Grammar

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sailerboy

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This topic has been beaten to hell and back, I'm sure. I also fully expect to get flamed like never before.

Having said that, let me begin.

Many people who have a congenital deafness of a substantial amount do not achieve a full integration in the oral society. If they are able to communicate orally, the communication is usually done at a level of pre-4th grade grammar. For whatever reason, this grammar seems to translate onto AllDeaf.com. I understand the difficulty of human speech, but does this difficulty really translate to a completly textual form of communication?

I'm not going to call anyone out on this, but I have seen examples of fragments, run on sentences, tautology, among many other English grammar violations. I understand that this is an informal method of communication, but some of the things I have seen on here have made the sentences indecipherable and unreadable without (and in some cases, with) context. My question to you is why?

If one went to a deaf school, surely, they would teach proper English and grammar in a textual way. Even at hearing schools these things are taught in a textual manner. Does being deaf discourage people from learning the English language? Does being Deaf discourage people from learning the English language? What reduces the quality of textual communication?

I know someone will say to me: "How can you say this? You can't possibly know how hard this comes to us."

My response is this:
I know exactly how hard this comes to everyone. I am in the exact situation that I describe, a congenital hearing impairment of severe-profound loss. I am aided by hearing aids and nothing else. I go to an all hearing school and am at the top of my class in AP English. If anyone wants to contest me as a hypocrite, go right ahead. I'm sure that I will have a proper counterargument for whatever trial you put before me.

I don't intend to cause an uprising, nor do I intend to hurt anyone's feelings. I just want to know why.

TL;DR: Why do congenital deaf people generally have bad grammar?
 
sailerboy said:
This topic has been beaten to hell and back, I'm sure. I also fully expect to get flamed like never before.

Having said that, let me begin.

Many people who have a congenital deafness of a substantial amount do not achieve a full integration in the oral society. If they are able to communicate orally, the communication is usually done at a level of pre-4th grade grammar. For whatever reason, this grammar seems to translate onto AllDeaf.com. I understand the difficulty of human speech, but does this difficulty really translate to a completly textual form of communication?

I'm not going to call anyone out on this, but I have seen examples of fragments, run on sentences, tautology, among many other English grammar violations. I understand that this is an informal method of communication, but some of the things I have seen on here have made the sentences indecipherable and unreadable without (and in some cases, with) context. My question to you is why?

If one went to a deaf school, surely, they would teach proper English and grammar in a textual way. Even at hearing schools these things are taught in a textual manner. Does being deaf discourage people from learning the English language? Does being Deaf discourage people from learning the English language? What reduces the quality of textual communication?

I know someone will say to me: "How can you say this? You can't possibly know how hard this comes to us."

My response is this:
I know exactly how hard this comes to everyone. I am in the exact situation that I describe, a congenital hearing impairment of severe-profound loss. I am aided by hearing aids and nothing else. I go to an all hearing school and am at the top of my class in AP English. If anyone wants to contest me as a hypocrite, go right ahead. I'm sure that I will have a proper counterargument for whatever trial you put before me.

I don't intend to cause an uprising, nor do I intend to hurt anyone's feelings. I just want to know why.

TL;DR: Why do congenital deaf people generally have bad grammar?
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:P Lalalala....
 
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okayguy.jpg
 
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You just want to be right... Spoken and written English, is that all that matters to you? Do you know how to sign? do you know the complexities of the grammar? Do you know how hard it is to live in a world where you are not accepted. You obviously do not see yourself as Deaf, you do not know the culture, the history, the beauty of it all.

This is a forum for Deaf people, a people with a shared history, a shared language, a shared Culture. you may think of yourself as "hard of hearing" but really... you are acting just like a hearing person, thinking why can't, why can't... not what can we do.

Go ahead and think the way you do, no one will, or rather can, stop you, please, just keep your insulting comments to yourself. Keep your "I'm better than anyone here because I have *perfect* grammar" thoughts to yourself.
 
I don't consider myself to have perfect grammar. I am genuinely curious about such things. I don't claim to know sign language. I am interested to see why it is harder for some people than others. If you want to play the "You don't know how it is" card, that's fine. Go ahead.

My focal point of the essay in the previous post was the illegible combinations of words, not minor grammar mistakes. I find it hard to believe that this is an exclusively Deaf site, as this site has a Hearing Aids, CI, etc.

I take it i'm not welcome here simply because i represent everything all of you stand against, that is, hard work, curiosity, novel ideas, and change. I'm going to go back to reading 1984.
 
sailerboy said:
I don't consider myself to have perfect grammar. I am genuinely curious about such things. I don't claim to know sign language. I am interested to see why it is harder for some people than others. If you want to play the "You don't know how it is" card, that's fine. Go ahead.

My focal point of the essay in the previous post was the illegible combinations of words, not minor grammar mistakes. I find it hard to believe that this is an exclusively Deaf site, as this site has a Hearing Aids, CI, etc.

