Shoshone Sisters Unarmed Fight Against the Federal Government

Status
Not open for further replies.
I have no love for the Democratic Party but history is history. They weren't the same party in 1828 that they are now. They were DINO's back then, compared to now.

Same for the Republican Party. They also evolved over time. They aren't the same party as they were when first formed.

I don't know why that's hard to accept.

Stein, there is fair with you - modern conservative is different from classical/traditional conservative.

Democratic Party became more left after Woodrow Wilson became the president as more left when FDR became the president. The democrats are divided with economic - capitalist and European-style socialist.

Republican Party was found as anti-slavery party and they supported Civil Rights for black people as democrats favor state rights over federal legislation. Many black people shifted to democrat in 1960s when Democratic Party moves to more left with progressive movement. Now, Republican Party is divided into pro-business conservatives and pro-religious conservatives, also many of republicans outside of Bible Belt and rural communities support business as they side with LGBT rights, especially in urban and suburb.

I'm independent but more side with Democratic Party due to pro-LGBT and preservation of Social Security and Medicare. I support single payer healthcare as well.
 
Stein, I'm glad you shared your post #16. Too many people still don't know/believe about the genocide of Native American Indian peoples.

I been telling people this years ago , I told a niece about the genocide of Native American Indian peoples and she didn't know genocide was a real word . She looked it up and came back and told me it a real word. I was like HUH?? It like people not believing the Holocaust happen. Nothing was really taught in school about genocide of Native American Indian peoples. My daughter would come home from school telling about what she learned about Native American Indian peoples and was all about how evil they're. I told my daughter that we gave them blankets infected with smallpox to kill them. When my daughter got into high school she came home with her history book and showed me a small paragraph
telling about us giving Native Americans blankets with smallpox to kill them. That was all there was in the whole book ! I spoke to an
Native American about this and he told they been trying for years to get the truth printed in school history books and that was all they were able to get printed . I hope the history books in school today are telling what really happen .
 
I been telling people this years ago , I told a niece about the genocide of Native American Indian peoples and she didn't know genocide was a real word . She looked it up and came back and told me it a real word. I was like HUH?? It like people not believing the Holocaust happen. Nothing was really taught in school about genocide of Native American Indian peoples. My daughter would come home from school telling about what she learned about Native American Indian peoples and was all about how evil they're. I told my daughter that we gave them blankets infected with smallpox to kill them. When my daughter got into high school she came home with her history book and showed me a small paragraph
telling about us giving Native Americans blankets with smallpox to kill them. That was all there was in the whole book ! I spoke to an
Native American about this and he told they been trying for years to get the truth printed in school history books and that was all they were able to get printed . I hope the history books in school today are telling what really happen .
I don't understand why it isn't taught. It was taught in my high school in 1967 when I attended. We learned all about the smallpox blankets, the taking of Native lands, etc. It seems the schools are going backwards in education.
 
Stein, I'm glad you shared your post #16. Too many people still don't know/believe about the genocide of Native American Indian peoples.
I don't understand how people can be so uninformed. I knew about our country's terrible treatment of Native Americans back in the 60's when we didn't even have the internet or cable TV. How is it people don't know things now?
 
When I was a teenager, I remember how this song touched me:

My Country 'Tis Of Thy People You're Dying


by Buffy Sainte-Marie

Now that your big eyes have finally opened
Now that you're wondering how must they feel
Meaning them that you've chased across
America's movie screens

Now that you're wondering how can it be real
That the ones you've called colorful, noble and proud
In your school propaganda, they starve in their splendor
You've asked for my comment, I simply will render

My country 'tis of thy people you're dying

Now that the long houses breed superstition
You force us to send our toddlers away
To your schools where they're taught
To despise their traditions

You forbid them their languages, then further say
That American history really began
When Columbus set sail out of Europe
Then stress that the nation of leeches that conquered this land
Are the biggest and bravest and boldest and best

And yet where in your history books is the tale
Of the genocide basic to this country's birth
Of the preachers who lied, how the Bill of Rights failed

How a nation of patriots returned to their earth
And where will it tell of the Liberty Bell
As it rang with a thud o'er Kinzua mud
And of brave Uncle Sam in Alaska this year

