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What should our troops in Iraq do?

  • Remain until they are able to defend themselves and finish the job

    Votes: 5 33.3%
  • Cut and run, wave the white flag, leave Iraq

    Votes: 1 6.7%
  • pull out a little at a time until we are done

    Votes: 8 53.3%
  • other (explain)

    Votes: 1 6.7%

  • Total voters
    15

sculleywr

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I have been following the news rather closely, and I only have one thing to ask. What in the heck happenned to our country? I pose this Johnny Cash song:

I walked through a county courthouse square,
On a park bench an old man was sitting there.
I said, "Your old courthouse is kinda run down."
He said, "Naw, it'll do for our little town."
I said, "Your old flagpole has leaned a little bit,
And that's a Ragged Old Flag you got hanging on it."

He said, "Have a seat," and I sat down.
"Is this the first time you've been to our little town?"
I said, "I think it is." He said, "I don't like to brag,
But we're kinda proud of that Ragged Old Flag.

"You see, we got a little hole in that flag there when
Washington took it across the Delaware.
And it got powder-burned the night Francis Scott Key
Sat watching it writing Say Can You See.
And it got a bad rip in New Orleans
With Packingham and Jackson tuggin' at its seems.

"And it almost fell at the Alamo
Beside the Texas flag, but she waved on though.
She got cut with a sword at Chancellorsville
And she got cut again at Shiloh Hill.
There was Robert E. Lee, Beauregard, and Bragg,
And the south wind blew hard on that Ragged Old Flag.

"On Flanders Field in World War I
She got a big hole from a Bertha gun.
She turned blood red in World War II.
She hung limp and low by the time it was through.
She was in Korea and Vietnam.
She went where she was sent by her Uncle Sam.

"She waved from our ships upon the briny foam,
And now they've about quit waving her back here at home.
In her own good land here she's been abused --
She's been burned, dishonored, denied, and refused.

"And the government for which she stands
Is scandalized throughout the land.
And she's getting threadbare and wearing thin,
But she's in good shape for the shape she's in.
'Cause she's been through the fire before
And I believe she can take a whole lot more.

"So we raise her up every morning, take her
down every night.
We don't let her touch the ground and we fold
her up right.
On second thought, I do like to brag,
'Cause I'm mighty proud of the Ragged Old Flag."

Now, if that doesn't make you feel patriotic, you need to go check your green card. :)

If you look at the last three stanzas of the song, that represents the treatment of our flag by our actions in the modern days we live in. We do everything except tell our government to take the flag out of our country and send it to Davey Jones' locker. One library in Philadelphia refused to put the flag up because "it might offend somebody." We have the liberals telling us we should allow the flag to be burned because to not do so is an infringement of our first amendment. Let me tell you this: If you live in the United States of America, and are embarrassed by our country flag, you have but one thing you should do. GET THE HECK OUT!!! I will NOT support the liberals. I WILL do my best to reinstitute the ban on flag burning. If you want to burn this nation's flag, go to Iraq, or France, or India. Just stay the hell away from here. Like the song says:

So I'll raise her up every morning, take her
down every night.
I won't let her touch the ground and I'll fold
her up right.
On second thought, I do like to brag,
'Cause I'm mighty proud of the Ragged Old Flag.

I salute the American soldiers and I support my government as long as it is in the right track. Be it red or blue, Democrat or Republican. I will pay my dues and, if needed, I will die for the cause of our freedom. In my opinion, if you don't do that, you are a sad excuse for a citizen. America is considered the most patriotic country in the world, and the only one doing the right thing if you ask the countrymen of nations like Iraq, South Korea, and others that we have helped. We have the ability to make a difference in the world. Why the hell not use it? I am for peace. But peace, like freedom, has a price tag. You can't make a claim to peace without going through the fire to get there. I am not for laying by and letting the bully nations have their way. Suddam Hussein was a ruthless dictator, and he deserves to die. We now have proof that not only was Al-Quaeda in Iraq, but there were 500 caches of bio-weapons (which libs said didn't exist) found in Iraq according to a recently declassified pentagon form. That is something you won't hear from the driveby media. We now have all the reason to have gone there. I say we finish the job
 
I believe we should pull out little by little. I believe we were right to go in there, and overthrow Saddam, but as time as gone on, we have forgotten our focus. I think we should have gone in there with an exit strategy. We shoulda known exactly what our objective were, how to accomplish it, and then, how to get the heck OUT! I don't believe we planned for when to get out, or how.

