Is there a law that prohibits it?

CrazyPaul said:
I didn't mean to make a racist remark. You know how some black women behave when they talk like the plaintiffs and/or defendants on several Judge Judy shows where Judge Judy says "I don't like that attitude so stop it or get out of my court". My supervisor is one of them. Most of my co-workers don't like her because of her inappropriate behavior. Even my union rep can't stand her. That's the way she is.

Why did I write it in the first place? She demanded my answer in writing to her question immediately and then set up the meeting with an interpreter one week later. I am not worried about what I said to her in writing but it's not fair for deaf workers because any supervisor doesn't keep records of hearing workers' voiced correspondences. In other words, my right is violated when a supervisor keeps the note while she/he can't do that to hearing workers who speak with their voices. That's my point. There should be a law to protect that right.
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That is because the hearing workers are not in a position to claim that accommodation is not being made under the ADA. Deaf workers are in that position, so documentation is necessary.
 
CrazyPaul said:
I don't want to bring anything to work except my cigarette pack, pen and employee id card in my shirt pocket. It's a good idea to use a portable erasable board but it's a pain in the ass to bring it along with an erasable marker to work everyday.
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Then quit complaining.....lol

"Oh it's so unfair that my boss keeps my notes .....but I don't want to make any effort toward a solution."

Boo freakin Hoo
 
I asked a lawyer friend about this. He said that there is no law against supervisors keeping the notes. He thinks it's a non issue but suggests if you are concerned about it then you should contact a labor law specialist. He said, if anything, copies of the notes could be in your favor since they can be used to support your side.
 
CrazyPaul said:
I don't want to bring anything to work except my cigarette pack, pen and employee id card in my shirt pocket. It's a good idea to use a portable erasable board but it's a pain in the ass to bring it along with an erasable marker to work everyday.
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bring it to work, once. then leave it.
 
matajan said:
I dont have any problem with accomadations and services at cornell
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Matajan, you don't attend Cornell - you attend Gallaudet.

Deaf should be happy into ivy school, prestigious, uc...cuz of services and accomdations.

But planning courses are complication.

It is not easy for me plan and pass, takes complete in five years.
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He's not talking about school - he's talking about at his JOB, his WORK !
 
CrazyPaul

As others have suggested - use a white board for writing.
If you want to make a "fold-able white board" just take a piece of white paper (or card-stock) and have it laminated - then use a fine tip dry-erase marker to right the note and "wipe it clean" when you finish.

Other solution is to use your personal blackberryetc to write back and forth - in the "NOTES" section (not IM/SMS etc). You could also look into a cheap PDA - even a used one (like a PalmPilot) that you can use at work - and if it gets damage/lost it's not a huge investment.
That way you can type what you want to say - show it to them, and then delete it (because it's your property)


Honestly though - I don't know what the issue is ? For general everyday communication ("what time are you going for lunch?", ""did you see the _____" etc) there's not reason why it should matter if they want to keep the note.

Of course if you are writing things in your notes like "Mr.P is an @ss - he stole my ____" or "You're an idiot and are discriminating against me" etc... then maybe you need to evaluate whether writing those things are a good idea or not (hint: they're not)

There are lots of pocket sized writing tablets available that are either like a dry-erase/white board or are a little keyboards etc - toy stores like toys-r-us have a huge selection of "write & erase" or "type & delete" items that while technically "toys" would be great for your needs.

If it were me, I'd just take some large size "recipe cards" (or cut down a few pieces of white cardstock), take them to a copy place or somewhere that does laminating and have them laminate the pieces of paper (leaving 1.5" of laminate material bordering each piece of paper). Then cut the sheets out so that you've got at least 1/2inch of laminate bordering each sheet and take them into work along with some ultrafine/fine dry erase markers.
 
Anij said:
CrazyPaul

As others have suggested - use a white board for writing.
If you want to make a "fold-able white board" just take a piece of white paper (or card-stock) and have it laminated - then use a fine tip dry-erase marker to right the note and "wipe it clean" when you finish.

Other solution is to use your personal blackberryetc to write back and forth - in the "NOTES" section (not IM/SMS etc). You could also look into a cheap PDA - even a used one (like a PalmPilot) that you can use at work - and if it gets damage/lost it's not a huge investment.
That way you can type what you want to say - show it to them, and then delete it (because it's your property)


Honestly though - I don't know what the issue is ? For general everyday communication ("what time are you going for lunch?", ""did you see the _____" etc) there's not reason why it should matter if they want to keep the note.

Of course if you are writing things in your notes like "Mr.P is an @ss - he stole my ____" or "You're an idiot and are discriminating against me" etc... then maybe you need to evaluate whether writing those things are a good idea or not (hint: they're not)

There are lots of pocket sized writing tablets available that are either like a dry-erase/white board or are a little keyboards etc - toy stores like toys-r-us have a huge selection of "write & erase" or "type & delete" items that while technically "toys" would be great for your needs.

