Grammar

[Berry]

English grammar has some problems.

Even without considering spelling. Knot and not are spelt the same, said different while Polish and polish are spelt the same, said different. And then there is PREsent and preSENT which is spelt the same and said the same -- But the accent is on the opposite syllable.

While the grammar nazis think grammar should be slavishly obeyed many of us believe English, both written and spoken, should be revamped.

Some rules are ridiculous -- Such as the one against splitting infinitives. At the time this one was put into effect Latin was considered The Perfect Language. You can NOT spilt an infinitive in Latin -- Therefore you should not in English. However the structure of English makes splitting infinitives both easy to do and easier to understand.

Some of our written grammar makes it more difficult to communicate, not easier. To make it worse prescriptive grammar was designed to control written English -- Not spoken English -- But grammar nazis tend to insist that these rules be applied to spoken English as well.

There are two types of grammar.

Prescriptive grammar states how you MUST speak and write in order to be considered intelligent and educated enough for those in power to consider you worth paying attention too. You will not be considered for the office of Prime Minister of England if you insist on using a Cockney accent.

The entire concept of following, or not following, prescriptive grammar for a written language is one of the problems facing those who would like ASL accepted as an equal to English.

Linguistic grammar considers how people actually communicate with each other. How communication develops over time and what is actually conveyed, both spoken and unspoken. For example when someone answers a question with "Of course." Nowhere in this two word sentence is it implied on the surface that the question or the questioner said something stupid -- But every native speaker knows that is EXACTLY what it Does mean.

Linguistic grammar can account for the Frenchman's native shrug. Prescriptive grammar considers it beneath notice.

Prescriptive grammar is not a friend to ASL.

 

[jedimunky]

I have worn hearing aids since I was three, as that was when my hearing loss was first diagnosed. Grammatically, I think I am fine. Speaking, I am fine, although I have a tendency to rush my words and therefore stutter sometimes. I never learned ASL as I never felt that I needed to, even though I did go to a deaf camp for twice as a kid and I did go on some field trips of sorts with other Deaf/HoH kids. As well as participating in several banquets for Deaf/HoH kid as well.

 

[Audiofuzzy]

This is a woman who is generally very insecure overall, so it doesn't surprise me that she's so picky about this.

hmm. maybe she was OCD??? an' grammar was her thingy?...

Fuzzy

 

[natty_4ever]

Most Deaf learn how to read and write English but don't advance. Most of the time, it's a matter of early language development and lack of proper instruction in either sign or English. *shrug* The out-of-order thing you see is syntax confusion.

THIS.

I grew up JUST LIKE YOU, OP. I grew up mainstreamed in an all-hearing school and was the only deaf student in the ENTIRE school. I only had hearing aids and nothing else. Guess what? I was in the top of my class in AP English also! In fact, I did so good because I graduated high school a year early with honors and got into Harvard! Do you see me parading around on this forum about how awesome my English is? How great I can speak and how awesome my hearing aids are because now I can INTEGRATE into the hearing world?! No. You'll never see that, because I am a proud Deaf person who LOVES being part of the Deaf culture. I have hearing friends and I'm not scared of the hearing world, but I've accepted my identity and you need to do the same.

Not everyone is just like you, OP. Some parents don't know what to do for their deaf children and they're dumped off at mainstream school with nothing. Maybe they're totally deaf and hearing aids don't work, so they get no benefit in hearing school whatsoever without an interpreter. Maybe the parents don't learn sign or cued speech or any communication method to help their child, and as a result, their reading suffers because of the lack of language exposure. Is it their fault? No, it's not. STOP BLAMING THEM.

Good lord. I rarely get mad on AD but this is one thread that actually pinched a nerve.

 

[Banjo]

THIS.

I grew up JUST LIKE YOU, OP. I grew up mainstreamed in an all-hearing school and was the only deaf student in the ENTIRE school. I only had hearing aids and nothing else. Guess what? I was in the top of my class in AP English also! In fact, I did so good because I graduated high school a year early with honors and got into Harvard! Do you see me parading around on this forum about how awesome my English is? How great I can speak and how awesome my hearing aids are because now I can INTEGRATE into the hearing world?! No. You'll never see that, because I am a proud Deaf person who LOVES being part of the Deaf culture. I have hearing friends and I'm not scared of the hearing world, but I've accepted my identity and you need to do the same.

Not everyone is just like you, OP. Some parents don't know what to do for their deaf children and they're dumped off at mainstream school with nothing. Maybe they're totally deaf and hearing aids don't work, so they get no benefit in hearing school whatsoever without an interpreter. Maybe the parents don't learn sign or cued speech or any communication method to help their child, and as a result, their reading suffers because of the lack of language exposure. Is it their fault? No, it's not. STOP BLAMING THEM.