At some pt, Iraq's new government is going to have to stand on their own to succeed or fail, and we should let them .
 
Oceanbreeze said:
I believe we should pull out little by little. I believe we were right to go in there, and overthrow Saddam, but as time as gone on, we have forgotten our focus. I think we should have gone in there with an exit strategy. We shoulda known exactly what our objective were, how to accomplish it, and then, how to get the heck OUT! I don't believe we planned for when to get out, or how.

At some pt, Iraq's new government is going to have to stand on their own to succeed or fail, and we should let them .

Very good point. Very Very good. However, I would add that we don't pull out what we can't replace with trained Iraqi soldiers. For every regiment we pull out, let's put another iraqi regiment in. Once they ae able to defend themselves and police the country, we pull out. While we are there, train soldiers and set up schools.

To give a list of the GOOD results of this war in Iraq:
Women now have rights to vote.
The first Iraqi women ever to take part in the olympics.
Reinstitution of a school system.
A new government in place, similar to the growth of our own government. We were once in te same position as Iraq. Shoot, they had a constitution months faster than we did.
Iraqis are off the bottom of the list of patriotic countries, replaced by Zimbabwe. They are now becoming proud of their own government.

Yes, there will be a group of people who don't like it. However, when they notice that they are not changing it, they will move on to another country.
 
Why don't we do what Ronald Reagan did? He changed course and pulled out of Beirut, Lebanon and let them fight out in their civil war. Then no more deaths after that. Bush wants to keep them in Iraq, deaths rise.... *shrug*
 
We need to maintain our military presence as long as necessary. I don't agree with the reasons this war was started and I think this war was a waste of our resources, though.

We're too far in now to go back. Regardless of how invalid our reasons for starting this may have been, we have to see this through to the end.
 
Boult said:
Why don't we do what Ronald Reagan did? He changed course and pulled out of Beirut, Lebanon and let them fight out in their civil war. Then no more deaths after that. Bush wants to keep them in Iraq, deaths rise.... *shrug*
WOW! This is the oldest and lamest excuse in the book. A comparison of the death counts from this and other wars makes it useless:
American death count
Iraq: 2544
Vietnam: 58000
Korea: 54,200
World War 1: 117,000
World War 2: 407,300

Congratulations Bush, you have acheived the record for the least American casualties in any war, also less than any battle waged by the US. If today's media had been in control of the US in WW2, with American deaths as the reason to pull out, would we have remained in any of these wars if they would have had their way? A breaking point of 2500 deaths says no.
 
sculleywr said:
WOW! This is the oldest and lamest excuse in the book. A comparison of the death counts from this and other wars makes it useless:
American death count
Iraq: 2544
Vietnam: 58000
Korea: 54,200
World War 1: 117,000
World War 2: 407,300

Congratulations Bush, you have acheived the record for the least American casualties in any war, also less than any battle waged by the US. If today's media had been in control of the US in WW2, with American deaths as the reason to pull out, would we have remained in any of these wars if they would have had their way? A breaking point of 2500 deaths says no.


:gpost:

Very Good Point here !
 
Are you forgetting what the pretext for Iraq war was? WMD was the reason for the war.

And... to this date, no WMD was ever found.

Still clinging to lies?
 
netrox said:
Are you forgetting what the pretext for Iraq war was? WMD was the reason for the war.

And... to this date, no WMD was ever found.

Still clinging to lies?

haha. Read on up:

Reading from a declassified portion of a report by the National Ground Intelligence Center, a Defense Department intelligence unit, Santorum said: "Since 2003, coalition forces have recovered approximately 500 weapons munitions which contain degraded mustard or sarin nerve agent. Despite many efforts to locate and destroy Iraq's pre-Gulf War chemical munitions, filled and unfilled pre-Gulf War chemical munitions are assessed to still exist."

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,200499,00.html

Santorum read from a declassified portion of a report by the National Ground Intelligence Center, a Defense Department intelligence unit, which noted: "Since 2003, coalition forces have recovered approximately 500 weapons munitions which contain degraded mustard or sarin nerve agent. Despite many efforts to locate and destroy Iraq's pre-Gulf War chemical munitions, filled and unfilled pre-Gulf War chemical munitions are assessed to still exist."

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=50746

Think again. This is a Pentagon report that the Pentagon has not yet and never will deny. Thus, your argument is based on false pretenses. Of course, you will probably be looking for places like Think Progress or Michael Moore to mention it before you even admit it, so what is the point? I am not clinging to lies.
 
