Deaf child hears for the first time

[AlleyCat]

I have met and dealt with hearing parents that refused to allow their Deaf kids and relatives using Videophone and relay service, mind you many of them already over 18 years old and STILL controlled by their hearing parents and relatives, what do you call them? It STILL exists, I see enough. They mainly complained about this and asked me what their rights were. All I can say, move out and be on their own.

That reminds me of one poster here whose child could not get out of home fast enough at 18, went to learn and became fluent in ASL. Tired of 18 years of listening so hard with a CI. I felt so bad for that child.

 

[Reba]

Anyone who does -not- believe words and the actions that can come from them- have the power to lead to oppression - is living in a fantasy land.

"Parent's choice" is crap. Parents aren't gods and they aren't right simply because they're parents.

Yet, if the parents don't choose, who does? The doctors? The judges? Social Services?

 

[AlleyCat]

Yet, if the parents don't choose, who does? The doctors? The judges? Social Services?

Really no need to get dramatic. Of course the parents are going to choose and make decisions. And, of course, there is occasionally going to be an exception to that here and there, I don't think that was ever in dispute.

It is glaringly apparent by the flippant attitude of some posters' posts here on AD that some parents are going to choose based on what is in THEIR better interests, not the child's, however. That hasn't changed in the 8 years I've been here on AD.

 

[VacationGuy234]

We may be pretty close to having something that will make the CI obsolete, in the near future, perhaps on a physical level. Having said that, I think the real question today is whether to implant a child and not be able to reverse the implantation. If something does come along that can correct hearing, that child may not have that choice.

No easy answers to these questions.

 

[diehardbiker]

No easy answer? You got it right. That is why I believe that parents deserves ALL the information available for child with hearing loss, and rest assure parents that there is no prediction on outcome for each child, and giving all the choices will ensure best path in future including that Deaf does not mean that their lives have severely restricted. The keyword is "education" This includes the truth about success rate of exclusively oralism, and CI. This is the reason why I was NOT that impressed about "Hear for the first time" because it means NOTHING at best. I will only impress if the child had succeed obtained the ability of hearing just like the rest of hearing people and that won't happen until child is in late teenager.

What I am saying is that it is dumb to limit only one avenue. When parents provide every accommodations to their child with hearing loss, the outcome will be far better for child. This includes CI, or other implant, and learn signs, even cued speech etc., altogether.

We may be pretty close to having something that will make the CI obsolete, in the near future, perhaps on a physical level. Having said that, I think the real question today is whether to implant a child and not be able to reverse the implantation. If something does come along that can correct hearing, that child may not have that choice.

No easy answers to these questions.

 

[ambrosia]

Anyone who does -not- believe words and the actions that can come from them- have the power to lead to oppression - is living in a fantasy land.

"Parent's choice" is crap. Parents aren't gods and they aren't right simply because they're parents.

No, just no. Those words are viewed in a defensive standpoint when the offense was never intended. You choose to be offended and take them as personal attacks and judgements when that was never the intention. It is the result of insecurities and misunderstanding.

 

[ambrosia]

Really no need to get dramatic. Of course the parents are going to choose and make decisions. And, of course, there is occasionally going to be an exception to that here and there, I don't think that was ever in dispute.

It is glaringly apparent by the flippant attitude of some posters' posts here on AD that some parents are going to choose based on what is in THEIR better interests, not the child's, however. That hasn't changed in the 8 years I've been here on AD.

I think that they really do have their best interests at heart, it's just a matter of perspective. Would it make their childhood a little harder? maybe, would it make the parents job easier? maybe. But that is just during childhood, a parent is thinking farther than that, that child is not going to stay a child forever. Part of a parents job is to teach and equip that child to be an independent well rounded adult. I hear a lot about "the hearing world", that would be the world yes, because the world is a hearing one. A parent with the long view of equipping the child to able to interact within that hearing world isn't exactly behaving selfishly and thinking what is best for them.

But again, this is an example of of perspective, perceived offenses from a view of defensiveness, insecurity and misunderstanding. A lot of assumptions about the "hearies" and what they're thinking and what their motivations are.

