Arab Majority May Not Stay Forever Silent

[Boult]

Arab Majority May Not Stay Forever Silent

Yes, world, there is a silent Arab majority that believes that seventh-century Islam is not fit for 21st-century challenges. That women do not have to look like walking black tents. That men do not have to wear beards and robes, act like lunatics, and run around blowing themselves up in order to enjoy 72 virgins in paradise. And that secular laws, not Islamic Shariah, should rule our day-to-day lives.

more at: http://www.nysun.com/article/36110

via link: http://digg.com/politics/Arab_Majority_May_Not_Stay_Forever_Silent


well...what do you think of that? hmm?

 

[netrox]

It's so unfortunate that they're being terrorized by religious extremists.

 

[Teresh]

I find it ridiculous that you wish to claim that there is something wrong with them for wearing religious or cultural symbols. Just because your religion does not have such things does not mean that there is something wrong with them.

 

[sillycat]

If the people grow up in that culture that requires women to wear black dress and hood (forgot the arabic word for it) then they don't know different--just normal life to them. But I do pity the women--I have read true life stories of women who lived there and later escaped to western world. The women are to stay home, not allowed to to go school after a certain age, cannot go outside without a male escort, if seeing a man from different culture then family kill her (honor killing), not allowed to drive (I think), many other restrictions.

Try reading an excellent book, "Not Without My Daughter"--a story of American woman married to an Iranian man and family moved to Iran. She describes their Iranian lifestyle in great details--the movie doesnt show much of the culture.

 

[Teresh]

But I do pity the women--I have read true life stories of women who lived there and later escaped to western world. The women are to stay home, not allowed to to go school after a certain age, cannot go outside without a male escort, if seeing a man from different culture then family kill her (honor killing), not allowed to drive (I think), many other restrictions.

In some countries, yes, but you need to also be aware that most of the nations in the Arab world are not so restrictive or backwards and that progress is being made in those societies to advance the rights of women.

As a society, the Arab world is slowly reaching maturity in the sense that the West already has. Saying that there is something wrong with the Arab world is not the solution... Rather, we need to support its growth and development.

 

[sr171soars]

In some countries, yes, but you need to also be aware that most of the nations in the Arab world are not so restrictive or backwards and that progress is being made in those societies to advance the rights of women.

As a society, the Arab world is slowly reaching maturity in the sense that the West already has. Saying that there is something wrong with the Arab world is not the solution... Rather, we need to support its growth and development.

Maybe in a couple of places but not really. That is being countered by those who are Islamic extremists. Take Iraq for example and before Saddam was captured, women had a lot more freedom. Go there today and all those gains are being reversed by the extremists as the women were amongst the first targeted by societial pressures to play it safe. Same is happening in Egypt, had happened in Afghanistan long ago during the Soviet intervention, Iran after the Aytollahs, the Saudis have always been restrictive and just can't come around to making any changes...like letting women drive. Besides Dubai, what are you talking about?

The Arab societies are paralized by the extremists because they use the Quran to justify stricter practices that set them back in time. They are looking for the mythical "golden era" of Islam and will not stop until a Caliph is reestablished in what was known as the Ottoman Empire.

Until one understands the real issues in the Middle East, one cannot enspouse simple observations to explain it or how it will get better or what not. Do you not realize that one of the current issues in Islam is the rejection of Western societal norms? If that is the case, it isn't necessarily going to improve in a way that is recognizable to us.

I heard recently Iran finally decided to let women attend football (soccer) games with the stipulation that they be in a separated section. Well, there was so much pressure from the conservatives that they had to back off from the idea because the men in the crowd could be so ugly in their words and chants (we not even talking about them messing with the women which was not allowed...the police would drag those men off). If this is the kind of thing that they have lots of trouble with...I don't give them a plugged fig for becoming flexible like us. They are still fighting a war from centuries ago on what is Islam. Until they settle that, nothing will get better...and they deserve condemnation because they aren't willing to look inward to figure out what the problems are. They much prefer to blame the West for all their problems.

 

[sillycat]

If the ME countries going to change to more open and less restrictive countries, it will take generations to do that. It is unfortunate that the extreme religious zealots still have big influence in the gov't so it will take longer but hopefully, one day they will be more flexible in following their religion--not be so legalistic.