Y said:
:gpost:

Very Good Point here !
I will keep them coming until either I am dead or the whole world believes what I do. Basically, until Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity stop, I will. ENjoy the posting.
 
sculleywr said:
haha. Read on up:
Think again. This is a Pentagon report that the Pentagon has not yet and never will deny. Thus, your argument is based on false pretenses. Of course, you will probably be looking for places like Think Progress or Michael Moore to mention it before you even admit it, so what is the point? I am not clinging to lies.

I don't consider Moore to be reliable but neither is FOX nor WorldNetDaily. Your dishonesty is disgusting.

In case you overlooked WorldNetDaily:
"One senior Defense Department official told Fox News the chemical weapons were not in useable conditions.

"This does not reflect a capacity that was built up after 1991," the official said, adding the munitions "are not the WMDs this country and the rest of the world believed Iraq had, and not the WMDs for which this country went to war."

Do you understand that part? It was all politics. Santorum was trying to drum up support by proving that WMD's existed by decieving the public that WMD's was found. The only thing they found were OLD WMD's that are no longer effective.

So, the pretext for the war was WMD and it has already been established that there's NO WMD's. No WMD was ever used against our troops. Our intel never proved that Saddam has WMD.

You are the one that is clinging to lies of the Right. Stop believing everything politicians say and think!
 
What the heck? I need the soliders come home. My brother in law has beeen in afraghan 2 past summers and now he might have to go to Iraq. It sucks.. and he said DAMN BUSH IS SELFISH! I don't want my bro in law to end up dead. I am very close to him! :(
 
Boult said:
Why don't we do what Ronald Reagan did? He changed course and pulled out of Beirut, Lebanon and let them fight out in their civil war. Then no more deaths after that. Bush wants to keep them in Iraq, deaths rise.... *shrug*

The reason i said this is because;
http://thinkprogress.org/2006/07/07/murtha-cheney/

and
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13296235/
Now, let’s, let’s—give me, give you an example. When we went to Beirut, I, I said to President Reagan, “Get out.” Now, the other day we were doing a debate, and they said, “Well, Beirut was a different situation. We cut and run.” We didn’t cut and run. President Reagan made the decision to change direction because he knew he couldn’t win it. Even in Somalia, President Clinton made the decision, “We have to, we have to change direction. Even with tax cuts. When we had a tax cut under Reagan, we then had a tax increase because he had to change direction. We need to change direction. We can’t win a war like this.
 
FreedummyRing said:
stay there until Saddam is dead.

I opposed the war because I don't percieve Saddam as a geniune threat to USA and he wasn't. I was right all along.

You're the one that support the war therefore you SHOULD go there. You may get killed but you know what's truly tragic? You'll die for a lie, just like thousands of soldiers died already.
 
netrox said:
I don't consider Moore to be reliable but neither is FOX nor WorldNetDaily. Your dishonesty is disgusting.

In case you overlooked WorldNetDaily:


Do you understand that part? It was all politics. Santorum was trying to drum up support by proving that WMD's existed by decieving the public that WMD's was found. The only thing they found were OLD WMD's that are no longer effective.

So, the pretext for the war was WMD and it has already been established that there's NO WMD's. No WMD was ever used against our troops. Our intel never proved that Saddam has WMD.

You are the one that is clinging to lies of the Right. Stop believing everything politicians say and think!

The munitions were useless, but they still had the chemicals in them, otherwise it woulde have used the word "for" instead of "of." an unusable weapon carrying mustard or sarin gas still has mustard gas in it and can easily be carried over. Anyways, the actual quote from the report said that SOME were useless. Not all.
 
netrox said:
I opposed the war because I don't percieve Saddam as a geniune threat to USA and he wasn't. I was right all along.

You're the one that support the war therefore you SHOULD go there. You may get killed but you know what's truly tragic? You'll die for a lie, just like thousands of soldiers died already.

Ok, just tell that to the US citizens who are dead because of his actions prior to our entrance.
 
netrox said:
I opposed the war because I don't percieve Saddam as a geniune threat to USA and he wasn't. I was right all along.

You're the one that support the war therefore you SHOULD go there. You may get killed but you know what's truly tragic? You'll die for a lie, just like thousands of soldiers died already.


Of course Saddam wasn't a threat to USA, but I want him dead because
so this darn war can be over... If Saddam had not surrender and was killed, then this war would have been over by now.

I don't know why Saddam's supporters love him so much, why can't they see this man is a nobody... and wave the white flag and vote for new leader?
 
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