My country 'tis of thy people you're dying

Hear how the bargain was made for the West
With her shivering children in zero degrees
Blankets for your land, so the treaties attest
Oh well, blankets for land is a bargain indeed

And the blankets were those Uncle Sam had collected
From smallpox-diseased dying soldiers that day
And the tribes were wiped out and the history books censored
A hundred years of your statesmen have felt
It's better this way

And yet a few of the conquered have somehow survived
Their blood runs the redder though genes have paled
From the Grand Canyon's caverns to craven sad hills
The wounded, the losers, the robbed sing their tale

From Los Angeles County to upstate New York
The white nation fattens while others grow lean
Oh the tricked and evicted they know what I mean

My country 'tis of thy people you're dying

The past it just crumbled, the future just threatens
Our life blood shut up in your chemical tanks
And now here you come, bill of sale in your hands
And surprise in your eyes that we're lacking in thanks

For the blessings of civilization you've brought us
The lessons you've taught us, the ruin you've wrought us
Oh see what our trust in America's brought us

My country 'tis of thy people you're dying

Now that the pride of the sires receives charity
Now that we're harmless and safe behind laws
Now that my life's to be known as your 'Heritage'
Now that even the graves have been robbed

Now that our own chosen way is a novelty
Hands on our hearts we salute you your victory
Choke on your blue white and scarlet hypocrisy
Pitying the blindness that you've never seen

That the eagles of war whose wings lent you glory
They were never no more than carrion crows
Pushed the wrens from their nest
Stole their eggs, changed their story

The mockingbird sings it, it's all that he knows
"Ah, what can I do?", say a powerless few
With a lump in your throat and a tear in your eye
Can't you see that their poverty's profiting you?

My country 'tis of thy people you're dying

Metrolyrics
 
I don't know why....I was in elementary school in the 70's/80's....I know I didn't learn about this genocide til I went to college and started reading a broader range of history books, and materials specifically by Native people. I took several classes in "diversity" and social work and one my professors was Anishinabe<Ojibway> and he taught us a lot.
I also read Zinn later- highly recommend "People's History of the United States"" - and learned further from various Native people i talked to, and going to pow wow.

Actually, considering this...I think people don't know partly because the States as a whole wants to badly to hold onto this image of individual, hard-fought for prosperity scraped from "nothing", it perpetuates romantic ideals we have about how this country was found and what it means to be "American".
 
:ty: for sharing that touching and tragic piece by Buffy Sainte-Marie, Reba
 
:ty: for sharing that touching and tragic piece by Buffy Sainte-Marie, Reba
You're welcome. I have a couple of her albums. She is a genius song writer.
 
I've seen some of her stuff but don't have any music of hers.
 
I don't understand why it isn't taught. It was taught in my high school in 1967 when I attended. We learned all about the smallpox blankets, the taking of Native lands, etc. It seems the schools are going backwards in education.

I learned some series of Native Indian genocide, such as Trail of Tears, gave blankets with smallpox and seizing of their lands, but their coverage is limited because Alabama put a lot of WWI and WWII questions on state graduation exam so all of my teachers were tied to test performance so I felt it wasn't real school anymore.
 
I learned some series of Native Indian genocide, such as Trail of Tears, gave blankets with smallpox and seizing of their lands, but their coverage is limited because Alabama put a lot of WWI and WWII questions on state graduation exam so all of my teachers were tied to test performance so I felt it wasn't real school anymore.
We learned about ancient history, American history, modern European history (including World Wars 1 & 2) and modern politics/current events. We didn't have graduation exams.
 
I don't understand how people can be so uninformed. I knew about our country's terrible treatment of Native Americans back in the 60's when we didn't even have the internet or cable TV. How is it people don't know things now?

I did too and I didn't learn about it in school , I read a lot about this on my own . My niece knew nothing about this until I told her . She has gone to high school too and I guess they didn't teach about the horrible treatment of Native American, my daughter knew about it from me. I was telling people about this in the 60's too and I told someone this in the 90's and she refuse to believe it. I think some people may know about this but don't believe it. Maybe they been brainwashed by the movies and cowboy shows they seen ?


