Loosing hearing 15 year old girl

Teacherofthedeaf said:
Actually I know a great deal of the population who was implanted very young. It was a very small group of kids because it was very early. I am extremely close with several of them.

Can you show me the "well documented" information? I would love to read some recent research. The longitudinal stuff I've seen about Auditory Verbal therapy isn't saying that. They are at 25 years for one study.
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So in other words, you're a devoted AVT teacher am I right? And yes, you may be close to a very small number of the early implanted kids but you do not know ALL the dhh kids in the world......and you also know that the AVT methodology is flawed as well, since that only includes a very specfic cherry picked population.
 
deafdyke said:
So in other words, you're a devoted AVT teacher am I right? And yes, you may be close to a very small number of the early implanted kids but you do not know ALL the dhh kids in the world......and you also know that the AVT methodology is flawed as well, since that only includes a very specfic cherry picked population.
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There is no such thing as an AVT teacher. AVT is Auditory Verbal Therapy. By definition it is therapy not teaching. I am a listening and spoken language teacher, yes.

Are you going to show this "well documented" research?
 
Teacherofthedeaf said:
There is no such thing as an AVT teacher. AVT is Auditory Verbal Therapy. By definition it is therapy not teaching. I am a listening and spoken language teacher, yes.

Are you going to show this "well documented" research?
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I know. But AG Bell has been fixtated that AVT is the Answer to Life the Universe and Everything. It is even pushing AVT in the oral schools b/c it is so convinced that it's going to be the magic bullet, based on a very small flawed research study. I've also seen this woman on FB refer to herself as an Auditory Verbal Teacher, so yes there are apparently professionals out there calling themselves Auditory Verbal Teachers. It seems to be a euphanism. I actually know that this woman is an educational audi, so in her mind she thinks that's equalivant to teaching. And why relabel yourself with a fancy name. Just call it oralism. There's no need to rebrand it.
 
deafdyke said:
I know. But AG Bell has been fixtated that AVT is the Answer to Life the Universe and Everything. It is even pushing AVT in the oral schools b/c it is so convinced that it's going to be the magic bullet, based on a very small flawed research study. I've also seen this woman on FB refer to herself as an Auditory Verbal Teacher, so yes there are apparently professionals out there calling themselves Auditory Verbal Teachers. It seems to be a euphanism. I actually know that this woman is an educational audi, so in her mind she thinks that's equalivant to teaching. And why relabel yourself with a fancy name. Just call it oralism. There's no need to rebrand it.
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What very small and flawed research study do you think that A.G. Bell is basing everything on. I am personally familiar with several literature reviews that look at all the available research and determine what trends are seen, that specifically target auditory verbal therapy. Would you like some names so you can review the current research?

It is possible that the person to whom you are referring is an Auditory Verbal Educator or an AVEd. but if she is an educational audiologist, it is within her scope of practice to do aural rehab, so she could be an Auditory Verbal Therapist, but certainly not an "auditory verbal teacher".

As for "rebranding", there is absolutely a difference between what we do today and what was done 20 years ago. If you look at the defining principles of auditory verbal practice, you can see that they didn't apply at all to what you would have seen in "oralism" in the 1980's or before.

I am still waiting on your research. I am very big into staying current on the literature, so I can't wait to read it.
 
deafdyke said:
Exactly!!!!! A dhh kid has the right to be able to function fully without a HA or CI. I read something in a book on special ed, that was profound " Physically disabled kids have the right to roll, blind/low vision kids have the right to learn Braille and dhh kids have the right to learn ASL. You have to give them the choice in the first place. Otherwise how will you know if it's helpful or not? I have no idea why that approach is so contorversial. There are many many different pieces to the puzzle and dhh kids should NOT be trained to exclusively depend to function exactly like a hearing kid. They NEED the choice in the first place!
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Yes, you have a right to function fully without a HA or CI and short of hearing most probably do function fully, but it sounds like you are saying that everyone must learn how to sign so they can converse with you when you don't feel like wearing your HA or CI? Do you think blind kids function fully when they don't feel like using their cane or don't have their cane? Since they know they need it to get around you will find few blind kids without it? I have a friend who runs the blind center as well as one of the schools for the blind in the area and she told me that all the students are taught braille as well as getting around with the use of a cane. The Deaf and HOH school near me teaches in both ASL as well as vocally. As a former teacher I can tell you it's not some big plot to keep you from functioning fully, the reason they teach you the way they do is they need to prepare you to function and hopefully earn a living in a largely hearing world. If they taught you only in ASL they would be doing you a huge disservice. It's hard enough to teach a hearing kid what they need to learn, but when you throw in a learning disability or a physical disability such as being Deaf, HOH or being blind, it becomes much harder and there are only so many hours in the school day. They also have the local school board or state telling them you must be able to do certain things and be more or less proficient doing them in any given school year.
 
deafdyke said:
I know. But AG Bell has been fixtated that AVT is the Answer to Life the Universe and Everything. It is even pushing AVT in the oral schools b/c it is so convinced that it's going to be the magic bullet, based on a very small flawed research study. I've also seen this woman on FB refer to herself as an Auditory Verbal Teacher, so yes there are apparently professionals out there calling themselves Auditory Verbal Teachers. It seems to be a euphanism. I actually know that this woman is an educational audi, so in her mind she thinks that's equalivant to teaching. And why relabel yourself with a fancy name. Just call it oralism. There's no need to rebrand it.
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I too would like to see this research you are talking about. Can you provide it please.
 