 

[Teresh]

Maybe in a couple of places but not really. That is being countered by those who are Islamic extremists.

Not true. Kuwait, for example, just had its first women voting at the polls for their government. Progress is being made. Slowly, but surely, liberty is winning out.

Take Iraq for example and before Saddam was captured, women had a lot more freedom.

Freedom? Being oppressed by a corrupt dictator hardly constitutes "freedom" in my book.

The Arab societies are paralized by the extremists because they use the Quran to justify stricter practices that set them back in time. They are looking for the mythical "golden era" of Islam and will not stop until a Caliph is reestablished in what was known as the Ottoman Empire.

The West was paralyzed from about 400 CE to 1500 CE by Christian extremists who used the Bible to justify stricter practices and set them back in time. It took the West 1100 years to get out of the hole they had dug for themselves.

Do you not realize that one of the current issues in Islam is the rejection of Western societal norms? If that is the case, it isn't necessarily going to improve in a way that is recognizable to us.

By the extremists? Yes, but not by most of the people. Western societal norms are actually accepted by most of the people if you look at how the economies work, at the civil rights debates that occur, on the different matters of Sharia law that are discussed among the major religious leaders.

 

[GalaxyAngel]

Want running after the Holy land....

Iran and Iraq are still under the war.....

Really stupid!
They are moron peoples and have no common sense.. Why can't they peace out?

 

[sr171soars]

Not true. Kuwait, for example, just had its first women voting at the polls for their government. Progress is being made. Slowly, but surely, liberty is winning out.

There are many definitions for freedom. You are looking at it through a prism of western thought. Middle Eastern societies look at things differently as the Chinese, Indian, and so on. Rightly or wrongly, each of these society value different things as to what is important to them. What is important to you is not necessarily important to them. Define what you mean by liberty and then we can talk about that. From our standpoint or theirs? An Islamic society will never be at ease with the concept of western wear especially for women. They have a different view of women that is contrary to that of the West.

Freedom? Being oppressed by a corrupt dictator hardly constitutes "freedom" in my book.

Again, you misunderstand what I meant and you were looking at it from your POV. Under Saddam it was a dictatorship and that was true. I was talking about the "freedom" in terms of how women were perceived in that society. They were not forced to wear the burka and other traditional garb as long as what they wore wasn't provocative for them. In other words, the women had more freedom to be themselves within the constraints of that era. Now, they are being forced to go to traditional garb and burkas so they won't be targeted as it seems nobody wants to stand up to the insurgents. Where is the freedom for the women? They are losing it day by day due to the reactionary tendencies over there.

The West was paralyzed from about 400 CE to 1500 CE by Christian extremists who used the Bible to justify stricter practices and set them back in time. It took the West 1100 years to get out of the hole they had dug for themselves.

Exactly my point. How many years will it take Muslims to sort all this out? It will take decades and maybe a century or even more than that. Worst yet, Islamic societies are amongst the most rapid in population growth. This trend is ominous in itself with grave implications for Western societies. The US is the only 1st world western society that breaks even in re-populating itself and more due to immigration than anything else. Europe as we know it today will be half the size population or worst in 50 years. This is while the Muslim populations are slowly increasing at the same time. Who is going to be in charge over there? I sure don't see western civilization staying strong over there.

By the extremists? Yes, but not by most of the people. Western societal norms are actually accepted by most of the people if you look at how the economies work, at the civil rights debates that occur, on the different matters of Sharia law that are discussed among the major religious leaders.

Get the blinders off your eyes. In Europe, there are already places over that the Sharia law predominates and it will only grow. There is one or two places here that Muslims are trying to do the same. So far, they haven't gotten too far but they are determined and know what they believe (we not even talking about fanatics like the extremists). Westerns are a scattered lot with all kinds of beliefs with no consistency as there used to be in the past. People who prevail throughout all history were the ones that stood united...I can't say that Western societies are united about anything except the loose concept of "freedom" and the idea of workable laws. Guess who will prevail...remember history is never fixed but ebbs and flows and peoples come and go. Nothing is engraved in stone and the ones who forget the past are often condemned to repeat it...the cycle goes on.