Some thoughts?

[jillio]

Obviously you have never seen me at therapy or you would know that I do participate. 50% me and her and the therapist, 50% just her and the therapist. Tuesday for an hour, Friday for an hour.

You just stated that the therapist played a game of Candyland with her. You said nothing about you and the therapist playing a game of Candyland with her.

50% you and 50% the therapist? What about 100% with the three of you? Because it is therapist and parent directed, first with the therapist directing her, and then with the therapist directing your interaction with her.

So, she is getting rehabilitative services outside of school. If you think she needs more, increase the number of times per week that you put her through this directive therapy.

 

[faire_jour]

You just stated that the therapist played a game of Candyland with her. You said nothing about you and the therapist playing a game of Candyland with her.

50% you and 50% the therapist? What about 100% with the three of you? Because it is therapist and parent directed, first with the therapist directing her, and then with the therapist directing your interaction with her.

I will stick to the advice of my daughter's therapist, thanks. You are not a expert in the field, as I am sure you will admit.

 

[jillio]

I will stick to the advice of my daughter's therapist, thanks. You are not a expert in the field, as I am sure you will admit.

Good. Stick to your therapist's advice, continue to provide her therapy with this particular therapist, and stop trying to force the school to do it for you.

And actually, I am an expert on early childhood development and cognitive processes.

 

[faire_jour]

Good. Stick to your therapist's advice, continue to provide her therapy with this particular therapist, and stop trying to force the school to do it for you.

Actually, the therapist thinks the school is way out of bounds. She thinks Utah is 20 years behind in terms of services for the deaf. She believes it is outrageous to have such an uninformed, behind, ignorant SLP working with kids is obscene. She also thinks that the idea that they won't provide ANY support for spoken language is counter productive.

 

[jillio]

Actually, the therapist thinks the school is way out of bounds. She thinks Utah is 20 years behind in terms of services for the deaf. She believes it is outrageous to have such an uninformed, behind, ignorant SLP working with kids is obscene. She also thinks that the idea that they won't provide ANY support for spoken language is counter productive.

Doesn't matter what she thinks. You still don't have any legal, moral, or ethical standing to force the school to provide additional speech or listening therapy. And of course she would think that. No need for her services otherwise. Speech therapists, by nature of their profession, function from an oralist perspective.

 

[faire_jour]

Doesn't matter what she thinks. You still don't have any legal, moral, or ethical standing to force the school to provide additional speech or listening therapy. And of course she would think that. No need for her services otherwise. Speech therapists, by nature of their profession, function from an oralist perspective.

Again, you are wrong. She advocates sign for every deaf child and believes an educational setting should support the development of both. She is also a fluent signer.

Very closed minded and judgemental of you.

 

[shel90]

Actually, the therapist thinks the school is way out of bounds. She thinks Utah is 20 years behind in terms of services for the deaf. She believes it is outrageous to have such an uninformed, behind, ignorant SLP working with kids is obscene. She also thinks that the idea that they won't provide ANY support for spoken language is counter productive.

It is common knowledge that AVT therapists support oralism first so it is not surprising that she has this view of the school.

 

[faire_jour]

It is common knowledge that AVT therapists support oralism first so it is not surprising that she has this view of the school.

Read above post.

I am disappointed that because someone is a therapist it is assumed they are an oralist.

So judgemental...

 

[Berry]

Depends on your definition of therapy. Is signing to your child "ASL therapy"? Is walking through the zoo talking about the animals therapy?

Actually if you study linguistics it is. There is such a thing as surface structure and deep structure in language and thought. If you follow linguistics to its ultimate conclusion then the richer a person's deep structure is the more capable, sane, and adjusted, the person will be.

This therapy starts as an open ended meta-dialogue between parent and child.

In its simplest form surface structure is that which is seen, heard, and expressed. The child sees a monkey and learns to associate certain things with it: sight, smell, actions such as swinging from a tree by its tail, a sound it makes; And is told to represent the creature using the sign "monkey" or the word "monkey" and is perhaps taught how to spell or lip read "monkey."

Deep structure begins when you the parent figure explain that this zoo is not the monkey's natural habitat, and deepens further when you explain the various roles this monkey plays in the lives of different groups of humans:

Some people never get to see a monkey in real life, only in a picture book.

In Sri Lanka monkeys live in a temple and people worship them.

Some tribes eat monkeys.

Some monkeys are helper monkeys for people in wheel chairs.

Compare this to the deep structure stifling done by the parent who simply says, "This is a monkey. An obnoxious, shit throwing, squalling, little creature we are not related to."

When a child goes through the stage of asking "Why" until the parent wants to scream, it is in reality asking for deep structure for its subconscious mind.

The parent with no deep structure of their own will pass it on by telling the child to quit asking so many stupid questions.

The parent with well developed deep structure themselves will answer the child to the extent of their capability.

The parent who knows what is going on might explain to the child that why is not always the right question to ask. We also have what, when, where, how, and who, and often these are the questions that will yield the best results.

Is going to the zoo and signing or talking about the animals therapy?

You BET!

 

[loml]

Actually, the therapist thinks the school is way out of bounds. She thinks Utah is 20 years behind in terms of services for the deaf. She believes it is outrageous to have such an uninformed, behind, ignorant SLP working with kids is obscene. She also thinks that the idea that they won't provide ANY support for spoken language is counter productive.

faire_jour - Have you explored contacting the American Speech-Language-Hearing Association (ASHA)?

 

[shel90]

Read above post.

I am disappointed that because someone is a therapist it is assumed they are an oralist.