seb said:
Yes, you have a right to function fully without a HA or CI and short of hearing most probably do function fully, but it sounds like you are saying that everyone must learn how to sign so they can converse with you when you don't feel like wearing your HA or CI? Do you think blind kids function fully when they don't feel like using their cane or don't have their cane? Since they know they need it to get around you will find few blind kids without it? I have a friend who runs the blind center as well as one of the schools for the blind in the area and she told me that all the students are taught braille as well as getting around with the use of a cane. The Deaf and HOH school near me teaches in both ASL as well as vocally. As a former teacher I can tell you it's not some big plot to keep you from functioning fully, the reason they teach you the way they do is they need to prepare you to function and hopefully earn a living in a largely hearing world. If they taught you only in ASL they would be doing you a huge disservice. It's hard enough to teach a hearing kid what they need to learn, but when you throw in a learning disability or a physical disability such as being Deaf, HOH or being blind, it becomes much harder and there are only so many hours in the school day. They also have the local school board or state telling them you must be able to do certain things and be more or less proficient doing them in any given school year.
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Seb, where the heck do you get the interpretation that I am saying ASL only? I am advocating and have ALWAYS advocated a FULL and complete toolbox of tools....both speech and sign. But the thing is oralism/an AVT approach IGNORES the value of ASL, cued speech and even speechreading!!!!!! A dhh kid has the right to be bilingal in BOTH ASL, and English!
 
deafdyke said:
Seb, where the heck do you get the interpretation that I am saying ASL only? I am advocating and have ALWAYS advocated a FULL and complete toolbox of tools....both speech and sign. But the thing is oralism/an AVT approach IGNORES the value of ASL, cued speech and even speechreading!!!!!! A dhh kid has the right to be bilingal in BOTH ASL, and English!
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Sorry, but you come across as one who is Deaf and mad at the world because you are Deaf and have to give in and communicate with the hearing world through speech because they won't learn ASL to communicate with you. I'm not saying that's true, just that that is how you seem to come across to me. I's also not arguing that Deaf kids shouldn't use both ASL and speak the spoken word and in the US it means speaking English, but if you want to get your message across you have to reach out to the parents of Deaf children, because it is they who choose what type of school they want to put their child in and many are choosing Deaf schools who rely on teaching orally because that is how the world mostly communicates and works.
 
seb said:
Sorry, but you come across as one who is Deaf and mad at the world because you are Deaf and have to give in and communicate with the hearing world through speech because they won't learn ASL to communicate with you. I'm not saying that's true, just that that is how you seem to come across to me. I's also not arguing that Deaf kids shouldn't use both ASL and speak the spoken word and in the US it means speaking English, but if you want to get your message across you have to reach out to the parents of Deaf children, because it is they who choose what type of school they want to put their child in and many are choosing Deaf schools who rely on teaching orally because that is how the world mostly communicates and works.
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WHERE on earth do you get THAT? I'm honestly puzzled. You've obviously never met any real Angry Deaf adults. I speak quite a bit of time. I am grateful for my speech skills. I reconize that they are very useful in the hearing world. I am also gratful for my abilty to use a terp so I can understand without struggling to hear with my weakest sense. My anger has nothing to do with me. My anger has to do with things I see in my work as an IEP advocate, as well as the manipulation of emotions that a certain approach pushes as " Oh they don't need this or that b/c it's NOT NORMAL!" Why deny it just b/c it's "not normal?" According to THAT thinking It's not normal to speak Hebrew, it's not normal to speak Chinese, it's not normal to speak French and so on and so on, so people shouldn't speak those languages. My anger comes from seeing kids denied a rich full life experience, my anger comes from hearing the story of a girl whose hearing aids broke. She did not have the abilty to use an interpreter, so she was completely lost without them. My anger comes from seeing guys like that guy in the general forum who was mainstreamed to the max, but yet at the same time didn't benefit socially at all...... My anger comes from the frustration at people rejecting this or that simply b/c it has the stigma of being for " special needs" kids.........And of course I have a lot of anger. It is what drives my activism....... Susan Faludi had a lot of anger, so did Gloria Steinem, so did Che Gureva, so did Cesar Chavez, so did MLK Jr, so did Gandi, so did countless number of social activists. We fight and speak out b/c we are angry at a lot of injustices in the world!
 
This thread was started by a 15 yo girl that losing their hearing and looking for support . I think we should see that she does get the support she wanted, I am not sure if all
this talk is what she was looking for.
 
deafdyke said:
WHERE on earth do you get THAT? I'm honestly puzzled. You've obviously never met any real Angry Deaf adults. I speak quite a bit of time. I am grateful for my speech skills. I reconize that they are very useful in the hearing world. I am also gratful for my abilty to use a terp so I can understand without struggling to hear with my weakest sense. My anger has nothing to do with me. My anger has to do with things I see in my work as an IEP advocate, as well as the manipulation of emotions that a certain approach pushes as " Oh they don't need this or that b/c it's NOT NORMAL!" Why deny it just b/c it's "not normal?" According to THAT thinking It's not normal to speak Hebrew, it's not normal to speak Chinese, it's not normal to speak French and so on and so on, so people shouldn't speak those languages. My anger comes from seeing kids denied a rich full life experience, my anger comes from hearing the story of a girl whose hearing aids broke. She did not have the abilty to use an interpreter, so she was completely lost without them. My anger comes from seeing guys like that guy in the general forum who was mainstreamed to the max, but yet at the same time didn't benefit socially at all...... My anger comes from the frustration at people rejecting this or that simply b/c it has the stigma of being for " special needs" kids.........And of course I have a lot of anger. It is what drives my activism....... Susan Faludi had a lot of anger, so did Gloria Steinem, so did Che Gureva, so did Cesar Chavez, so did MLK Jr, so did Gandi, so did countless number of social activists. We fight and speak out b/c we are angry at a lot of injustices in the world!
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So now we have the rest of the story! Now your comments make more sense. Now lets get back to helping this 15 year old girl.
 
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