I take it i'm not welcome here simply because i represent everything all of you stand against, that is, hard work, curiosity, novel ideas, and change. I'm going to go back to reading 1984.
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A lot of things happened before you were born. I suggest you read up on more current subjects, i.e., the varied topics being offered in this forum. :wave:
 
sailerboy said:
I take it i'm not welcome here simply because i represent everything all of you stand against, that is, hard work, curiosity, novel ideas, and change. I'm going to go back to reading 1984.
Click to expand...


So, you're saying the Deaf are against hard work, curiosity, novel ideas and change? Do you actually know any Deaf people in real life?
 
My previous post refers to several deaf people I have met, and those in this thread. My reasoning for this is that deaf people shun me for working so hard to integrate in the hearing culture. That is it.
 
sailerboy said:
My previous post refers to several deaf people I have met, and those in this thread. My reasoning for this is that deaf people shun me for working so hard to integrate in the hearing culture. That is it.
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Then you've been hanging out with the wrong kind of crowd. Most of my deaf friends does not shun me at all because I have a CI or write well. We treat each other equally, no matter our education.

OR

Maybe it's because of your attitude towards the deaf community. Either one. Take your pick.
 
sailerboy said:
My previous post refers to several deaf people I have met, and those in this thread. My reasoning for this is that deaf people shun me for working so hard to integrate in the hearing culture. That is it.
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As you are working so hard to assimilate into the hearing "culture" (they dont have any, btw) why should the deaf people embrace you and tell you to "ohhhh come to our side"???

I'll help you out. There are no reasons for them to.
 
sailerboy said:
I take it i'm not welcome here simply because i represent everything all of you stand against, that is, hard work, curiosity, novel ideas, and change. I'm going to go back to reading 1984.
Click to expand...

:laugh2: You remind me so much of a skinny little bantam rooster I have that struts around all puffed up in front, aggressively challenging everything around him, unaware that he's missing his long plumes in the back and is waggling around the most ridiculous bare bottom. All the other animals ignore him, except for once in a while when he gets a bit too full of himself (ergo the missing plumes).

Weren't you planning to grace us with the grammatically correct story of why you chose to spell "sailerboy" in such an unusual way? I'm ready and waiting with my dictionary in hand so I might be able to manage any of those big high school level words you might throw my way.
 
sailerboy said:
My previous post refers to several deaf people I have met, and those in this thread. My reasoning for this is that deaf people shun me for working so hard to integrate in the hearing culture. That is it.
Click to expand...

its not shunning you because you want to be within the hearing word, its that it isn't our culture. Its because you see yourself as Hearing (yes with a capital H). Its that we don't... its that we are Deaf, and PROUD of it, not ashamed.
Really, I'm not trying to shun you... because you can't accept who you are, because you are trying to be something your not... I pitty you. Also, I'm done with your BS... I'm done letting you get the better of me. I'm done. I know who I am, and I'm Proud to be a part of something so beautiful, so wonderful. I can have instant friends where ever I go, I can have so much more. I don't have to live in a world of noise, of negativity, I can appreciate the world for its beauty. Goodbye Sailerboy, I hope you can understand your identity, I hope you come to realize there is so much more than what you think into the Deaf Culture.
 
Now, this does not pertain to me, but:

I will say that for the most part, the deaf who had ASL as their primary language may have had a harder struggle to learn proper English grammar mainly due to the fact that they originally learned ASL grammar. Most can and do learn the proper English grammar or the proper grammar of their country's language. Some people still find the English grammar to be too hard, so they type in whatever they feel comfortable with. We do not make a habit to criticize a person's grammar. We do have a few here on this forum who will try to correct spelling. I have been known to do that a few times, but I always am careful about who I do it to and how I do it.

I was fortunate that I had some hearing and spoken English was my first language. I am finding ASL grammar syntax to be very challenging, but I will succeed at it or die trying. :giggle:
 
posts from hell said:
..
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Apparently he does, either that or he gives them a nasty attitude about being deaf.

I've met a fair share of deaf people who absolutely hated hearing people. I met one elderly deaf woman and I was hanging out with my friends who are interpreters. She asked all of us if we're deaf. I was the only deaf and she would only speak to me, sticking her nose up at my friends.

Ah, you deleted your post.
 
sailerboy - you mispelled your name. How come you write like a Deaf person? I thought you were into boating and all, don't you know how to spell sailor by now? Especially with your top marks? Aren't you supposed to be cured of "Deafness"?


See how obnoxious that sounds? That's exactly how you sound. I wouldn't go out of my way to befriend someone like you.
 
ash345 said:
You just want to be right... Spoken and written English, is that all that matters to you? Do you know how to sign? do you know the complexities of the grammar? Do you know how hard it is to live in a world where you are not accepted. You obviously do not see yourself as Deaf, you do not know the culture, the history, the beauty of it all.

This is a forum for Deaf people, a people with a shared history, a shared language, a shared Culture. you may think of yourself as "hard of hearing" but really... you are acting just like a hearing person, thinking why can't, why can't... not what can we do.

Go ahead and think the way you do, no one will, or rather can, stop you, please, just keep your insulting comments to yourself. Keep your "I'm better than anyone here because I have *perfect* grammar" thoughts to yourself.
Click to expand...

What she said....


I used to think like you...


Oh how wrong I was and I was happy to be proven wrong.
 
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