GA illegal immigration bill ruins crops

Status
Not open for further replies.
Steinhauer - so you endorse poor people staying poor while the rich gets richer? Poor people should stay at the same wages even when inflation goes up but the rich gets all the benefits from tax cuts? Then when the debt bloats up, the poor have to pay more in taxes while losing their jobs to those who are willing to work for even less pay thanks to Bachmann eliminating minimum wage while the rich lobbies to fight against tax increases. This sounds right to you?
 
Steinhauer said:
That is an interesting article and she was absolutely right. Not only did the minimum wage increase cause more layoffs, a lot of minimum wage earners had their weekly hours cut. So instead of earning more - as was conveyed by the rhetoric from the left - what actually happened was much different. The damage done as a result of the minimum wage increase was severe. It made matters worse, not better. When minimum wage increased, so did the price of ... everything.

Another reason I vote Republican.
Click to expand...

Well, I'm a conservative first, and Republican second.

I don't know if you remember the times when at fast food restaurants and stores you'd see older teens and young adults (16 - 21) working the counters but today you have mostly adults.
 
DeafCaroline said:
Steinhauer - so you endorse poor people staying poor while the rich gets richer? Poor people should stay at the same wages even when inflation goes up but the rich gets all the benefits from tax cuts? Then when the debt bloats up, the poor have to pay more in taxes while losing their jobs to those who are willing to work for even less pay thanks to Bachmann eliminating minimum wage while the rich lobbies to fight against tax increases. This sounds right to you?
Click to expand...

No, the democrats endorse that. They use rhetoric to deflect what actually happens when they make promises to help "the little man". Inflation went up when the minimum wage went up exactly as predicted by economists.

Democrats regulate business owners to the point they have to make cuts. This hurts the poor as businesses are the ones hiring them. The democrats then deflect what they actually caused and blame it on republicans. Never fails.
 
DeafCaroline said:
ok, if thats what you prefer to believe regardless of the facts, ok.
Click to expand...

Here let me show you the facts - this was just "one" argument made BEFORE the minimum wage increase:


Tuesday, February 13, 2007
Minimum Wage and Inflation
We've heard from several sources that the increase in the minimum wage will "cause" inflation. Actually, an increase in the minimum wage doesn't cause inflation, although that is a common misconception. The real cause of inflation is a decline in the value of money. A general rise in prices (i.e. inflation, as we usually think of it) occurs because money has less value, not vice-versa. (inflation resulted in the minimum wage increase - no misconception there- this is rhetoric from the left)

Once you have recognized that subtle, but critical point, a lot of things become clear, including who is responsible for money losing its value: the federal government. Money (today) is entirely a government monopoly, and it is government actions and policies that determine whether the dollar (or any currency) has a stable or declining value. Politicians always try to blame labor (for increasing costs), businesses (for raising prices), and consumers (for "excessive demand"), but those are all effects of inflation, not causes. Those claims do help hide the culpability of the politicians, though.

This is not to say that the minimum wage is a good idea or that it has no harmful effects. Suppose we just raise the minimum wage to $50/hr so we can all get rich? How many of us would still have a job the day after that law went into effect? (Answer: approximately zero) Ultimately, setting a minimum wage doesn't guarantee anyone will have a job at that wage. It only guarantees that you won't have a job for less than that. Unless the value of anyone's work product is greater than the cost of employing him (including wages, taxes, and benefits) that job will not exist (or at least not for long).

So what does happen when the minimum wage is increased? Most people who were making less get a raise, and they feel great about the new law. Employers who now have to pay more for the same amount of work have higher costs, which means:

Some will lay off employees to cut costs. (Labor is the biggest cost for most businesses.)
Some will put off hiring new employees or give smaller raises to their other employees.
Some will raise prices, if the market will allow it, to try to pass the cost on to customers. But price increases suppress demand, so customers may go elsewhere to spend their money.
Some will put off expansion plans or purchases of durable equipment, reducing the demand for other people's products (businesses and workers).
Some, those who were already weak, will go out of business.

