring to those who refuse to listen to us, but when a hearing person pop in and speak the same thing... they are like "yeah, you're right"
 
Mountain Man said:
I don't think it's necessarily a hearing/Deaf thing. Some people just don't like being told they're wrong no matter who it's coming from.
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I wish it was true in my experience but growing up, I was always told I was wrong by hearing people but when other hearing people tell them the same thing I say, they believe them. Like one example..I told my dad that the measurements for a curtain rod were wrong and he told me that I didnt know anything and then my hearing cousin who was a year younger than me told him the same thing and then my dad went and measured to double check. Turned out that I was right but he patted my cousin's back praising him for catching the measurement error.

That is what Lighthouse is most likely referring to.
 
shel90 said:
I wish it was true in my experience but growing up, I was always told I was wrong by hearing people but when other hearing people tell them the same thing I say, they believe them. Like one example..I told my dad that the measurements for a curtain rod were wrong and he told me that I didnt know anything and then my hearing cousin who was a year younger than me told him the same thing and then my dad went and measured to double check. Turned out that I was right but he patted my cousin's back praising him for catching the measurement error.

That is what Lighthouse is most likely referring to.
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In this situation, I can't tell if it is a man thing where a man doesn't want to listen to a woman (which is very common) ... or Hearing doesn't want to listen to a deaf.
 
Lighthouse77 said:
that's true too :) but I was referring to those who refuse to listen to us, but when a hearing person pop in and speak the same thing... they are like "yeah, you're right"
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That's unfortunate. I've not encountered that kind of thing personally, but perhaps it's because most of my interactions with Deaf are as a minority, so I'm the odd man out and they have to take time to carefully explain things to me thanks to my less than stellar but slowly improving receptive skills.
 
jillio said:
I agree with what you are saying to a great extent. But I can't deny that the credibility of the deaf person is often discounted simply because they are deaf. I have watched, for over 20 years now how a deaf person can relate their experience, and they are treated as if they have no clue, but let a hearing person repeat it, and it is believed all of a sudden. In fact, I have seen it happen so many times, that I now use it to an advantage. I will ask the deaf for their input, and when I am sure that I have it correct, I willsimply voice it for them, knowing that I will be considered more credible simply because I am hearing. It pisses me off, but the only thing I can do about it is turn the tables and use it to advocate for the deaf in the way they want to be advocated for. If I am unsure of something, I will go directly to the deaf to make sure that I am representing them properly. Then I use the situation to give a voice to what they have told me. It is all part of my "nothing for us without us" philosophy. And all the while, the people who won't listen to the deaf are actually being made to listen to them. I'm sure you have seen me do that right here on this forum more than once, lol.
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I do understand what you are saying and it's not that I don't agree to some extent. My problem is that I am a bit cynical due to personal experiences and how people are. I apply reluctance to believe something to hearing people as well. It is part of who I am and part of how I learn. I am an equal opportunity skeptic. I think it is wrong for me or anyone to just believe what somebody says without further investigation and getting opinions from others. For me, it's not only part of how I learn but it's also how I make sure I am getting a balanced view.

We know in the deaf community there are far left to far right and everything in between just as there are in many walks of life. I have been here and other places long enough to where I am fairly confident that I understand the perspectives from a variety of deaf folks. It bothers me when someone comes down on me for trying to learn with the "how dare you question a deaf person" attitude. Just because somebody says something doesn't mean it's true or doesn't mean it's the experience or viewpoint of the majority. I simply can't take the opinions or experiences of a few as gospel. Especially when other deaf people don't share those views and experiences.

The deaf social which I thought was yesterday was actually the previous Saturday. They hold them on the third Sat of each month so I will be attending the one in December. Meanwhile I will be brushing up on certian ASL phrases to hopefully get me through without having to speak or write stuff down. That means I will be doing alot of observing and not so much conversing and will no doubt miss out on a lot. I know... welcome to the deaf world... right? I will be interested in how this goes and am looking forward to it.
 
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