I have Native American artist Jerome Tiger painting of "Tail of Tears' hanging in my living room. I brought it when I went to Oklahoma to visit some friends. It's not the original painting , my friends brought to a Native American art galley so I could see the paintings .
 
Seems like you and I have both read a lot of stuff on our own, WDYS-
 
Seems like you and I have both read a lot of stuff on our own, WDYS-

I had too. I didn't learn it in school . I read a lot when I was teenager ,
James Baldwin, John Howard Griffin book' Black like me' War and Peace ' etc. I carried 'Black Elk Speaks' in my back pocket when I was in my 20's and read it all the time. People would ask me why and I said "It was my bible" .
 
Last edited:
That what I believe too but I don't use wikipedia as source for academic purpose.

The history is very complicated and lengthy so it may have a lot of hidden information that we don't discover, but I made more simple to explain about difference in history of Democratic Party.

I'm on iPhone and it is notoriously difficult to make very large post with sources but I will check in when I get home from errands.

Are you saying I need to use academic sources to claim Andrew Jackson was the founder of the modern day Democratic Party?

You might want to take a look at the works cited at the end of the wikipedia article for reference.
 
Stein, there is fair with you - modern conservative is different from classical/traditional conservative.

Democratic Party became more left after Woodrow Wilson became the president as more left when FDR became the president. The democrats are divided with economic - capitalist and European-style socialist.

Republican Party was found as anti-slavery party and they supported Civil Rights for black people as democrats favor state rights over federal legislation. Many black people shifted to democrat in 1960s when Democratic Party moves to more left with progressive movement. Now, Republican Party is divided into pro-business conservatives and pro-religious conservatives, also many of republicans outside of Bible Belt and rural communities support business as they side with LGBT rights, especially in urban and suburb.

I'm independent but more side with Democratic Party due to pro-LGBT and preservation of Social Security and Medicare. I support single payer healthcare as well.


All I was mentioning was the Party - not politics. Party politics is an entirely different matter. The Party that was founded during the Jackson Administration is the same Party today.
 
Really? Opposing big government?

The Republicans were the progressives of that time, and the Democrats were the conservatives.

I don't understand how you missed that.

Well, you are in opposition to the historians. It's common knowledge in the history of the United States.

If you don't believe me, that's fine. Google "when did the Democrats become progressive?" or "when were the Republicans liberal?" or "were the Democrats always liberal" or any other such search phrase. You will see lots of sources pop up, and you can choose whatever ones you want.


Because I was highlighting the general philosophies, not the specific examples.

That is a strawman - I never mentioned political philosophies - I mentioned the Party that Andrew Jackson founded. It is the modern Democratic Party. They were the "classical liberals" and the "American Liberals". The same political tenets of the Jacksonian Democrats exist today within the Democratic Party - that is why he is considered the founder of the modern day Democratic Party.

Although, the Democratic Party of today is still liberal, it is a form of social liberalism.

And just to clear something up here - I am not looking to start a political war - I am just trying to keep things accurate. It is accurate to say that Andrew Jackson was the founder of the Modern Day Democratic Party, because it is true. It is inaccurate to claim that the entire Democratic Party was responsible for the genocide of the Native Americans. That was not what I was implying or attempting to represent.

What I am attempting to point out, is that when someone ignores Constitutional Law, be it a President, or a Federal Bureau or Federal Organization, Civil Unrest is bound to happen.

I am also trying to point out that when the Federal Government does not adhere to Constitutional Law - who keeps them in check?

I hope that clears some things up. I am not trying to push anyone's hot buttons, I am just attempting to generate discussion as this topic does interest me.

BTW, thanks for the lyrics to the song - that was extremely nice :)
 
Are you saying I need to use academic sources to claim Andrew Jackson was the founder of the modern day Democratic Party?

You might want to take a look at the works cited at the end of the wikipedia article for reference.

You use wikipedia link as source, not somewhere that on reference.

That what Reba saying about don't use wikipedia link, that's not me.
 
All I was mentioning was the Party - not politics. Party politics is an entirely different matter. The Party that was founded during the Jackson Administration is the same Party today.

Democratic Party and Republican Party are political parties so you aren't making any sense. :confused:
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top