ALL OF THE ABOVE HAPPENED

Notice that the losers in this process are much less visible than the winners (with the possible exception of group 1 above). Politicians get to take credit for "doing good," for The Little Guy. while others bear all the costs and take all the blame for the plight of the losers. This is why even politicians who know it's bad policy have a hard time resisting a vote for increasing the minium wage. Buying votes with other people's money: that's what it's all about.
Click to expand...

http://dontletmestopyou.blogspot.com/2007/02/minimum-wage-and-inflation.html
 
DeafCaroline said:
Steinhauer - so you endorse poor people staying poor while the rich gets richer? Poor people should stay at the same wages even when inflation goes up but the rich gets all the benefits from tax cuts? Then when the debt bloats up, the poor have to pay more in taxes while losing their jobs to those who are willing to work for even less pay thanks to Bachmann eliminating minimum wage while the rich lobbies to fight against tax increases. This sounds right to you?
Click to expand...

I'm waiting for somebody start flipping yell about a strawman or sumthin. :hmm:

Um, the poor do not pay taxes, at least not on income taxes. :lol: Perhaps you need to define exactly what the income amount you're referring to as to constitute as being "poor."

The top 25% income earners pay 86% of all federal income taxes while the top 50% income earners pay 97% of all incomes taxes.

Here's a bit of history for ya.

In 1980, when the top income tax rate was 70%, the richest 1% paid only 19% of all income taxes; now, with a lower tax rate, the richest 1% pay 39% of all income taxes. They now pay more than double that share today.

Funny how a Canadian is trying to tell Americans about American taxes.
 
Steinhauer said:
No, the democrats endorse that. They use rhetoric to deflect what actually happens when they make promises to help "the little man". Inflation went up when the minimum wage went up exactly as predicted by economists.

Democrats regulate business owners to the point they have to make cuts. This hurts the poor as businesses are the ones hiring them. The democrats then deflect what they actually caused and blame it on republicans. Never fails.
Click to expand...

You look at the charts DC provided and don't believe your lying eyes? :giggle:
 
The poor don't pay taxes? that's a big surprise to them

"The reality is that the income tax is one of a number of types of taxes that individuals pay, both over the course of their lifetimes and in a given year, and it makes little sense to treat it as though it were the only one that matters. Some 86 percent of working households pay more in payroll taxes than in federal income taxes. In fact, low- and moderate-income people pay a much larger share of their incomes in federal payroll taxes than high-income people do: taxpayers in the bottom 20 percent of the income scale paid an average of 8.8 percent of their incomes in payroll taxes in 2007, compared to just 1.6 percent for taxpayers in the top 1 percent of the income distribution. ..."
 
kokonut said:
I'm waiting for somebody start flipping yell about a strawman or sumthin. :hmm:

Um, the poor do not pay taxes, at least not on income taxes. :lol: Perhaps you need to define exactly what the income amount you're referring to as to constitute as being "poor."

The top 25% income earners pay 86% of all federal income taxes while the top 50% income earners pay 97% of all incomes taxes.

Here's a bit of history for ya.

In 1980, when the top income tax rate was 70%, the richest 1% paid only 19% of all income taxes; now, with a lower tax rate, the richest 1% pay 39% of all income taxes. They now pay more than double that share today.

Funny how a Canadian is trying to tell Americans about American taxes.
Click to expand...

Sorry, buddy, but she is far more knowledgeable than you are. :wave:
 
• More Americans could identify Michael Jackson as the composer of "Beat It" and "Billie Jean" than could identify the Bill of Rights as a body of amendments to the Constitution.

• More than 50 percent of respondents attributed the quote "From each according to his ability to each according to his needs" to either Thomas Paine, George Washington or President Obama. The quote is from Karl Marx, author of "The Communist Manifesto."

• More than a third did not know the century in which the American Revolution took place, and half of respondents believed that either the Civil War, the Emancipation Proclamation or the War of 1812 occurred before the American Revolution.