If it were me, I'd just take some large size "recipe cards" (or cut down a few pieces of white cardstock), take them to a copy place or somewhere that does laminating and have them laminate the pieces of paper (leaving 1.5" of laminate material bordering each piece of paper). Then cut the sheets out so that you've got at least 1/2inch of laminate bordering each sheet and take them into work along with some ultrafine/fine dry erase markers.
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Excellent demonstration of how easy it really is to accommodate deaf needs. Just need a little thinking out of the box.
 
CrazyPaul said:
I work at US Postal Service in Southern California.
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As a retired (38 years of service) from the USPS, I do know about all the rules and regulations, the different craft contracts and even was a 204B (supervisior) for two years. So with my experience, these are the things you need to do. All communication for work preformance is general speech. This means if she says "I wnat you do do this or that" you have to do as instructed. You can ask for more instructions if you feel the need. The written parts are HERS if she is using her paper. You should never ever carry around your own paper to write on....always use their paper to reply.
Having said that, if you move on to any and all discussions that are NOT general work preformance....late returning from break, sleeping on the job, unauthorized absent from the work floor, etc. then you always ask for an intrepreter and a union rep. And I mean ALWAYS ASK FOR BOTH!!!!
If you are refused both then keep your mouth shut and DO NOT WRITE ANYTHING. You must read what she writes but you do not have to respond to what she writes IF..IF..IF she refuses your request for an intrepreter and a union rep. Safety meetings, job instruction in-plant meeting and any other meeting betwedn employees and management require an intrepreter and you DO NOT HAVE TO ASK FOR ONE, if you are well know as a deaf person who requires accomodation.....do not do their job for them and go begging for an intrepreter...they already know they HAVE to provide one!!!
At anytime you feel you are not being treated fair because you are deaf or you are being treated different from others, DO NOT (and I repeat!) DO NOT go to the Union for help!! Head straight to EEOC and file a complain with them. If you do not know about EEOC, that in itself is a violation because not only the USPS but all employees have to innform their employees of the employee's rights under EEOC.
When I retired, my EEOC file was over a foot thick and my name brought fear to management because EEOC sued them so many times. Sure, sometimes the supervisor was right about the employee's work or problem but the supervisor is never ever right in refusing to provide an intrepreter nor union rep. KNOW YOU RIGHTS.....AND USE THEM!!
 
Please be careful in advising what fulfills ADA requirements and what doesn't. You have given some very mistaken advise here.
 
jillio said:
Please be careful in advising what fulfills ADA requirements and what doesn't. You have given some very mistaken advise here.
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I don't think rolling7 was specifically addressing ADA requirements but USPS and union requirements. Government agencies have standards that are above and beyond ADA requirements. I've interpreted in federal government settings, and it's true about the union reps, witnesses, and provision of terps. Management usually goes out of their way to make sure all requirements are met.
 
rolling7 said:
As a retired (38 years of service) from the USPS, I do know about all the rules and regulations, the different craft contracts and even was a 204B (supervisior) for two years. So with my experience, these are the things you need to do. All communication for work preformance is general speech. This means if she says "I wnat you do do this or that" you have to do as instructed. You can ask for more instructions if you feel the need. The written parts are HERS if she is using her paper. You should never ever carry around your own paper to write on....always use their paper to reply.
Having said that, if you move on to any and all discussions that are NOT general work preformance....late returning from break, sleeping on the job, unauthorized absent from the work floor, etc. then you always ask for an intrepreter and a union rep. And I mean ALWAYS ASK FOR BOTH!!!!
If you are refused both then keep your mouth shut and DO NOT WRITE ANYTHING. You must read what she writes but you do not have to respond to what she writes IF..IF..IF she refuses your request for an intrepreter and a union rep. Safety meetings, job instruction in-plant meeting and any other meeting betwedn employees and management require an intrepreter and you DO NOT HAVE TO ASK FOR ONE, if you are well know as a deaf person who requires accomodation.....do not do their job for them and go begging for an intrepreter...they already know they HAVE to provide one!!!
At anytime you feel you are not being treated fair because you are deaf or you are being treated different from others, DO NOT (and I repeat!) DO NOT go to the Union for help!! Head straight to EEOC and file a complain with them. If you do not know about EEOC, that in itself is a violation because not only the USPS but all employees have to innform their employees of the employee's rights under EEOC.
When I retired, my EEOC file was over a foot thick and my name brought fear to management because EEOC sued them so many times. Sure, sometimes the supervisor was right about the employee's work or problem but the supervisor is never ever right in refusing to provide an intrepreter nor union rep. KNOW YOU RIGHTS.....AND USE THEM!!
Click to expand...