I said oralism first....

 

[jillio]

Again, you are wrong. She advocates sign for every deaf child and believes an educational setting should support the development of both. She is also a fluent signer.

Very closed minded and judgemental of you.

Not closed minded and judgemental of me at all. I am going on what you are telling me about her and her therapeutic techniques. And is she is such a strong supporter of sign for all deaf kids, why isn't she using it in therapy?

 

[faire_jour]

Actually if you study linguistics it is. There is such a thing as surface structure and deep structure in language and thought. If you follow linguistics to its ultimate conclusion then the richer a person's deep structure is the more capable, sane, and adjusted the person will be.

This therapy starts as an open ended meta-dialogue between parent and child.

In its simplest form surface structure is that which is seen, heard, and expressed. The child sees a monkey and learns to associate certain things with it: sight, smell, actions such as swinging from a tree by its tail, a sound it makes; And is told to represent the creature using the sign "monkey" or the word "monkey" and is perhaps taught how to spell or lip read "monkey."

Deep structure begins when you the parent figure explain that this zoo is not the monkey's natural habitat, and deepens further when you explain the various roles this monkey plays in the lives of different groups of humans:

Some people never get to see a monkey in real life, only in a picture book.

In Sri Lanka monkeys live in a temple and people worship them.

Some tribes eat monkeys.

Some monkeys are helper monkeys for people in wheel chairs.

Compare this to the deep structure stifling done by the parent who simply says, "This is a monkey. An obnoxious, shit throwing, squalling, little creature we are not related to."

When a child goes through the stage of asking "Why" until the parent wants to scream, it is in reality asking for deep structure for its subconscious mind.

The parent with no deep structure of their own will pass it on by telling the child to quit asking so many stupid questions.

The parent with well developed deep structure themselves will answer the child to the extent of their capability.

The parent who knows what is going on might explain to the child that why is not always the right question to ask. We also have what, when, where, how, and who, and often these are the questions that will yield the best results.

Is going to the zoo and talking about the animals therapy?

You BET!

I love this!
Thanks!!!

 

[shel90]

Read above post.

I am disappointed that because someone is a therapist it is assumed they are an oralist.

So judgemental...

It is not surprising that she has that view...isnt the training of AVT therapist include a stronger emphasis on oralism?

 

[jillio]

Read above post.

I am disappointed that because someone is a therapist it is assumed they are an oralist.

So judgemental...

Again, it is not judgemental at all. It is a logical conclusion based on the fact that you have stated that she is providing AVT therapy for your daughter.

 

[faire_jour]

Not closed minded and judgemental of me at all. I am going on what you are telling me about her and her therapeutic techniques. And is she is such a strong supporter of sign for all deaf kids, why isn't she using it in therapy?

She used to, until Miss Kat didn't need it. (In the one on one, controlled enviroment) She still does for clarification, occasionally.

 

[faire_jour]

I said oralism first....

Nope, she supports both.

 

[jillio]

Actually if you study linguistics it is. There is such a thing as surface structure and deep structure in language and thought. If you follow linguistics to its ultimate conclusion then the richer a person's deep structure is the more capable, sane, and adjusted, the person will be.

This therapy starts as an open ended meta-dialogue between parent and child.

In its simplest form surface structure is that which is seen, heard, and expressed. The child sees a monkey and learns to associate certain things with it: sight, smell, actions such as swinging from a tree by its tail, a sound it makes; And is told to represent the creature using the sign "monkey" or the word "monkey" and is perhaps taught how to spell or lip read "monkey."

Deep structure begins when you the parent figure explain that this zoo is not the monkey's natural habitat, and deepens further when you explain the various roles this monkey plays in the lives of different groups of humans:

Some people never get to see a monkey in real life, only in a picture book.

In Sri Lanka monkeys live in a temple and people worship them.

Some tribes eat monkeys.

Some monkeys are helper monkeys for people in wheel chairs.

Compare this to the deep structure stifling done by the parent who simply says, "This is a monkey. An obnoxious, shit throwing, squalling, little creature we are not related to."

When a child goes through the stage of asking "Why" until the parent wants to scream, it is in reality asking for deep structure for its subconscious mind.

The parent with no deep structure of their own will pass it on by telling the child to quit asking so many stupid questions.

The parent with well developed deep structure themselves will answer the child to the extent of their capability.

The parent who knows what is going on might explain to the child that why is not always the right question to ask. We also have what, when, where, how, and who, and often these are the questions that will yield the best results.

Is going to the zoo and talking about the animals therapy?

You BET!

Well stated, Berry. And it is exactly this deep structure that is absent in so many who were raised in an oral only environment, and that which they experience only after being introduced to ASL allowing them to access their innate capabilities to use language at this deeper level.

 

[shel90]

My daughter (and several other students with auditory abilities) need a bi-bi educational enviroment but also need appropriate service for aural rehab, their needs are NOT being met.

Did the children demand for aural rehab? Are they saying that it is their needs not being met?

 

[jillio]

She used to, until Miss Kat didn't need it. (In the one on one, controlled enviroment) She still does for clarification, occasionally.

So, Miss Kat still needs sign for clarification. Doesn't that tell you anything?

And, if this therapist is using sign in her therapies with your daughter, she is not conducting AVT.

And you might want to keep in mind that communication does not occur in a controlled environment.

Miss Kat is only 2 months or so into her CI, correct? And in that short amount of time, she has no need for visual cues, even though you claim that was the foundation of her early language acquisition? Something is not adding up.