• With a political movement now claiming the mantle of the Revolutionary-era Tea Party, more than half of respondents misidentified the outcome of the 18th-century agitation as a repeal of taxes, rather than as a key mobilization of popular resistance to British colonial rule.

• A third mistakenly believed that the Bill of Rights does not guarantee a right to a trial by jury, while 40 percent mistakenly thought that it did secure the right to vote.

• More than half misidentified the system of government established in the Constitution as a direct democracy, rather than a republic-a question that must be answered correctly by immigrants qualifying for U.S. citizenship.
Click to expand...


Lehmann notes what may be the most telling statistic: "Before the test, 89 percent of respondents expressed confidence they could pass it; 83 percent went on to fail." Outside the Beltway's Doug Mataconis shrugs it off. "I’m not at all certain that this means much of anything for the political system, though, because the people who are unable to identify the basic facts of American history are also unlikely to be the ones lining up at the polling place at six in the morning to cast a ballot."
Click to expand...

Americans vs. Basic Historical Knowledge - Politics - The Atlantic Wire
 
Beowulf said:
Sorry, buddy, but she is far more knowledgeable than you are. :wave:
Click to expand...

I think it speak volumes about the state of our education system when a Canadian knows more about our tax system than a native born American.
 
DeafCaroline said:
"The reality is that the income tax is one of a number of types of taxes that individuals pay, both over the course of their lifetimes and in a given year, and it makes little sense to treat it as though it were the only one that matters. Some 86 percent of working households pay more in payroll taxes than in federal income taxes. In fact, low- and moderate-income people pay a much larger share of their incomes in federal payroll taxes than high-income people do: taxpayers in the bottom 20 percent of the income scale paid an average of 8.8 percent of their incomes in payroll taxes in 2007, compared to just 1.6 percent for taxpayers in the top 1 percent of the income distribution. ..."
Click to expand...
That's about tax payers. There are some Americans who are not tax payers. They either pay no income taxes at all, or get back all that is withheld, plus some (earned income credits).
 
Reba said:
That's about tax payers. There are some Americans who are not tax payers. They either pay no income taxes at all, or get back all that is withheld, plus some (earned income credits).
Click to expand...

did taxes get deducted from their payrolls? If so, that makes them tax payers.
 
"More than half misidentified the system of government established in the Constitution as a direct democracy, rather than a republic-a question that must be answered correctly by immigrants qualifying for U.S. citizenship."

That's exactly why we should never have "true democracy" - so many people can be so wrong on so many things.

And that test reflects how ignorant so many Americans are.
 
Minimum wage jobs are either entry level jobs, or part time supplemental incomes. No one really expects to make a life-time career of a minimum wage job. The incentive is to advance oneself or move on to a better paying job. Minimum wage jobs were never intended to be jobs that would fully support a family. No one expects a burger flipper without a high school diploma to earn as much as a teacher with a master's degree.
 
DeafCaroline said:
did taxes get deducted from their payrolls? If so, that makes them tax payers.
Click to expand...
Not if it's all returned to them. They didn't actually pay anything. It was just held for them, interest free.

If you buy an iPad for $600, send in a rebate form in a postage prepaid envelope, and get back the full $600, how much did you pay for the iPad? NOTHING!
 
Reba said:
Minimum wage jobs are either entry level jobs, or part time supplemental incomes. No one really expects to make a life-time career of a minimum wage job. The incentive is to advance oneself or move on to a better paying job. Minimum wage jobs were never intended to be jobs that would fully support a family. No one expects a burger flipper without a high school diploma to earn as much as a teacher with a master's degree.
Click to expand...

That's cold. I think "burger flippers" (as you call them) deserve more than they are getting paid, since their work is difficult. And I totally disagree about the purpose of minimum-wage jobs, since I notice that most require maximum effort on the part of workers: they were intended to maximize profits from people stuck in ruts.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top