Seriously - talk about making it as difficult as possible to get things done.

Acting like a child isn't going to a) fix the problems or b) make it look like hiring Hoh/Deaf people is really "no big deal".

For everyday conversations - provided the Hoh/Deaf person is literate, notes work FINE. You do NOT need to hire an interpreter for every little thing that needs to be said - that's RIDICULOUS (and I'm Hoh/Deaf !!)

Fighting about "whose paper" it is - is not only childish, it's out right stupid to put it bluntly.

If the OP is for some reason concerned about the other person keeping his notes (and honestly - I realllly really don't understand why it's a problem, I don't) then using a "mini white board" such as I mentioned early is the all around perfect answer because it's then "his property" and thus the other person can't "take it".

Sometimes - I think that many of the problems we face as Hoh/Deaf people in terms of discrimination, assumptions etc are the fault of some of US making a mountain out of a mole hill, expecting accommodation that is "overkill" and being unwilling to think out of the box long enough to find an EASY solution for EVERYONE.



When I was working for a large company in a huge building ... here are some of the things I did to make everyone's life easier (and PROVE that "hiring a Hoh/Deaf person was "no big deal").

Problem: Using Phones​

Issue 1
I'm able to use the phone, sometimes, if it's amplified.
There were times that I WANTED to be able to use the phones.

The Fix
I bought my OWN in line amplifier. I did this intentionally so that it was my property, that way people couldn't take it/move it/use it etc and I could take it with me when I left etc. In return for me buying the amplifier, my employer agreed to cover all the batteries (needed to run the unit).


Issue 2

Sometimes I simply can't understand what's being said on the phone - even amplified, even with my HA cranked. So I needed additional way to communicate with people.

The Fix

Part 1
I brought my UltraTec compact TTY into work with me daily (I just tossed it into the bag I took to work) so that on days where using the phone was "out" I could use the TTY.

Part 2
I was assigned a personal (non-dept) email so that I would be able to email whomever I needed (much easier than rely for many things)

Part 3
I was given permission to set up an internal IM system with various depts - so that instead of using the phone I could send an IM that would pop up on their screen

Part 4
I had a co-worker who would handle phone calls when I simply couldn't understand someone I was talking with (and/or clarify mis-understood words/phrases - which he could hear across the room, due to the amplifier on the phone lol!)


The Paging system/ PA​

Issue
I often wasn't able to hear the PA/Paging system page which would announce if there was a phone line I was needed on, if there was someone looking for me/ needing me somewhere etc.

The Fix

I carried my cell phone with me (on vibrate) and if I didn't pick up the phone line, etc within 30secs the receptionist would simply text me "Line 3 @ 3:33pm" or "Needed at the front Desk" etc. which she'd either text from her cell, or from my wireless carriers website that has a "send a text" function.



General Communications​

At all times, I made sure to keep a pen/pencil with me and some post-it notes ... that way if there was a "communication hiccup" I/they could just jot a note down on the piece of paper! If it was something that I needed/they needed to remember - the person could easily take the post-it note with them so they didn't forget.




Honestly - it's NOT that hard to make it EASY to be a Hoh/Deaf person working in a hearing place ... we have the ability to make it very easy or very frustrating depending on how WE act.

Acting like a stubborn child will get you treated like a stubborn child. Acting like a smart innovative (communication wise etc) person will get you treated with respect.
 
While I totally agree with Anij's solution for Anij only, there is still legal requirements that the USPS choose to ignore. Like Reba said, the USPS is a Federal agent and ADA is tricky here. In my 38 years of service I went out of my way to offer solutions and had them thrown back in my face each time with "That is an expense we don't want to cover" as each office has a budget and that office does not want the deaf to have a say in how the money is spent. I wont do it here but I could tell you stories about tty, vp, class in ASL for supervisiors, etc. that went nowhere. So my point is that to be legally covered a deaf person should first make it known that whichever company is expected to follow ADA and the Civil Rights Act of 1964 but if they resist then contact EEOC with proof that they resist.
 
For jillio ...I went back and read post #48 and not once did "ADA" appear.
So don't tell me I have given "some very mistaken advise here."
 
Reba said:
I don't think rolling7 was specifically addressing ADA requirements but USPS and union requirements. Government agencies have standards that are above and beyond ADA requirements. I've interpreted in federal government settings, and it's true about the union reps, witnesses, and provision of terps. Management usually goes out of their way to make sure all requirements are met.
Click to expand...

