K.i.s.s.
Originally Posted by loml
removing ambiguity of lip reading,YIPEE!!!! It has not been presented this way, although being a team player CS can certainly work with an oral program.
No. CS is avalable to support the childs learning. I like that!
Read your articles. It has most certainly been presented this way, most of all by its inventor.
And so is ASL. I like that.After interpretation, although a cuer would not need it to be interpreted being that they would be fluent in English as well.
This is where your misunderstanding starts to become evident. You are knowledge in linguistics is showingassuming fluency ion English simply because one is a cuer.
LOL I have never stated that cueing is a stand alone tool.You cannot support that with anything.
ASL is a team player? Definately, ASL and cued speech go hand in hand. (no pun intended) It is much older than ASL, it eveolved from the people it serves (deaf, not hearing) and it conveys much more information than does CS.
ASL conveys information differently that Englsih via CS, is it really more? Juries out on that one.
Nope, jury isn't out Once again, your lack of linguistic knowledge is showing. If you say so. Oh and ASL to English, literate hearing people.
if the child already has a good foundation in some form of sign communication(thought I would add the rest of the sentence there)TrueAnd your point would be?My point.. a child must have a an accurate and fluent role model, preferably native user, to have a good foundation in ASL, English, French, Hebrew etc.
There is research that indicates that deaf children with a less than fluent model of sign will surpass their models in correct usage.after they have been exposed to fluent signers...Okay..... so.....and???
Multiple uses, good!
Phoneme-grapheme relationships distinguished visually. Raising readers!
Not necessarily. There is more to literacy than that. If distinguishing phonemes were all that was necessary, there is no hearing kid that would ever have trouble reading. This certainly is not the case.
Of course there are more variables, nice to have a tool that is kinesthetic, visual and can be auditory, like CS.Cognitive research has shown that there are many avenues to kiteracy that do not rely on phoneme/morpheme information of spoken language.Okay. Sounds like an arduroes task. I believe in K.I.S.S. Got some links to this info please.
Obviously you believe in the K.I.S.S. philosophy. Your posts way oversimplify the issues surrounding literacy, language acquisition, and linguistics. And I've already posted that research.Cueing is not complicated is purely logic. Playing linguistics with it is simply an attempt to make things complicated. You continue to show your lack of experience regarding cueing and literacy. Guess that is that then. 
Oh right, forgot, can't ask for research agian, sheesh where is that rule book?
Can't locate that one in Advantages article, where are you getting this one from?? and what does this have to do with CA as a tool for literacy?? Okay found it. His opinion. Certainly not mine. Not sure what conclusion you are making here.
I cut and pasted from your articles. AHH...In the "Here to Stay Article"
Here is the "Learning of Abstract Language .Don't see that statement anywhere."
Cued Speech providing equal access to information via transliteration, NOT interpretation. EXCELLENT!
This is a limitation, not an advantage.[/COLOR] "this is a limitation, not an advantage".
More evidence that you don't fully understand the issues.So you say.....
"When cueing was invented at Gallaudet, it was invented for the purpose of teaching deaf people English reading and writing," Raimondo said. "But what happened is, it got taken over by people who said, 'Let's use it for speaking and spoken language.' So I think it has been used to exclude sign language. "Which article is this from?? Yes, CS teaches deaf people English reading and writing. Yes it can be used for speaking and spoken languages, added bonus! CS works well with sign language, another bonus! ASL teaches reading and writng skills, is a complete and separate language capable of conveying complete conceptual information. Isn't the issue oneof literacy, not oral skills? Juries out on success of ASL, DOHA and literacy.
Obviously you are not up to date on your research.
Are you going to provide me with the research?
CS aiding with oral skills, if that is the choice, then it is an added bonus, though of course not what CS was intended to do.CS has always been about literacy!
No CS started out as a possible solution to literacy, but has evolved, as I have pointed out above. Andit has not proven to be successful. You still cannot seem to explain how a system invented over 40 years ago could be so wonderfully seccessful, and still be used by only 1,000 people in the U.S.
Wow maybe when you live in the ASL Political Power House you really don't see it. Sheesh!
Several thousand, and growing world wide!!!!
Anything to support that? I do, then again, you wouldn't believe it anyway. lol
Yeah me too.
True though this is changing as more parents demand CS.
Anything to support that? And if more parents are demanding it, it because of the perceived convienence to the parent and not what is in the best interest of the child. Yes, but would you beleive it? lol K.I.S.S.
I'm already aware of your need to keep it simple.
Cueing is simple. As I am of yours to make things ARDUOUS!To suggest denying a deaf child inclusion within his/her families language/culture/history via CS is not in the best interest of the child or family. You reported family fluency in ASL is an anomoly. I believe, provided the opportunity of family language via CS, in conjunction with ASL via a native signer, future deaf/hoh child could be bilingual/bicutural.
English already has a visual form. It is called writing. If a child is giventhe advantage of early and fluent ASL, that can be used to teach written English. That is Bicultural=-BilingualL
IF Like I said anomoly!
OR="Green"]Ture, nice and consistent.[/color]????? The system of CS is consistent.
True, not regular but does happen. Things are changing! Take Illinois University for example, or Florida State. I can find out names and contacts for you.
Yes, things are changing slowly.Indeed, like eating an elephant, "one bite at a time". And support for the Bi-Bi method is increasing at a much greater rate.So you say....
Okay, unfortunate though.
Guess that is his philosophy, wonder how its working for him?? Got any SAT scores? or an email...maybe I should email him
What exactly, do SAT scores have to do with it? Once again,this is from your post. Go back to it to find the email address. "It's ridiculous, actually, to think that cueing could ever eradicate ASL and its accompanying culture," said Allison Kaftan, the English doctoral student, whose 4-year-old daughter also is deaf.
"But the frank and honest truth is that cueing is extremely successful in conveying English effortlessly to deaf people," said Kaftan, who cues with her daughter. "Since we all hold proficiency in English as the gold standard of literacy, cueing is here to staySupporting the child and optimising language, well done!. "Here to Stay" Topic: Deaf Education Post #1
CS does not optimize, it limits, bu providing onmy one form of language...English, rather than 2 forms. Cueing English provides English, cueing French provides French, cueing Spanish provides Spanish and so on and so on. So far, that is 3. Then again it is used for a least 60 different languages,so...... If you really have to count :shrug:
You still don't understand the difference between a separate language and a mode of language, do you?
First class support and research bonus! Open minded in Spain!
Visual representation of spoken language via CS, anot excellent point!
Only for those that adhere to a strict oral environment. Otherwise, spoken langauge does not need to be visable except in written form.Wrong again
! No it doesn;t have to be strictly oral, but then again you won't beleive that either. lol For deaf/hoh people English can be visual via CS.
How so?
CS eliminating the ambiguity of speech reading, good good! Inclusion in your family via CS. So very important!!!
Again, only if the family insists on maintaining a strict oral environment.
Only if your family refused to accommodate the deaf child's needs. More than one way to meets the needs of a deaf child.
Yep, and oral only CS has not proven to be one of the ones that is succesful
You have support for this statement? I have to go find that research too do I? Again, you are the one who keeps saying oral only. Not my words.
I find this really funny, you keep making statements about CS in an attempt, imo, to make it seem so complicated. The system is not, nor never will be complicated.
........Sounds like an arduos task.