 

[ambrosia]

You don't know squat about the child's deafness especially CI. You are suppose to pay attention to the deaf child's needs first before you make decisions. The adopted parents don't care about his deafness and his needs. They went ahead getting him to get brain stem implant like a guinea pig and hoping that he will hear clearly like a hearing person. The little boy was not responding to his father when he tried to communicate with him. He completely ignored him.

They are testing him like being in the experiment lab. Geeze. I don't like your thinking. You have to accept the child being deaf. If you don't, he or she will turn against you if you force your child to do your bidding. I don't know why you are here if you don't understand and agree with us. We have been through it and you have no idea how we suffered under the oralism method . You have no right to be here if you keep making the denial about it.

Oh, and now we're outright deciding who has a "right" to be here eh?

 

[diehardbiker]

Care to show us the success rate for them that goes oral only, audism all the way? Most hearing parents getting false hope, they have no clue the success rate, these information were never shared with them in the first place. Only small percentage of them do have success rate, but most of them comes out not as good as they could have be.

I think that they really do have their best interests at heart, it's just a matter of perspective. Would it make their childhood a little harder? maybe, would it make the parents job easier? maybe. But that is just during childhood, a parent is thinking farther than that, that child is not going to stay a child forever. Part of a parents job is to teach and equip that child to be an independent well rounded adult. I hear a lot about "the hearing world", that would be the world yes, because the world is a hearing one. A parent with the long view of equipping the child to able to interact within that hearing world isn't exactly behaving selfishly and thinking what is best for them.

But again, this is an example of of perspective, perceived offenses from a view of defensiveness, insecurity and misunderstanding. A lot of assumptions about the "hearies" and what they're thinking and what their motivations are.

 

[diehardbiker]

Oralism leaves deaf children behind in our society | DeafTimes

 

[ambrosia]

I think it's better to give them both ASL and oral skills. I don't have to go looking through google when there's plenty of posters on this site that went the oral route and are successfully employed adults.

Some people are really really quick to make assumptions for my, and others reasoning, and real quick to put words in my mouth that I never said. Going to back to Bebonang claim we don't have a "right" to be here. Yes I'm lumping myself in with Tx golfer because my opinions on this aline well with his most of the time. We're late deafened. Were we deaf kids? no. Is that a prerequisite to be a member of this site? I'm deaf now, profoundly so. We have a perspective and insight to being hearing that it wouldn't hurt you to listen to without going on the defensive.

Although now you've got me curious. think you can find me the success rate for deaf kids that were given ASL only?

 

[Reba]

Really no need to get dramatic. Of course the parents are going to choose and make decisions. And, of course, there is occasionally going to be an exception to that here and there, I don't think that was ever in dispute.

It is glaringly apparent by the flippant attitude of some posters' posts here on AD that some parents are going to choose based on what is in THEIR better interests, not the child's, however. That hasn't changed in the 8 years I've been here on AD.

No drama; just making a point. Even if the parents aren't fully informed or have questionable motives, who other than them is in a position to make choices for their children?

 

[diehardbiker]

Your lucky that your late deafened which makes it easier because you have the experience of sense called sounds. Those who born Deaf do not have that experience and have no way figure out what the sense of sounds is like. I myself have no clue what it is, it is pretty much like black and white and nothing else. Because you have experienced being hearing, you have no idea what it is like to be born Deaf.

Like I said earlier, this is one of most misunderstood disability, many hearing people sees deaf like you, and awe that you were able to talk and hear, then EXPECT other Deafies to be likewise which often is not the case.

I learn this couple years ago after watching show about born blind guy that gets his first implant in his eyes when he was in his early 40's and his reaction was startling, he said he does not want to be able to see AT ALL, because it confused him to extremes and rather live in blindness. His explanation why he rather stay blind made me think that I may be missing something out of hearing world and will never know what the hell it is.

I support those who born hearing and become deaf at later age getting CI, and learn sign language.

I think it's better to give them both ASL and oral skills. I don't have to go looking through google when there's plenty of posters on this site that went the oral route and are successfully employed adults.