Oh, I wasn't disagreeing with any of that. Just that a union rep and a terp will not be hanging around just waiting for day to day communication to occur between supervisor and worker. The problem seemed to be that the OP did not like the fact that day to day communication was being accommodated through writing. But, that fulfills the ADA requirements.
 
rolling7 said:
For jillio ...I went back and read post #48 and not once did "ADA" appear.
So don't tell me I have given "some very mistaken advise here."
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You have advised some things be done which most likely will not ever come into being. The fact is that when a complaint is made about an accommodation, the employer will use the ADA criteria as a foundation of judging compliance. They are not obligated to make any accommodation what so ever except that which is mandated.

In a legal determination, ADA criteria will also serve as the foundation for whether a particular way of accommodation is discriminatory or not.
 
Anij said:
Seriously - talk about making it as difficult as possible to get things done.

Acting like a child isn't going to a) fix the problems or b) make it look like hiring Hoh/Deaf people is really "no big deal".

For everyday conversations - provided the Hoh/Deaf person is literate, notes work FINE. You do NOT need to hire an interpreter for every little thing that needs to be said - that's RIDICULOUS (and I'm Hoh/Deaf !!)

Fighting about "whose paper" it is - is not only childish, it's out right stupid to put it bluntly.

If the OP is for some reason concerned about the other person keeping his notes (and honestly - I realllly really don't understand why it's a problem, I don't) then using a "mini white board" such as I mentioned early is the all around perfect answer because it's then "his property" and thus the other person can't "take it".

Sometimes - I think that many of the problems we face as Hoh/Deaf people in terms of discrimination, assumptions etc are the fault of some of US making a mountain out of a mole hill, expecting accommodation that is "overkill" and being unwilling to think out of the box long enough to find an EASY solution for EVERYONE.



When I was working for a large company in a huge building ... here are some of the things I did to make everyone's life easier (and PROVE that "hiring a Hoh/Deaf person was "no big deal").

Problem: Using Phones​

Issue 1
I'm able to use the phone, sometimes, if it's amplified.
There were times that I WANTED to be able to use the phones.

The Fix
I bought my OWN in line amplifier. I did this intentionally so that it was my property, that way people couldn't take it/move it/use it etc and I could take it with me when I left etc. In return for me buying the amplifier, my employer agreed to cover all the batteries (needed to run the unit).


Issue 2

Sometimes I simply can't understand what's being said on the phone - even amplified, even with my HA cranked. So I needed additional way to communicate with people.

The Fix

Part 1
I brought my UltraTec compact TTY into work with me daily (I just tossed it into the bag I took to work) so that on days where using the phone was "out" I could use the TTY.

Part 2
I was assigned a personal (non-dept) email so that I would be able to email whomever I needed (much easier than rely for many things)

Part 3
I was given permission to set up an internal IM system with various depts - so that instead of using the phone I could send an IM that would pop up on their screen

Part 4
I had a co-worker who would handle phone calls when I simply couldn't understand someone I was talking with (and/or clarify mis-understood words/phrases - which he could hear across the room, due to the amplifier on the phone lol!)


The Paging system/ PA​

Issue
I often wasn't able to hear the PA/Paging system page which would announce if there was a phone line I was needed on, if there was someone looking for me/ needing me somewhere etc.

The Fix

I carried my cell phone with me (on vibrate) and if I didn't pick up the phone line, etc within 30secs the receptionist would simply text me "Line 3 @ 3:33pm" or "Needed at the front Desk" etc. which she'd either text from her cell, or from my wireless carriers website that has a "send a text" function.



General Communications​

At all times, I made sure to keep a pen/pencil with me and some post-it notes ... that way if there was a "communication hiccup" I/they could just jot a note down on the piece of paper! If it was something that I needed/they needed to remember - the person could easily take the post-it note with them so they didn't forget.




Honestly - it's NOT that hard to make it EASY to be a Hoh/Deaf person working in a hearing place ... we have the ability to make it very easy or very frustrating depending on how WE act.

Acting like a stubborn child will get you treated like a stubborn child. Acting like a smart innovative (communication wise etc) person will get you treated with respect.
Click to expand...


As always, great post.
 
I agree with rolling7 all the way because it makes alot of sense.

I am sorry for not giving more details earlier. I was not talking about daily communications at work. My supervisor wrote to me about a serious issue between me and one of my co-workers and I answered her question by writing and then she kept that note as an evidence. I realized that it's my mistake and I should refuse to talk to her in the first place until an interpreter and union rep are present. The federal law requires an employer to provide an interpreter for deaf employees at official discussions/meetings. The Postal Service must accept a request for an union steward. That's a fact.

Rolling7 is 100% right about deaf workers not having to use their notepad, whiteboard, pen, etc to communicate with supervisors at work. The employer has to provide those things. That's a fact.

Rolling7, I know about EEO but I heard that they don't usually do a good job.

Ok, everyone, many thanks for trying to help. I really appreciate it. Now I know that we don't have a law to protect that right. I learned my lesson so next time I will be a smartass.
 
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