Good lord. I rarely get mad on AD but this is one thread that actually pinched a nerve.

Don't worry about her, she's just full of hot air.

 

[deafskeptic]

English grammar has some problems.

Even without considering spelling. Knot and not are spelt the same, said different while Polish and polish are spelt the same, said different. And then there is PREsent and preSENT which is spelt the same and said the same -- But the accent is on the opposite syllable.

While the grammar nazis think grammar should be slavishly obeyed many of us believe English, both written and spoken, should be revamped.

Some rules are ridiculous -- Such as the one against splitting infinitives. At the time this one was put into effect Latin was considered The Perfect Language. You can NOT spilt an infinitive in Latin -- Therefore you should not in English. However the structure of English makes splitting infinitives both easy to do and easier to understand.

Some of our written grammar makes it more difficult to communicate, not easier. To make it worse prescriptive grammar was designed to control written English -- Not spoken English -- But grammar nazis tend to insist that these rules be applied to spoken English as well.

There are two types of grammar.

Prescriptive grammar states how you MUST speak and write in order to be considered intelligent and educated enough for those in power to consider you worth paying attention too. You will not be considered for the office of Prime Minister of England if you insist on using a Cockney accent.

The entire concept of following, or not following, prescriptive grammar for a written language is one of the problems facing those who would like ASL accepted as an equal to English.

Linguistic grammar considers how people actually communicate with each other. How communication develops over time and what is actually conveyed, both spoken and unspoken. For example when someone answers a question with "Of course." Nowhere in this two word sentence is it implied on the surface that the question or the questioner said something stupid -- But every native speaker knows that is EXACTLY what it Does mean.

Linguistic grammar can account for the Frenchman's native shrug. Prescriptive grammar considers it beneath notice.

Prescriptive grammar is not a friend to ASL.

Let's not get started on foreign names. One of my most embrassing moments came when I learned that the Chinese surname Hung is not pronounced as the English word Hung. I hate mispronouncing peoples' names cuz they get offended. :P

 

[deafskeptic]

THIS.

I grew up JUST LIKE YOU, OP. I grew up mainstreamed in an all-hearing school and was the only deaf student in the ENTIRE school. I only had hearing aids and nothing else. Guess what? I was in the top of my class in AP English also! In fact, I did so good because I graduated high school a year early with honors and got into Harvard! Do you see me parading around on this forum about how awesome my English is? How great I can speak and how awesome my hearing aids are because now I can INTEGRATE into the hearing world?! No. You'll never see that, because I am a proud Deaf person who LOVES being part of the Deaf culture. I have hearing friends and I'm not scared of the hearing world, but I've accepted my identity and you need to do the same.

Not everyone is just like you, OP. Some parents don't know what to do for their deaf children and they're dumped off at mainstream school with nothing. Maybe they're totally deaf and hearing aids don't work, so they get no benefit in hearing school whatsoever without an interpreter. Maybe the parents don't learn sign or cued speech or any communication method to help their child, and as a result, their reading suffers because of the lack of language exposure. Is it their fault? No, it's not. STOP BLAMING THEM.

Good lord. I rarely get mad on AD but this is one thread that actually pinched a nerve.

Wow. That's an impressive post. :bow:

 

[deafbajagal]

THIS.

I grew up JUST LIKE YOU, OP. I grew up mainstreamed in an all-hearing school and was the only deaf student in the ENTIRE school. I only had hearing aids and nothing else. Guess what? I was in the top of my class in AP English also! In fact, I did so good because I graduated high school a year early with honors and got into Harvard! Do you see me parading around on this forum about how awesome my English is? How great I can speak and how awesome my hearing aids are because now I can INTEGRATE into the hearing world?! No. You'll never see that, because I am a proud Deaf person who LOVES being part of the Deaf culture. I have hearing friends and I'm not scared of the hearing world, but I've accepted my identity and you need to do the same.

Not everyone is just like you, OP. Some parents don't know what to do for their deaf children and they're dumped off at mainstream school with nothing. Maybe they're totally deaf and hearing aids don't work, so they get no benefit in hearing school whatsoever without an interpreter. Maybe the parents don't learn sign or cued speech or any communication method to help their child, and as a result, their reading suffers because of the lack of language exposure. Is it their fault? No, it's not. STOP BLAMING THEM.

Good lord. I rarely get mad on AD but this is one thread that actually pinched a nerve.