Some people are really really quick to make assumptions for my, and others reasoning, and real quick to put words in my mouth that I never said. Going to back to Bebonang claim we don't have a "right" to be here. Yes I'm lumping myself in with Tx golfer because my opinions on this aline well with his most of the time. We're late deafened. Were we deaf kids? no. Is that a prerequisite to be a member of this site? I'm deaf now, profoundly so. We have a perspective and insight to being hearing that it wouldn't hurt you to listen to without going on the defensive.

 

[ambrosia]

Your lucky that your late deafened which makes it easier because you have the experience of sense called sounds. Those who born Deaf do not have that experience and have no way figure out what the sense of sounds is like. I myself have no clue what it is, it is pretty much like black and white and nothing else. Because you have experienced being hearing, you have no idea what it is like to be born Deaf.

Like I said earlier, this is one of most misunderstood disability, many hearing people sees deaf like you, and awe that you were able to talk and hear, then EXPECT other Deafies to be likewise which often is not the case.

I learn this couple years ago after watching show about born blind guy that gets his first implant in his eyes when he was in his early 40's and his reaction was startling, he said he does not want to be able to see AT ALL, because it confused him to extremes and rather live in blindness. His explanation why he rather stay blind made me think that I may be missing something out of hearing world and will never know what the hell it is.

I support those who born hearing and become deaf at later age getting CI, and learn sign language.

I think part of the problem is that this is looked at so black and white by some. You're either deaf of hearing, when there is such a HUGE varying degree in the audiogram. I would think that kids with no real access to speech sounds wouldn't benefit as much with oral skills as a kid who can access the speech sounds, so why deny oral skills to a deaf/hoh kid just because some deaf kids can't access them?

I would seriously debate with about how "lucky" I am

But I don't really know exactly how much my memory of sound helps me vs if someone had my exact same loss but were born with it. I don't know how much it helps me recognize speech sounds. I think it would be an interesting study, probably fairly useless, but I'm curious enough about it.

My left ear actually gets no speech, it's loss starts at 100db at 250K, drops to 110db and stays there until 8K where it goes back up to 100db. My right one, my "good" one, starts at 90db at 250k, drops to 100db at 500k, then bops around between 105 and 110 db until like 6.5k where it goes back up to 100. Would my "listening" skills be as good as they are if I was born with this loss, I have no idea. But "hearies" do get frustrated with me, that I do need repeats, that I do struggle. They just don't understand how amazing it is that I can hear what I do hear. I don't really expect them to though, how could they? But I personally think it is worth all the struggles and misunderstandings, at least for me it is.

Can I tell you how annoying it was that I had edited in this huge addition to my post then accidently deleted so i had to do it all over again??!! gah

 

[diehardbiker]

Understand, I am speaking for those who born Deaf, and with parents being lost. This video, I would have said the exact same thing what she said.

Those who born hearing and become deaf at later age is whole different ballgame and they including yourself have huge advantage and I would support them including you sticking with oral. Its ok to learn sign if you wish but it is not mandatory.

Early Intervention: The Missing Link - YouTube

I think part of the problem is that this is looked at so black and white by some. You're either deaf of hearing, when there is such a HUGE varying degree in the audiogram. I would think that kids with no real access to speech sounds wouldn't benefit as much with oral skills as a kid who can access the speech sounds, so why deny oral skills to a deaf/hoh kid just because some deaf kids can't access them?

 

[Reba]

...Like I said earlier, this is one of most misunderstood disability, many hearing people sees deaf like you, and awe that you were able to talk and hear, then EXPECT other Deafies to be likewise which often is not the case....

Yes, this is a problem that I've observed.

When I interpret for a full Deaf, voice-off ASL consumer, invariably the hearing consumer will mention something about how some other deaf person could read lips and speak, so no interpreter was necessary. (Restraining my eye roll.) Or, the hearing person will ask, "Do you read lips? How much do you hear? Do you understand me?"

Hearing people don't realize that the deaf and hard-of-hearing population spans a huge continuum. Not to sound trite but deaf people are like snowflakes--no two are the same. Sadly though, hearing people tend to lump all deaf people into one group, with similar language modes, life experiences, audiograms, educational backgrounds, and socio-economic levels. They don't understand why deaf people need interpreters--can't they write notes, lip-read, get an implant, use better hearing aids?

Uh, huh.

That's not to say I begrudge anyone, late-deafened, oral, CI user, etc., for whom their path has brought them satisfaction. It's not their fault that hearing acquaintances expect all deaf people to match their model. To add to that, hearing people see "miracles" happen on TV and the internet, and expect that soon deafness will be just a faded memory of the past. But the reality is, it does sometimes make things more difficult for those who don't match the model they expect.

 

[diehardbiker]

Guess what? I was in speech therapy for 15 years and I STILL can't talk normal and can't discriminate much of sounds. Why do I have to go though all the BS which ended up waste of my time and all of the punishment I got for not able to talk. I'm tired of hearing same sound over and over and over millions of times. This makes me wonder why they can't get the hint that this is not going to work?

For example visual as if it were sounds, and each sounds represent specific color, like red, blue, green yellow, orange, white, purple, black, etc. To me it is just one color and I can't tell the difference between Red and blue in sounds, and they both sounds like white to me after all .

 

[ambrosia]

Understand, I am speaking for those who born Deaf, and with parents being lost. This video, I would have said the exact same thing what she said.

Those who born hearing and become deaf at later age is whole different ballgame and they including yourself have huge advantage and I would support them including you sticking with oral. Its ok to learn sign if you wish but it is not mandatory.

Early Intervention: The Missing Link - YouTube

I don't know diehardbiker......that whole changing the choice of words so it doesn't sound so "negative" seems more like their treating the parents like children. They're not kindergarteners, no matter what choice of words a doctor uses to discuss the state of their newborns hearing......it's going to be scary regardless. A tomato is still a tomato, ah crap, I probably can't even use the analogy of the two different pronunciations for tomato. Ah Shakespeare.....a rose by any other name is still a rose. That whole video just seemed like political correctness, I hate pussyfooting and sugarcoating. But maybe that's just me?

But I do agree that lots of options should be given.

 

[ambrosia]

Guess what? I was in speech therapy for 15 years and I STILL can't talk normal and can't discriminate much of sounds. Why do I have to go though all the BS which ended up waste of my time and all of the punishment I got for not able to talk. I'm tired of hearing same sound over and over and over millions of times. This makes me wonder why they can't get the hint that this is not going to work?

For example visual as if it were sounds, and each sounds represent specific color, like red, blue, green yellow, orange, white, purple, black, etc. To me it is just one color and I can't tell the difference between Red and blue in sounds, and they both sounds like white to me after all .

See you're an example of someone that wouldn't have benefited speech therapy and oral skills. I am sorry you had to go through that, I really am. They should have recognized the futility of it early on. BUT, just because you couldn't benefit from it doesn't mean other children wouldn't, do think it's fair to hold that approach against all parents and doctors when there are children that will benefit from it? That they should have those tools in their tool box if they can use it?

 

[diehardbiker]

Ambrosia, don't worry, like I said this is one of most misunderstood disability. Considered yourself lucky because your mind already programmed and that makes it much easier for you. And I don't think this is political correction and it is more of HOW to approach hearing parents when they first discovered their newborn are Deaf. It is a HUGE shock especially when they never heard or met any Deaf person. I think the shock of discovery Deafness is most severe of all kinds disability. Many parents, after discovered that their child has disability other than hearing would be much like "Alright, we can work this out and blah blah", and most of the time they already have solid support programs to help them ride though child's disabilities but when it comes to Deafness, it is complete different ballgame. Often parents would think Deafness as equilvent to mentally retarded, like they can't have life, they never heard of Deaf that has Ph.D degree, never heard of Deaf holding decent job, and so on.

Supposed a doctor informed parents that their child is Deaf, and same time doctor said "By the way, we do have doctors, nurse, etc that is Deaf" This will give some degrees of relief for parents in shock.

I don't know diehardbiker......that whole changing the choice of words so it doesn't sound so "negative" seems more like their treating the parents like children. They're not kindergarteners, no matter what choice of words a doctor uses to discuss the state of their newborns hearing......it's going to be scary regardless. A tomato is still a tomato, ah crap, I probably can't even use the analogy of the two different pronunciations for tomato. Ah Shakespeare.....a rose by any other name is still a rose. That whole video just seemed like political correctness, I hate pussyfooting and sugarcoating. But maybe that's just me?

But I do agree that lots of options should be given.